Arguing... again (at least with someone different this time)
Hrrgggghh. I spent entirely too long today arguing with a senior coworker who insisted that gays are unnatural, perverted and sinful and that he doesn’t want them anywhere near him (though he did concede that what they did in the privacy of their own homes was their business)--but refused to admit that he’s homophobic
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Now, back when I was 16-18 I shared the Chief's predjudices and I was uber-right. I supported Alan Keyes in 96 to show how bad I was (yet I supported Perot in 92 when I was 15 which may have been scarier). Now, my social conservatism was due to a few things, much of it from being Catholic and to a smaller extent my mother (my father is basically pro-choice, my mother isn't), though she was apolitical, but liked Marx on an ideal level, mainly due to Jesuit education.
College was a huge shift in my views. My first two years were in Memphis's CBU, where I fell in with a very traditional crowd and there was a progressive nun there who was in charge of Campus Ministry who wante dto block anything that had pre-Vatican II roots....her efforts were thwarted when the Administration realized how much money they were alientaing alumni and alumni donations by blocking traditional Catholicism, as well as when a liberal Presbyterian College said they need to be more Catholic.
During this time I began to reconsider my views on gay marriage as far as legality while still sharing my religious views about it (I also strongly supported gay adoption due to my then-views on abortion though). I transferred to Loyola at 21 and this was cause for a major shift as I was influenced by libertarian theories in the form of Economics. In fact this dude is a Professor at my alma mater right now, but not when I was there unfortuantely. During College I also began to find the word social justice dubious and my faith's foundations may have stattered to crack there as my mother was not too fond of my capitalist views being as she regarded Christianity as essentially Marxist.
After I graduated form Loyola I joined the Army which had the biggest effects on my religious and political development. Since 1991 I favored finsihing the job of Gulf War I and taking care of Sadaam. I became even more hawkish in 02 and at the same time, I became an even bigger advocate of same sex marriage and even began to oppose the Church's position which is still far better than that of the Fundamentalist Churches. A big factor was a gentleman named Andrew Sullivan and his essay about socially conservative arguments favoring gay marriage. It is funny how hawkishness and acceptance became so connected, or maybe it is because our enemy was a vicious third world homophobe far scarier than Robertosn, Falwell, or even Fred Phelps. Even then, my religious views were shaken, but intact. I did develop a real hatred for Bishop Gumbleton who wanted to pressure Catholic soldiers to refuse to deploy to certain conflicts.
My faith has retreated further as I began to fully relaize how much my motehr was right about Christianity and Marxism (I still think killing a Marxist should only be a misdemeanor). My views on abortion shifted too, and my support of gay marriage was now based on capitalism, as I support the right of two legal adults to engage in a private contract. That is what marriage is after all.
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?? Never heard of this fellow; don't suppose you have a good link to that essay? Because most conservatives I know are against gay marriage almost as much as they're against abortion.
(I'll never actually do this, but I've always wanted to go to an anti-abortion protest, and slap the following bumper sticker on each one's car: "May the fetus you save grow up to be gay.")
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He's a gay conservative, but in the true sense of the word...more of what could also be called right-wing liberal. He's pro-choice until the first trimester, though I don't think he's out for affecting the law.
You're issue with conservatives stems from the solidarity syndrome where people cannot form independent thoughts.....John Paul II strongly opposed both abortion and capital punishment and to some people (right- and left- wing) the combo would make their heads explode.
Hmmm..now for pro-chocie conservatives:
Barry Goldwater
Margaret Thatcher
Ronald Reagan (before he ran for President)
Sandra Day O'Connor (though some may call her a moderate)
Kay Bailey Hutchison
Larry Elder (though more a Libertarian)
Gerald Ford
Jennifer Dunn
The gay marriage issue is one that will take time. I am conservative in that I afvor gay marraige, but realize a 20 year strategy will be needed, and like Andrew I want it enacted legislatively and not judicially.
Also, another thing that affected my view on abortion is history. It was only inthe 20th century that life was viewed as beginning at conception and in the Middle Ages infanticide was common, and I believe choice extends to about the child's fifth birthday, but that is a whole different can of worms. Of course abortion laws in America were fluid as abortion was legal in almsot all states back in the 18th cnetury and woudl later be outlawed duing the 19th cnetury, while states were legalizing it again in the 1960s and onward until 1973 (of course the death of LBJ, a truly evil souless man who I wish was aborted, overshadowed teh very court case).
I guess my philosophy is more easily described as classically liberal, right-wing liberal, neo-liberal, or libertarian, but I have a conservative demeanor through my fondness for bowties, sense fo duty, pratcice of chivalry, and a belief that children should be taught the classics.
(I'll never actually do this, but I've always wanted to go to an anti-abortion protest, and slap the following bumper sticker on each one's car: "May the fetus you save grow up to be gay.")
Gutsy, but I oppose it on the grounds of property rights, which is why I'm pro-choice among other reasons (crime reduction and hearing scremaing children at shopping malls, PXs, and restaurants).
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