(no subject)
I received a fine for running a red light. Got caught by a camera .15 seconds into the light.
Normally, I wouldn't really care, and just pay the fine, but I remember this one. The yellow light lasted 3.5 seconds according to the picture taken. It seemed shorter, but that is beside the point. I do have a problem with the length of the green light, though. As the night goes on, the green light intervals grow shorter and shorter. I saw this light change to green from earlier down the road, and saw a person sitting in the left turn lane waiting for that little green arrow to give him the "ok" to progress. However, when I was approximately 3.65 seconds away from the intersection, the light changed to yellow. There was no anticipated green arrow, which would have usually prolonged the other green lights at the intersection. I was going approximately 35 mph at the time, and on seeing the yellow light decided to attempt to slow down.
Something I learned in my research after receiving the fine is that yellow lights are timed to where you can stop "safely". "Safely" here means that you are applying approximately 1G in horizontal force to your car, your person, and your passengers. In my mind, this is a poor definition of "safe". My research has shown me that a much safer "safe" is defined as about .45Gs, less than half the city and possibly state definition. According to that guideline, going 30 miles per hour, one would need about 2.3 seconds to safely stop. As I mentioned before, the yellow light lasted 3.5 seconds, and so naturally one would not consider this to be a problem. However, that 2.3 seconds only measures time from the beginning of the braking procedure to the full stop, and doesn't take into consideration the time it takes to process the changing of the yellow light, judging the distance and time you have, and making the decision to stop, which could add a second to total stopping time (at minimum), or even double stopping time (what I consider maximum). Using the minimum 1 second addition, I would have barely enough time to stop, but if you also factor in the changing green-light durations, and the time it takes to recover from that unexpected change, that second increases to approximately 2.
The camera caught me going 31 miles per hour through the intersection because I tried to slow down. Had I sped through, I would have beaten that .15 seconds and been legally inside the intersection when the light changed, keeping me safe from this small civil citation. Going 35 mph (the speed limit) down that road, at that time, with the duration of the yellow light being 3.5 seconds, means that yes, physically, you could safely stop according to both "safe" and safe standards, if you began braking the very instant the light turned yellow. However, given the variations in green-light duration throughout the day, even if you saw the light turn green from further down the road you have no idea whether or not you will be caught in the same yellow light situation I was.
I went ahead and payed the fine, since my explanation involves a subjective idea of safety, and without challenging the current official idea of "safe" I would never be taken seriously in court. However, the psychology, biology, and physics here all play into the equation, but officially the former two are irrelevant to the city's idea of safe stopping.
The exclusion of the human element from an equation that concerns human safety concerns me. Granted, the human element is random and chaotic, and cannot be reduced to finite numbers, but averages DO exist, and dammit, the whole idea behind red-light cameras and determining yellow-light lengths is human safety. I'll not even touch on the idea that applying one G of force to a cars parts horizontally, combined with the already applied 1G of vertical (downward) force, can do some interesting things to your vehicle.
I also don't like the fact that some third party video recording company is making a profit off of the my decision that I could not stop safely. I'm sure most of that will go to the city, and that's fine, but any cut going outside the city on a regular basis irritates me. Maybe I can't stand the idea that someone is betting on people being bad drivers and winning. Maybe my problem lies solely in my own money going to them. Maybe I'm just a bit pissed about the whole thing, and losing what amounts to about a days pay over making what was, in my mind, a safe decision.
Well, anyways, just a heads up, you may be expected to put what feels like an unnecessary amount of strain on your vehicle, passengers, and person should you be caught in the same situation. Maybe someone else can afford to officially bitch and moan about it, but I can't.
Normally, I wouldn't really care, and just pay the fine, but I remember this one. The yellow light lasted 3.5 seconds according to the picture taken. It seemed shorter, but that is beside the point. I do have a problem with the length of the green light, though. As the night goes on, the green light intervals grow shorter and shorter. I saw this light change to green from earlier down the road, and saw a person sitting in the left turn lane waiting for that little green arrow to give him the "ok" to progress. However, when I was approximately 3.65 seconds away from the intersection, the light changed to yellow. There was no anticipated green arrow, which would have usually prolonged the other green lights at the intersection. I was going approximately 35 mph at the time, and on seeing the yellow light decided to attempt to slow down.
Something I learned in my research after receiving the fine is that yellow lights are timed to where you can stop "safely". "Safely" here means that you are applying approximately 1G in horizontal force to your car, your person, and your passengers. In my mind, this is a poor definition of "safe". My research has shown me that a much safer "safe" is defined as about .45Gs, less than half the city and possibly state definition. According to that guideline, going 30 miles per hour, one would need about 2.3 seconds to safely stop. As I mentioned before, the yellow light lasted 3.5 seconds, and so naturally one would not consider this to be a problem. However, that 2.3 seconds only measures time from the beginning of the braking procedure to the full stop, and doesn't take into consideration the time it takes to process the changing of the yellow light, judging the distance and time you have, and making the decision to stop, which could add a second to total stopping time (at minimum), or even double stopping time (what I consider maximum). Using the minimum 1 second addition, I would have barely enough time to stop, but if you also factor in the changing green-light durations, and the time it takes to recover from that unexpected change, that second increases to approximately 2.
The camera caught me going 31 miles per hour through the intersection because I tried to slow down. Had I sped through, I would have beaten that .15 seconds and been legally inside the intersection when the light changed, keeping me safe from this small civil citation. Going 35 mph (the speed limit) down that road, at that time, with the duration of the yellow light being 3.5 seconds, means that yes, physically, you could safely stop according to both "safe" and safe standards, if you began braking the very instant the light turned yellow. However, given the variations in green-light duration throughout the day, even if you saw the light turn green from further down the road you have no idea whether or not you will be caught in the same yellow light situation I was.
I went ahead and payed the fine, since my explanation involves a subjective idea of safety, and without challenging the current official idea of "safe" I would never be taken seriously in court. However, the psychology, biology, and physics here all play into the equation, but officially the former two are irrelevant to the city's idea of safe stopping.
The exclusion of the human element from an equation that concerns human safety concerns me. Granted, the human element is random and chaotic, and cannot be reduced to finite numbers, but averages DO exist, and dammit, the whole idea behind red-light cameras and determining yellow-light lengths is human safety. I'll not even touch on the idea that applying one G of force to a cars parts horizontally, combined with the already applied 1G of vertical (downward) force, can do some interesting things to your vehicle.
I also don't like the fact that some third party video recording company is making a profit off of the my decision that I could not stop safely. I'm sure most of that will go to the city, and that's fine, but any cut going outside the city on a regular basis irritates me. Maybe I can't stand the idea that someone is betting on people being bad drivers and winning. Maybe my problem lies solely in my own money going to them. Maybe I'm just a bit pissed about the whole thing, and losing what amounts to about a days pay over making what was, in my mind, a safe decision.
Well, anyways, just a heads up, you may be expected to put what feels like an unnecessary amount of strain on your vehicle, passengers, and person should you be caught in the same situation. Maybe someone else can afford to officially bitch and moan about it, but I can't.