plz to rec me movies with girls in them

[kattahj]

So, new Star Trek trailer. One one hand, it does look pretty cool. OTOH, talk about gender FAIL.

Which reminds me - as you know, I'm trying to watch 100 movies in a year, meaning roughly 8 movies a month (or more, since I'm behind). I try to have a good mix of simpler fare and critically acclaimed stuff. And while watching The Shawshank Redemption

Comments

[tarchannon]

As far as the Star Trek trailer, you have to start with the fact that the traditional crew is 1 in 7 female. That wasn't going to change. And yes, the bra shot is a touch pandering, but I'm told there is gender equivalence in the film (Kirk, as always, has trouble keeping a short alive). Additionally, and completely unlike the TOS, Uhura supposedly kicks ass in this movie. She not only physically can hold her own with the boys, but she's the best of the best. I mean, this is JJ Abrams! I have *no* doubts that JJ takes care of his ladies. I don't thnk it's quite fair to call this trailer out on gender issues even when viewed on it's own: 90 seconds to convice someone to see a film isn't exactly enough time to be concerned with parity for second tier characters (especially when a first tier character like McCoy barely appears).

[kattahj]

And yes, the bra shot is a touch pandering, but I'm told there is gender equivalence in the film (Kirk, as always, has trouble keeping a short alive). Additionally, and completely unlike the TOS, Uhura supposedly kicks ass in this movie.

I wasn't judging the movie, just the trailer, and I think it's significant that neither of these two things were shown in the film while the four shots I noticed with women in them were 1: breasts, 2: sex, 3: screaming and 4: random background. That's not a question of how many male vs. female characters are in the movie. In fact, I'd have had less reason to cry gender fail without those clips.

I mean, this is JJ Abrams! I have *no* doubts that JJ takes care of his ladies.I haven't seen Alias, but Lost is quite frequently full of gender fail too (albeit less so with time, and certainly less than other shows), so JJ's name alone isn't enough to reassure me

[tarchannon]

Can I ask: how can there be shots of women without breasts? Humans have sex (though I didn't see any sex in the trailer, most sex is heterosexual and hence around 50% female participatory). People scream in action movies - period. And there were both men and women in the background. None of these things are legitimate points

[kattahj]

Can I ask: how can there be shots of women without breasts?

Now you're just being deliberately obtuse. There's a difference between showing a woman who happens to have breasts and focusing on a woman's breasts, as was done with the bra shots.

And yes, heterosexual sex is only 50% female, and yes, there will be screaming in action movies, and yes, there were men in the background, but when men get to do all sorts of things in the trailer and women get to do ONLY these things, I see it as a problem.

The purpose of a movie trailer is to get butts in the seats, and hence, provides an abbriviated, enticing, appealing idea of the film.

Exactly. And what is enticing and appealing to some is off-putting to me.

Star Trek has a VAST female following, and if you're going after a movie/universe/series, the Star Trek one is likely the most feamle supportive, egalitarian one out there. I think youre WAY off base here.
Just a moment ago, you were excusing it with how TOS is 7/1 male. TNG wasn't very cheerful from a gender perspective either,

[tarchannon]

Not not being obtuse, I just have a viewpoint that is realistic, and has some intellectual and artisic perspective on the subject. Evalating a trailer (and movie by extension) by two fraction of a second clips out of context is stupid. In fact, neither show women in a negative light - that's YOUR overinterpretation. And there is no indication - and every contra-indication - that women won't be treated with parity and placed in a good light. Uhura is supposed to be a great beauty - and the second most intelligent person (the most intelligent human) on the bridge, the third or fourth in command, and a strong woman that hold her own with her compadres - some of the greatest people of her age. So she shouldn't have breasts? So a filmmaker should avoid using all the tools at his disposal to create an appealing an strong HUMAN narrative? Your asking for utterly unrealistic things here. I could go on about how that, anthropologically, humans use archeotypes (in fact, are programmed with many), and that is normal and natural, but hey, you've

[kattahj]

You know, this may come as a suprise to you, but there are other genres than action, other mediums than film and television, and other countries than the USA. I have seen stuff that's better than this. I believe that it's possible to make even American action movies better than this. And if this is truly the best they can offer, then I for one am more than happy to leave the whole genre behind

[tarchannon]

You know Katta, after reading (and being irritated by) any number of rather extremist-bordering-on-male-bashing posts in your blog, I thought I'd do you a favor and let you know that you're off-base and on poor ground. Knowing that you are a generally reasonable and intelligent person (unlike morthel, who is just foolish and nasty) that is actually interested in forward women's issues. You're not going to do so the way you're going. (Note the lack of male participants on your blog). You do yourself no favors by using terms like 'gender fail' - fringe terminology with no concrete defintion (I checked) and poopr penetrance into not only mainstream sociology or psychology, but even into gender studies. It's a useless term; if you mean to say gender equity or gender representation, then just say so. Using crap terminology makes your commentary GIGO. Showing a great lack of perspective by failing to consider the function and role of an art piece (in this case, a movie trailer) does your position no favors. In the same vein, the fact that

[morthel]

Assuming you aren't just very, very stupid, I'll have to assume that you intentionally ignore the gender fail of this trailer. Let's just face it - from a gender perspective it truly sucks, as someone else has pointed out in detail already, and the fact that you're defending only makes it seem like you feel threatened by the implication that gender fail exists everywhere, even in Star Trek. I'd suggest you go read something about gender studies before attempting to hold an argument in any topic related to this, alternatively go be a dimwit somewhere else.

[tarchannon]

To be perfectly blunt, there is a reason that of the 20 or so responses to the trailer on a open public form - say EW - that every single one of the responses were positive? That judging a movie (or even the gender representation/gender quality of a film by a 90 second trailer? When the bits you don't like are taken out of context and account for less than 2 seconds of time? When your ritique fails but factully and practically? When the series (and the character you are criticizing) is the very one where not only was a woman of color put in a leadership poistion (one that Martin Lurthor King himself convinced the actress to stay on), but was one of the very first place where one could observe a woman in an authroity position in a military setting? Yes, I can say you're either stupid or obtuse. And, to be even more frank, I know more about women's studies that you ever will and have done more for women's rights that you every are likely to - squared. Such militant positions are not only offensive on an intellectual, actistic, practical

[morthel]

Heh... Defensive much? Anyway, the others judging the trailer have obviously not done so from a gender perspective - and it might well be good from other perspectives. Get over yourself. Nobody's militant here, we're just pointing out flaws that are quite obvious to anyone with half a brain. This movie might have a great plot otherwise, that's not what this critique is about. Anyway, my point stands. Stop being such a total asshole and go to a therapist or something and handle that raging male identity crisis of yours.

[tarchannon]

Uh... anyone that uses such a fringe, ill-defined, and self-contradictory term like 'gender fail' is not only massively ignorant, but has such massive gaps in their education that I cannot possibly afford the time to fix them, even if I were so inclined - which I'm not. This is reinforced by such a startling lack of perspective I'm not sure you'd be capable of understand it, and a debating tookbox that begins and ends with "you're an asshole' and 'raging male identity crisis'. Astonishing.

[tarchannon]

Thank you for replying in a non-hostile, intelligent manner. It's appreciated