Godspeed!

[katphyre]

Just a follow up on my last post. Here is the letter from the bishop I recieved 4 days after my resignation letter, and the letter dated three days after that from Church Membership. They're easier to see if you click on the larger image size (top right). I'm shocked and pleased with their promptness all at the same time. I really appreciate

Comments

Re: Leaving the church

[anonymous]

elyograg - I'm not sure that all religions feel a "driving need to coerce others into believing as they do." However, if any Christian takes Christianity seriously, as well as its instructions in the Bible, there is really no choice but to follow its commandment to tell others. If you don't happen to agree, I can accept that and leave you to your own beliefs. That's entirely between you and God. But I don't agree with your extremist assertion that the mere offer to express a view that one hopes could be helpful to others necessarily constitutes "coersion." I am also quite certain that there are in fact religious people who just can't take "no" for an answer, just as there are non-religious people who can't. Shame on both of them. But if the definition of "coersion" includes (as you are possibly suggesting?) the mere offering of dialogue, then don't your own opinions, as well as mine, also meet that definition? I also don't think the Bible qualifies as "propaganda" as it doesn't promote anything other than belief in God's plan for salvation - it doesn't bestow power or authority to any religious institution, though some may try to misuse it for that purpose. You do seem as sure of your beliefs as I am of mine, though possibly less tolorent. Would you not then consider your sharing of your beliefs to also be "coercive" and your words to be "propaganda?" Just some thoughts, nothing rude intended.
Chuck

Re: Leaving the church

[elyograg]

Your earlier post is full of "Bible" and "God" ... an enormous presupposition that either of us believes in these things in a way that resembles yours at all.

Have you seen Star Trek VI, specifically the dinner scene where they drink Romulan Ale? I feel like the Klingon woman, when she expresses disgust at the very blatant racism and insensitivity shown by the Enterprise crew. They are not actually trying to offend anyone, but they are exposed to something they do not completely understand.

I do not believe in the idea of God as most people understand it. I'm not atheist, just agnostic. To me, it's offensive to be asked to follow God's leadership. Your statement "that's entirely between you and God" says that there's no room in your mind for a belief that doesn't include a deity at all.

I'm completely tolerant of your beliefs, as long as they stay in your life and keep out of mine. My dander is up because you tried to convince my wife not to abandon the Christian world view that dominates your existence. The tools employed in this endeavor include fear and guilt. You may not see these qualities in what you have written, but they are there.

Re: Leaving the church

[katphyre]

Just so we're all on the same page:

From Merriam-Webster online: coerce

Main Entry: co·erce
Pronunciation: \kō-ˈərs\
Function: transitive verb
Inflected Form(s): co·erced; co·erc·ing
Etymology: Middle English cohercen, from Anglo-French *cohercer Latin coercēre, from co- + arcēre to shut up, enclose.
Date: 15th century

1 : to restrain or dominate by force (religion in the past has tried to coerce the irreligious - W. R. Inge) 2 : to compel to an act or choice (was coerced into agreeing) 3 : to achieve by force or threat (coerce compliance)

I don't think my husband was asserting that, "the mere offer to express a view that one hopes could be helpful to others necessarily constitutes "coersion."."

I think he was asserting that the following comment made by you is, in fact, an attempt to use fear as a compelling reason to be compliant with the beliefs of christianity:

"You're right, we'll all know what happens next after we die, but the problem is that what happens next to you may not be to your liking, and it may be too late then to change your direction."

You're asking me to base my spiritual convictions on the idea that I should follow Christianity just in case it turns out you're right and I might not want to burn in hell if I'm wrong! By that logic I should also make sure I'm in good standing with the Buddhists, the Hindus, the Muslims, the Jews, and every other variation of religion. In fact, all of those religions came before Christianity and still outnumber them worldwide. If more people believe it, isn't it more likely to be true? Maybe you ought to join one of those churches, just in case! Oh, but wait, what if it turns out the Mormons really did have the truth? What if it's only the Baptists, or the Anglicans? Maybe you should stop sitting on the non-denominational Christian fence and pick a flavor. Or maybe you have and I just don't know it because I don't know you. In which case all of this advice is uneducated and unsolicited. Kind of like yours.

I realize I have posted my story out in the open, for anyone to read and comment on. And that was why I didn't respond the first time you posted. You have a right to an opinion and if I don't like it, I'll ignore it. But you are wrong when you say that your words were not coercive. Playing on the fear of an unhappy afterlife is a universal method among religions to gain and keep their membership. And it is exactly why I would not even consider the possibility of subscribing to a single brand of religion again.

I can almost appreciate what, I'm sure, you view as an honest concern for my soul, but believe me when I say that it is not a concern that keeps me up at night. I have faith, just as un-shakeable as yours, that at this moment I am square with who or what might place judgement upon me after my death.