About the HP fandom and the ships
Seems that, since adela711 started the conversation, many of you have started talking about it, so I wanted to say my opinion about it.
First off, I must say I can't be very reliable about HP ships. The reason is because in first instance, I see evidence of everything and of nothing in canon. I think the same thing Adela too thinks, that is the HP books are non shipping books. I really don't care with whom the X character will finish in canon, because, a side by some hints of R/Hr, but only one-sided, I can see nothing that really screams "OMG they're a couple".
That said, I shall say I SAW evidences of R/S in the third film, and this made my face assume the expression of a wide, slashy grin for the whole film. But I don't see much of this ship in the true canon, which are the books. The only thing might be the shared present but, as Adela said, I believe, it might have been something Sirius did to be nice with Remus--aka Remus is poor and Sirius decided to buy the present with him because they're *friends* and nothing more. I see much more evidence that Remus and Sirius were very good friends in canon than evidences to a ship. A "ship" for me is something much stronger than a friendship, anyway.
As for anything else, I really don't see evidences of a ship or the other more than the other ship around. Which means I also see hints to all the ships. I don't look at the hints with the one-sided eye of the shipper, because I really don't have a ship I care much about, therefore I think I can be unbiased in this.
adela711 asked to me, in reply to my comment in her LJ, when did I exactly start to look for hints in the book. To this, I can reply I always did and I never did. I don't go looking for hints in the books, simply because the ships aren't my main interest in the books: I just look for the action and the building of the characters. Although, the moment when I started to snigger and think of R/Hr being true was when Ron cuts the arms of his Krum's doll. *There* I saw a hint of a possible relationship, but only one-sided. And I saw a good possible evidence of H/Hr when, in book 5, Hermione says "of course you don't" to Harry's crying over himself and Ron saying Harry maybe doesn't know how to kiss. *THERE* you couldn't help it but thinking "How do you know, Hermione?". Another ship I have seen hints of is Harry/Luna, but because I think Luna was the only person who was near Harry in the end of book 5, and I feel her having good empathy over Harry. Even if, of course, I saw LOTS of hints that Luna is probably liking Ron. But now *that*'s a sad triangle, because it's evident that Ron likes Hermione. I'm still unsure of whom Hermione likes. I feel she's absolutely conscious that Ron likes her, and I feel Hermione isn't the type to give Ron "false hopes", so if she hasn't yet taken him in a corner and told him she doesn't like him at all, I suppose she might like him too, but maybe being shy about it, or wanting to be sure (always because she's responsible). Of course, there are also the things Harry notices, that Ron and Hermione look like Mr and Mrs Weasley arguing.
However, really, I see nothing else and everything else. For example, I do see hints of a Snape/Lily ship, probably one-sided, even if Lily chose James. Rather, I think this might be something that increased Snape's loathe over James. And my evidence here is the fact the memory Harry looks at was Snape's WORSE memory. Why was it that? After all I think Snape was used to public humiliation from James and Sirius, I don't think this was the first time the duo had fun at his expenses. However, I believe that the memory of the werewolf should have been a much worse memory for Snape to handle, much worse than a public humiliation. You know, not only he risked to die, but he also happened to have a life debt with the person he despises the most--James Potter. So, a for bullying and humiliation, I think *that* should have been a much worst memory for Snape. So, why in the hell that was his WORST memory? The only reason I can think of, is that Lily tried to protect him and he insulted her that way. That's what makes this his worst memory in my opinion, and this can be true only if Snape had a thing for Lily. Even Sirius and Remus' talking about how Lily chose James in her seventh year and how James didn't mock Snape IN FRONT OF LILY anymore . . . mhhhhhhhh yes, there my shipping ear rings a bell.
Anyway, always in response to adela711, I shall say I can't be considered a person to look at while thinking at how to determine the ships. In fact, I didn't look at the books with "innocent eyes". I read the books after having read two fanfictions. The two fanfictions were D/G romance.
Yeah, I had come out with a totally different idea of Draco than that I came out reading the books reading those fics, but anyway, I had read something that involved the two characters romantically (and angsty), therefore my shipping ear was "biased" somehow. I didn't find hints to D/G in canon, but I do think their personality are very well together. Above all the personality I made up for Ginny in MoM, but that's all another story, after all.
As for slash, I can see where H/D shippers look when they talk of canon evidences. And PoA was wonderful in this direction (I agree with sistermagpie, Cuaron is so much a perv!). However, I see only tension in canon and nothing more. And I don't think the fact Harry has imprisoned Lucius will destroy the ship. In fact, I feel it as something that can make Draco finally come out the closet and make some decisions. And I believe he will, in the good or in the bad (more in the bad, I believe, because JKR hates him too much). I hope JKR will explore Draco more in the next book, because the poor fellow is worth it. I know that when she will, she will destroy Draco. But I prefer having him as a true baddie than having him as a cretin who is always hexed with no real reason. I really feel that H/D, especially in book 5, is similar to J/SS.
Also, I really don't believe to people who say "Draco has reached the point of no return" just because he said "You're dead, Potter." If *I*'d reached the point of no return each time I wished people I dislike dead . . . I would burn in hell forever. Those are only WORDS. I don't think Draco has done anything so bad to be worth of the role of baddie yet. This is why I believe that when Jo will develop him, she will destroy him. I have the impression she *will* turn him evil without giving him the possibility to choose. You might argue that Draco *has* possibility to choose: nobody is pointing a gun at him forcing him to become a DE. Yeah, that's true. But sometimes, social pression is much a worse gun pointed at your temple than an actual gun. Harry now has done something very bad to Draco: he has not only put Lucius in Azkaban, but has also thrown mud over the Malfoy's name. Two things Draco cares *lots* about. I too have never thought Draco hates his father. I do think Draco FEARS his father. I have the impression Draco adores Lucius and puts him on a pedestral, worshipping him. This is why, in MoM, Draco hates his father now: killing Marion, Lucius has broken the pedestral Draco had put him in, and this very thing made Draco suffer too much to bear it. But in canon (and even in my story before that), Draco *LOVES* Lucius. And he not only loves him, but he worships him, h considers his father something intouchable and never wrong, something to take as a sample. Throwing mud over Lucius, Harry has given Draco a big pain. And not because Draco is unaware his father deserved to go to Azkaban: he knows perfectly well Lucius follows Voldemort, and I think he prefers Lucius in Azkaban than Lucius who betrays Voldemort. However, I believe that the social humiliation this imprisonment gives to Lucius is something Draco has hard time to bear: now in the eyes of everybody, Lucius has done something WRONG. He's a DE, scum. Malfoy's name is disgraced too, in the public opinion. Before that, everybody *thought* Malfoy was a DE, but nobody could say that truly. Malfoys were feared, now they're insulted.
This is something I hope JKR will develop better in the next book, but it's something that lead to a two paths choice for Draco. And I know Jo will choose for him the one side path to evil. This is a shame, indeed, but I won't be surprised, because I know Draco's destiny in canon isn't redeemable, because JKR doesn't think him as redeemable.
Anyway, going back to the ships speech, I finish this rant saying I'm not the best person, really, to talk of this. I'm too much a SWISS shipper for that. I don't care of who will be with whom, I only choose my ships in my fics thinking at *my* plot and what I want to comply with it. And I have fun this way, regardless what JKR will do with her characters in canon.
Sorry for the silly rant with no head and no tail (as we say here in Italy to mean something with no sense)
First off, I must say I can't be very reliable about HP ships. The reason is because in first instance, I see evidence of everything and of nothing in canon. I think the same thing Adela too thinks, that is the HP books are non shipping books. I really don't care with whom the X character will finish in canon, because, a side by some hints of R/Hr, but only one-sided, I can see nothing that really screams "OMG they're a couple".
That said, I shall say I SAW evidences of R/S in the third film, and this made my face assume the expression of a wide, slashy grin for the whole film. But I don't see much of this ship in the true canon, which are the books. The only thing might be the shared present but, as Adela said, I believe, it might have been something Sirius did to be nice with Remus--aka Remus is poor and Sirius decided to buy the present with him because they're *friends* and nothing more. I see much more evidence that Remus and Sirius were very good friends in canon than evidences to a ship. A "ship" for me is something much stronger than a friendship, anyway.
As for anything else, I really don't see evidences of a ship or the other more than the other ship around. Which means I also see hints to all the ships. I don't look at the hints with the one-sided eye of the shipper, because I really don't have a ship I care much about, therefore I think I can be unbiased in this.
adela711 asked to me, in reply to my comment in her LJ, when did I exactly start to look for hints in the book. To this, I can reply I always did and I never did. I don't go looking for hints in the books, simply because the ships aren't my main interest in the books: I just look for the action and the building of the characters. Although, the moment when I started to snigger and think of R/Hr being true was when Ron cuts the arms of his Krum's doll. *There* I saw a hint of a possible relationship, but only one-sided. And I saw a good possible evidence of H/Hr when, in book 5, Hermione says "of course you don't" to Harry's crying over himself and Ron saying Harry maybe doesn't know how to kiss. *THERE* you couldn't help it but thinking "How do you know, Hermione?". Another ship I have seen hints of is Harry/Luna, but because I think Luna was the only person who was near Harry in the end of book 5, and I feel her having good empathy over Harry. Even if, of course, I saw LOTS of hints that Luna is probably liking Ron. But now *that*'s a sad triangle, because it's evident that Ron likes Hermione. I'm still unsure of whom Hermione likes. I feel she's absolutely conscious that Ron likes her, and I feel Hermione isn't the type to give Ron "false hopes", so if she hasn't yet taken him in a corner and told him she doesn't like him at all, I suppose she might like him too, but maybe being shy about it, or wanting to be sure (always because she's responsible). Of course, there are also the things Harry notices, that Ron and Hermione look like Mr and Mrs Weasley arguing.
However, really, I see nothing else and everything else. For example, I do see hints of a Snape/Lily ship, probably one-sided, even if Lily chose James. Rather, I think this might be something that increased Snape's loathe over James. And my evidence here is the fact the memory Harry looks at was Snape's WORSE memory. Why was it that? After all I think Snape was used to public humiliation from James and Sirius, I don't think this was the first time the duo had fun at his expenses. However, I believe that the memory of the werewolf should have been a much worse memory for Snape to handle, much worse than a public humiliation. You know, not only he risked to die, but he also happened to have a life debt with the person he despises the most--James Potter. So, a for bullying and humiliation, I think *that* should have been a much worst memory for Snape. So, why in the hell that was his WORST memory? The only reason I can think of, is that Lily tried to protect him and he insulted her that way. That's what makes this his worst memory in my opinion, and this can be true only if Snape had a thing for Lily. Even Sirius and Remus' talking about how Lily chose James in her seventh year and how James didn't mock Snape IN FRONT OF LILY anymore . . . mhhhhhhhh yes, there my shipping ear rings a bell.
Anyway, always in response to adela711, I shall say I can't be considered a person to look at while thinking at how to determine the ships. In fact, I didn't look at the books with "innocent eyes". I read the books after having read two fanfictions. The two fanfictions were D/G romance.
Yeah, I had come out with a totally different idea of Draco than that I came out reading the books reading those fics, but anyway, I had read something that involved the two characters romantically (and angsty), therefore my shipping ear was "biased" somehow. I didn't find hints to D/G in canon, but I do think their personality are very well together. Above all the personality I made up for Ginny in MoM, but that's all another story, after all.
As for slash, I can see where H/D shippers look when they talk of canon evidences. And PoA was wonderful in this direction (I agree with sistermagpie, Cuaron is so much a perv!). However, I see only tension in canon and nothing more. And I don't think the fact Harry has imprisoned Lucius will destroy the ship. In fact, I feel it as something that can make Draco finally come out the closet and make some decisions. And I believe he will, in the good or in the bad (more in the bad, I believe, because JKR hates him too much). I hope JKR will explore Draco more in the next book, because the poor fellow is worth it. I know that when she will, she will destroy Draco. But I prefer having him as a true baddie than having him as a cretin who is always hexed with no real reason. I really feel that H/D, especially in book 5, is similar to J/SS.
Also, I really don't believe to people who say "Draco has reached the point of no return" just because he said "You're dead, Potter." If *I*'d reached the point of no return each time I wished people I dislike dead . . . I would burn in hell forever. Those are only WORDS. I don't think Draco has done anything so bad to be worth of the role of baddie yet. This is why I believe that when Jo will develop him, she will destroy him. I have the impression she *will* turn him evil without giving him the possibility to choose. You might argue that Draco *has* possibility to choose: nobody is pointing a gun at him forcing him to become a DE. Yeah, that's true. But sometimes, social pression is much a worse gun pointed at your temple than an actual gun. Harry now has done something very bad to Draco: he has not only put Lucius in Azkaban, but has also thrown mud over the Malfoy's name. Two things Draco cares *lots* about. I too have never thought Draco hates his father. I do think Draco FEARS his father. I have the impression Draco adores Lucius and puts him on a pedestral, worshipping him. This is why, in MoM, Draco hates his father now: killing Marion, Lucius has broken the pedestral Draco had put him in, and this very thing made Draco suffer too much to bear it. But in canon (and even in my story before that), Draco *LOVES* Lucius. And he not only loves him, but he worships him, h considers his father something intouchable and never wrong, something to take as a sample. Throwing mud over Lucius, Harry has given Draco a big pain. And not because Draco is unaware his father deserved to go to Azkaban: he knows perfectly well Lucius follows Voldemort, and I think he prefers Lucius in Azkaban than Lucius who betrays Voldemort. However, I believe that the social humiliation this imprisonment gives to Lucius is something Draco has hard time to bear: now in the eyes of everybody, Lucius has done something WRONG. He's a DE, scum. Malfoy's name is disgraced too, in the public opinion. Before that, everybody *thought* Malfoy was a DE, but nobody could say that truly. Malfoys were feared, now they're insulted.
This is something I hope JKR will develop better in the next book, but it's something that lead to a two paths choice for Draco. And I know Jo will choose for him the one side path to evil. This is a shame, indeed, but I won't be surprised, because I know Draco's destiny in canon isn't redeemable, because JKR doesn't think him as redeemable.
Anyway, going back to the ships speech, I finish this rant saying I'm not the best person, really, to talk of this. I'm too much a SWISS shipper for that. I don't care of who will be with whom, I only choose my ships in my fics thinking at *my* plot and what I want to comply with it. And I have fun this way, regardless what JKR will do with her characters in canon.
Sorry for the silly rant with no head and no tail (as we say here in Italy to mean something with no sense)