And, yeah, it WOULD be nice in some of these games to not have to constantly doubt my "employer." That seems to be the big "gotcha" that happens in certain game franchises. Surprise! YOU ARE THE BAD GUY. Or, you're working for the wrong side (and so it is scripted that you'll be changing sides midway through, and shooting those folks who used to be your allies, because ALL MODELS MUST BE TARGETS). Bioshock is particularly bad about this, all through the franchise (even when it was "System Shock" instead of "Bioshock").
I figure it's this way in Fallout because if there's to be any sort of choice between factions, you need to at least set things up so that the player feels like there's a CHOICE to be made. Not just "Good Guy Faction" vs. "Bad Guy Faction #1" vs. "Bad Guy Faction #2." Although I wasn't totally happy with my limited choices in New Vegas, at least I felt like it made me think for a bit about what the right choice genuinely was. I wouldn't for a moment have considered Caesar's Legion, but at least they fleshed them out enough so that an NPC speaking in their defense had something to say other than "We do because we CAN, so NYAH." But NCR and Mr. House each have things going for and against them. Neither side lives up to its stated ideals ... but in NCR's case, I could at least forgive them because it was a NATION, and in any given nation, you might have good people genuinely trying to live up to those ideals, and exploitative jerks who will give lip service to those same ideals but really be there just about the power. It doesn't mean the ideals themselves aren't worth pursuing.
In Mr. House's case ... he's an individual, not a nation. I can forgive him for transgressions of the past, but it's the matter of what he wants to do RIGHT NOW and IN THE FUTURE that I have a problem with. (Of course, it sort of helps that I can look up the ending I would have gotten, had I stayed with him and betrayed all my other allies, and see that things weren't going to turn out like he'd promised, because his priorities weren't quite as stated, and were kind of evident from what actions he'd taken already in the pursuit of power.)
As for the Brotherhood of Steel ... well, they were one of the minor factions in the game, but important to the path I chose through both of my main play-throughs. (I played once on Xbox ... then later on PC with all of the DLC, in "Hardcore" mode.) I appreciated that if I went through their side-quests, and didn't take the obvious route when someone at NCR declared them a threat (not baseless -- the two factions had fought in recent history), I could negotiate peace. I lost a lot of rep with NCR (it was clear they'd rather not have any potential "competitors" in the region) but it was kind of cool that the Brotherhood sent in a bunch of paladins to help out the NCR in the final battle against Caesar's Legion, despite their differences.
Anyway, I'm curious what might happen in the future. I hope that the Fallout franchise is popular enough to see a #5 down the line. I also hope that they might bring back some of the better elements of Fallout: New Vegas.
I also hope that not every single non-robot non-dog companion/friend I make is going to hit on me when I reach maximum "affinity" in his or her quest line. (That ever-present blood-red "Romance" option at the top of the dialogue wheel is kind of unnerving. Like, the first several times I say, "Let's be friends" isn't enough? Seriously? Fallout: New Vegas still let you choose whichever "lifestyle" you pleased, but the romantic options didn't come across as pushy.)
It could be worse, you could have the blood-red "Romance" option light up when you talk to your dog or household robot. :)
I liked the Brotherhood of Steel, when they were being good guys, not so much when they're being the heavies, Again with the wanting to be able to negotiate agreements between rival factions!
It could be worse, you could have the blood-red "Romance" option light up when you talk to your dog or household robot. :)
Yes, that did occur to me. (*shudder*) Nice of them to not make it completely standard across the board!
I liked the Brotherhood of Steel, when they were being good guys, not so much when they're being the heavies, Again with the wanting to be able to negotiate agreements between rival factions!
I totally agree there. I see the Brotherhood of Steel as flawed but not beyond hope. (I almost would have gone with the Railroad path ... but only if it were a case of "Brotherhood strikes first -- do you defend Railroad or help BOS?" Not "Railroad offers you a chance to go blow up the Brotherhood, because ... ideological differences.")
If Bethesda is going to give me the repeated option to ROMANCE absolutely everybody who travels with me (except buzzsaw-armed robots and friendly dogs, thank goodness), they could at least be nice enough to give me diplomatic options to make friends with all the non-nasty factions and make them play nice with each other (even if there's some grumbling, and I have to be Charisma-focused, and it costs me some kind of favor points or I have to spend a bunch of my wealth to buy gifts for everybody, or whatever). I mean, it's POSSIBLE to end up there simply by avoiding certain "event triggers," but it doesn't make sense from a "roleplay" point of view. (It requires a bit of precognition on my part to get it right and some silly "la la la I can't heaaaaaaaar you with your nasty mission request!" maneuvering.)
Anyway, Fallout 4 is still a great game. I also love that so many mods exist for it. It makes me wish I could work out how to make my own, and try my hand at tweaking it a bit. (I have no idea what would be possible, though.)
As for my wishes for some future Fallout game...
1) Vehicles. A motorcycle would be nice. A horse (or mutant horse-like equivalent) would be AWESOME.
2) More diversity in dialogue paths, and less of "3 out of 4 choices will take you to EXACTLY the same outcome, with no effect beyond just getting to hear your character say something slightly different."
3) More ways to tackle the same problem. Fight your way through, tech your way through, bribe your way through, charm your way through, solve the puzzle to bypass the whole challenge.... One thing I thought was awesome about System Shock 2 was how playing a different character archetype could open up very different ways to deal with the same challenge, thus encouraging me to play through again with a different choice. It's too bad that aspect was lost in the Bioshock series, but it seems applicable to Fallout.
4) More music. I know this isn't going to happen, but I wish I'd hear something like "Postmodern Jukebox" -- Sure, maybe the culture for some reason got frozen in the 1950s/1960s, but surely they made new songs after that point. I loved the treatment of "Girls Just Wanna Have Fun" and "Everybody Wants to Rule the World" in 1910s style in Bioshock Infinite. It'd be great to hear "covers" of post-1960s songs done in 1950s/1960s style (as if the "future" still happened, but just in a different, Fallout way) over the radio.
I've actually thought of -- whenever I get to the point where my player group will let me run a Fallout campaign -- I might try accumulating a Postmodern Jukebox collection for a background soundtrack. (Most of Postmodern Jukebox's stuff seems to be from the 1920s or 1940s, but I think they've done at least one or two "doowop" style treatments of 80s songs sung as if performed in the 1950s, and that would probably work.)
5) Scale things up. It's kind of silly just how tiny the streets are. I wouldn't mind a bit more space between interesting zones, if I had a vehicle to traverse the distance more quickly. I could even do with a certain "loss of resolution" if the illusion could be perpetuated that the universe isn't quite so claustrophobic and tiny as it seems sometimes in Fallout.
...
Of those, #2 and #3 are the most important to me. This wasn't ranked in any particular way. :)
I figure it's this way in Fallout because if there's to be any sort of choice between factions, you need to at least set things up so that the player feels like there's a CHOICE to be made. Not just "Good Guy Faction" vs. "Bad Guy Faction #1" vs. "Bad Guy Faction #2." Although I wasn't totally happy with my limited choices in New Vegas, at least I felt like it made me think for a bit about what the right choice genuinely was. I wouldn't for a moment have considered Caesar's Legion, but at least they fleshed them out enough so that an NPC speaking in their defense had something to say other than "We do because we CAN, so NYAH." But NCR and Mr. House each have things going for and against them. Neither side lives up to its stated ideals ... but in NCR's case, I could at least forgive them because it was a NATION, and in any given nation, you might have good people genuinely trying to live up to those ideals, and exploitative jerks who will give lip service to those same ideals but really be there just about the power. It doesn't mean the ideals themselves aren't worth pursuing.
In Mr. House's case ... he's an individual, not a nation. I can forgive him for transgressions of the past, but it's the matter of what he wants to do RIGHT NOW and IN THE FUTURE that I have a problem with. (Of course, it sort of helps that I can look up the ending I would have gotten, had I stayed with him and betrayed all my other allies, and see that things weren't going to turn out like he'd promised, because his priorities weren't quite as stated, and were kind of evident from what actions he'd taken already in the pursuit of power.)
As for the Brotherhood of Steel ... well, they were one of the minor factions in the game, but important to the path I chose through both of my main play-throughs. (I played once on Xbox ... then later on PC with all of the DLC, in "Hardcore" mode.) I appreciated that if I went through their side-quests, and didn't take the obvious route when someone at NCR declared them a threat (not baseless -- the two factions had fought in recent history), I could negotiate peace. I lost a lot of rep with NCR (it was clear they'd rather not have any potential "competitors" in the region) but it was kind of cool that the Brotherhood sent in a bunch of paladins to help out the NCR in the final battle against Caesar's Legion, despite their differences.
Anyway, I'm curious what might happen in the future. I hope that the Fallout franchise is popular enough to see a #5 down the line. I also hope that they might bring back some of the better elements of Fallout: New Vegas.
I also hope that not every single non-robot non-dog companion/friend I make is going to hit on me when I reach maximum "affinity" in his or her quest line. (That ever-present blood-red "Romance" option at the top of the dialogue wheel is kind of unnerving. Like, the first several times I say, "Let's be friends" isn't enough? Seriously? Fallout: New Vegas still let you choose whichever "lifestyle" you pleased, but the romantic options didn't come across as pushy.)
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I liked the Brotherhood of Steel, when they were being good guys, not so much when they're being the heavies, Again with the wanting to be able to negotiate agreements between rival factions!
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Yes, that did occur to me. (*shudder*) Nice of them to not make it completely standard across the board!
I liked the Brotherhood of Steel, when they were being good guys, not so much when they're being the heavies, Again with the wanting to be able to negotiate agreements between rival factions!
I totally agree there. I see the Brotherhood of Steel as flawed but not beyond hope. (I almost would have gone with the Railroad path ... but only if it were a case of "Brotherhood strikes first -- do you defend Railroad or help BOS?" Not "Railroad offers you a chance to go blow up the Brotherhood, because ... ideological differences.")
If Bethesda is going to give me the repeated option to ROMANCE absolutely everybody who travels with me (except buzzsaw-armed robots and friendly dogs, thank goodness), they could at least be nice enough to give me diplomatic options to make friends with all the non-nasty factions and make them play nice with each other (even if there's some grumbling, and I have to be Charisma-focused, and it costs me some kind of favor points or I have to spend a bunch of my wealth to buy gifts for everybody, or whatever). I mean, it's POSSIBLE to end up there simply by avoiding certain "event triggers," but it doesn't make sense from a "roleplay" point of view. (It requires a bit of precognition on my part to get it right and some silly "la la la I can't heaaaaaaaar you with your nasty mission request!" maneuvering.)
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Anyway, Fallout 4 is still a great game. I also love that so many mods exist for it. It makes me wish I could work out how to make my own, and try my hand at tweaking it a bit. (I have no idea what would be possible, though.)
As for my wishes for some future Fallout game...
1) Vehicles. A motorcycle would be nice. A horse (or mutant horse-like equivalent) would be AWESOME.
2) More diversity in dialogue paths, and less of "3 out of 4 choices will take you to EXACTLY the same outcome, with no effect beyond just getting to hear your character say something slightly different."
3) More ways to tackle the same problem. Fight your way through, tech your way through, bribe your way through, charm your way through, solve the puzzle to bypass the whole challenge.... One thing I thought was awesome about System Shock 2 was how playing a different character archetype could open up very different ways to deal with the same challenge, thus encouraging me to play through again with a different choice. It's too bad that aspect was lost in the Bioshock series, but it seems applicable to Fallout.
4) More music. I know this isn't going to happen, but I wish I'd hear something like "Postmodern Jukebox" -- Sure, maybe the culture for some reason got frozen in the 1950s/1960s, but surely they made new songs after that point. I loved the treatment of "Girls Just Wanna Have Fun" and "Everybody Wants to Rule the World" in 1910s style in Bioshock Infinite. It'd be great to hear "covers" of post-1960s songs done in 1950s/1960s style (as if the "future" still happened, but just in a different, Fallout way) over the radio.
I've actually thought of -- whenever I get to the point where my player group will let me run a Fallout campaign -- I might try accumulating a Postmodern Jukebox collection for a background soundtrack. (Most of Postmodern Jukebox's stuff seems to be from the 1920s or 1940s, but I think they've done at least one or two "doowop" style treatments of 80s songs sung as if performed in the 1950s, and that would probably work.)
5) Scale things up. It's kind of silly just how tiny the streets are. I wouldn't mind a bit more space between interesting zones, if I had a vehicle to traverse the distance more quickly. I could even do with a certain "loss of resolution" if the illusion could be perpetuated that the universe isn't quite so claustrophobic and tiny as it seems sometimes in Fallout.
...
Of those, #2 and #3 are the most important to me. This wasn't ranked in any particular way. :)
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