Amazon Jumps Into the Fanfic Business

[jimhines]

Amazon announced Kindle Worlds today, describing it as “the first commercial publishing platform that will enable any writer to create fan fiction based on a range of original stories and characters and earn royalties for doing so.”

I didn’t know this was coming, but I’m not surprised, exactly. Amazon has been a very successful business, and if

Comments

[beccastareyes]

I've wondered why this hasn't happened before, to be honest. All I hope is that it doesn't bring the lawyers down on people who want to keep writing fanfiction for free. One of the aspects of fan culture I enjoy is the interaction between writers and readers (which are fuzzy categories since many people do both), and I worry that charging for fanfiction would limit that, especially given the number of shorter works that aren't worth the dollar that tends to be a minimum on eBook sales. (You could collect them, I suppose.)

And the element of pseudo-anonymous posting; I am consistent in using Becca Stareyes (or sometimes Stareyes) as my fannish handle so I can establish an identity as a fan, but I try not to link it to my real name, mostly so people looking for my work-related things can find those (and people looking for fiction don't run into scientific papers on Saturn's rings). I wouldn't mind signing a contract under my real name, but I'd rather publish using the name I interact with fandom with.

Does this mean fanfic could now qualify for SFWA membership?

Well, would a story like A Study in Emerald by Neil Gaiman (among other examples) apply, since it is basically a Sherlock Holmes/Lovecraftian Mythos crossover? Gaiman simply was working within two public domain properties so didn't need anyone's permission to write that.

Really, it's a fuzzy line, in my opinion, between say a general mythology with no (or several!) versions already in print (like, say, fairy tales and folklore), a specific text that has entered SF or general culture, and something that hasn't (yet). Or something like Star Wars which has become a general cultural icon, but because of copyright law, it tends to be seen in parody or criticism outside of controlled licensed material.

My understanding of the fanfiction community is that there’s a strong value on not profiting from your work.

Some of it is fear that as soon as you involve money, the lawyers will come and shut everything down -- basically, the more it's clear that it's not threatening, the safer and happier everyone is. I've heard that back in the old days of 'zines, that charging cost of materials was more common. People also do charity drives using fanfic -- you donate $X to a charity (often a topical one, like the natural disaster du jour), and the writer will write you something on request.

[naomikritzer]

Sherlock Holmes is a REALLY INTERESTING EXAMPLE, actually.

From what I understand, there are a few stories that are still under copyright (thanks to the endless endless copyright extensions granted to Mickey Mouse). Since there are plenty of Holmes stories that are thoroughly within the public domain, whether the character and world are public domain generally is a gray area, and the heirs of the Conan Doyle estate have dealt with it by essentially licensing anything that will pay them a fee or a percentage or something along those lines.

"A Study in Emerald" was originally published in a collection called "Shadows Over Baker Street," and I am sure the publisher of that collection paid the usual fee.

There's actually a lawsuit working its way through the courts right now: http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20130215/15093722002/arthur-conan-doyle-estate-sued-to-show-that-sherlock-holmes-is-public-domain.shtml that may result in Sherlock Holmes being declared as Totally Public Domain. But the Conan Doyle estate has made a LOT of money over the years by demanding a licensing fee.

[beccastareyes]

Oh, neat. Thanks for telling me that.

[sylviamcivers]

Licensing for Sherlock Holmes, really?

I've been reading Laurie R King's Holmes-got-married series, and now I wonder if she had to pay for the right to use his name.

[naomikritzer]

I'm sure she did. Or her publisher.

FWIW, I googled and found the Conan Doyle Estate's page:
http://www.conandoyleestate.co.uk/

They do not, however, tell you how much they charge.

[socchan]

Some of it is fear that as soon as you involve money, the lawyers will come and shut everything down

This is mostly it, to the best of my knowledge. There's a great short story available for free online that says pretty much exactly that: The City Boy, the Peasant Women, and the Dragon in the Tower: A Fable. It's pretty fantastic, and makes references to at least two prior incidents of people attempting to start an actual business via fanfic writers.

There's also the individual authors who try to get away with it; they're usually shut down in short order. We don't want to jeopardize our community, see: the dragon in the tower.

I'm pretty sure that most of the reason we feel like we can "get away" with charity drives is because not only do we never get any money from it, we never even handle the money, electronically or otherwise. We're ultimately just providing donation incentives.

Incidentally, I'm keeping my eyes and ears open for any fandom charities related to the Oklahoma tornado. [/frequent offerer]

[beccastareyes]

Incidentally, I'm keeping my eyes and ears open for any fandom charities related to the Oklahoma tornado. [/frequent offerer]

I know I saw someone doing something, but I'd have to check my friendslist back a couple of days. (The incentives didn't match my usual fandom haunts.)

[socchan]

fandomaid is usually my go-to for fandom charity efforts these days, but it doesn't look like they have anything set up at the moment. Considering the work that I'm sure goes into it, I certainly don't blame them. I've also checked communities with the "charity" tag on both LJ and DW and haven't seen anything that looks particularly promising (disaster-centric rather than religion-centric). If you have the time to look up a link to them, I'd be interested in finding out more.

Edit: Argh, I can never remember whether it's user or cut that requires a hyphen on LJ these days. *sigh*

[tenillypo]

I think it's actually more than just the fear of being shut down, actually. I mean, that might have been the genesis of the fan-fiction-as-gift culture, but there's also a very strong sense of commercialization as an evil for other reasons that's arisen as a result. At least in the corners of fandom where I've traveled.

In general, the gift economy encourages a certain amount of freedom that I think monetizing is perceived to jeopardize (and rightly so, given the kind of restrictions we're already seeing). But also, a culture in which stories are told in exchange for only the time and praise of the readers also fosters a different kind of camaraderie and community than one in which people are writing for money. It's a culture in which fandom often uses fanfic as just another part of the on-going conversation and commentary on the original show/book/movie, and that exchange of ideas is the compensation. The kink memes and fic exchanges are all sprung up out of this kind of back and forth between authors and readers and other authors. And that's very important to a lot of people.

[martianmooncrab]

and this will then explode with plagarism, where some free fanfic will get lightly sanded down to meet Amazons rules and the original shippers will get squat. I wonder what Amazon will do about that sort of behavior?

[seldearslj]

I suspect Amazon won't care, so long as they're getting paid. There's no incentive for them to correct the plagiarist, in fact, there's more incentive for them to encourage the plagiarists, since more work being 'sanded down' and published means more money for them, whether it belongs to the 'author' or not.

Published authors have legal rights; fanfic authors...not so much, historically.

[martianmooncrab]

New and Improved! CanOWorms! An Amazon exclusive!

[seldearslj]

Doesn't matter if it's a can of worms! It's making money! It's Capitalism! Capitalism is Good!

[martianmooncrab]

Wyrm O Gratin, and other fine uses..

[dayzdark]

This was the first thought that entered my mind when I read this news. Amazon has had enough trouble with folks plagiarizing self-published authors by slapping a new title/cover on it and putting so many titles out on KDP under pseudonyms that the numbers add up.

How much fanfic is floating around out there on the Internet? Fanfic writers often use pseudonyms and post on sites over which they do not have administrative rights. Even if they make Amazon do a Google search, how are they going to prove they're the authors?

How many fanfic writers have no idea this is going on? Among those who do, how many either won't think to look for someone profiting off their work or won't much care to raise a fuss? Self-pubbed authors at least have some intention of making a buck on their writing, so they tend to kick up a fuss when they find out someone is exploiting their intellectual property without permission. But the college student who wrote a gift for Yuletide five years ago? Not so likely to hire a lawyer if she finds out someone made $10 selling her work.