The Dark Knight

[jij]

My thoughts on this are still a bit jumbled, so forgive me if they tend to tumble over each other a bit.  I've written this without looking at any other reviews for the movie because I didn't want mine to be in reaction to them.  So bear with me if I state the obvious that's been hashed over a dozen times, or seem really stupid.  :)

In George

Comments

[naga_battousai]

What a lovely review, I don't think that I have read a better description of what the Joker's purpose is. And you are one of the few who focused on the ferry-scene as the key emotional pivots in the movie.

What I truly loved is that the movie struck a different chord in almost everyone, and almost every review/impression brought a different focus on the myriad aspects of the story. And because of that I love to read people's reviews and impressions and see how they differ or highlight things that I did not notice before.

For me, the ferry scene was great plot-wise and what it meant ideologically, but it did not quite touch the same emotional chord. It was the 'big' climax for act 3 and it certainly has sufficient gravity and impact, but the scene with Harvey afterwards is the 'personal' climax and it hits me harder emotionally. Part of it is of course because I am a lot more personally emotionally-invested in Harvey and Jim, but also because this climax has the potential to destroy the triumph/achievement in the previous climax. As the Joker said, he would not have risked the battle for Gotham's soul on a fistfight with Batman - the ferry ship is the appetiser, the real main dish is Harvey's fall from grace and how that will ultimately break Gotham's faith and showed them once and for all that even the best of them can be corrupted.

When Bruce decided that the Joker cannot win and took the fall on Harvey's behalf, it was incredibly heartbreaking, but also felt inevitable, as if the whole movie has been moving towards this point all along. It was very satisfying to me (although very sad as well), plot-wise and emotion-wise. I came in thinking that I know what " The Dark Knight" means but the movie ends with giving you a whole new layer of meaning to that title, and that sleight of hand by Nolan is one of the many things that make this movie a true masterpiece of story telling to me.

[jij]

It was the 'big' climax for act 3 and it certainly has sufficient gravity and impact, but the scene with Harvey afterwards is the 'personal' climax and it hits me harder emotionally.

I think part of the reason it didn't so much with me is that part of me always stayed very aware that Harvey was going to make the wrong choice--that he's kind of doomed to, based on years of canon. Harvey will make bad choices, Jim and Bruce will make good choices (whether those choices lead to tragedy or triumph or something bittersweetly transcending either is a very different issue, and very gripping). But I really had no faith, when it came down to the key moment, about what Random Thug and Random Suit would do. Those moments felt like judgments on all humanity rather than judgments on the canon characters, so I was very tense about what the message would be. Batman sacrifices himself for the people of Gotham--but are those people worth the sacrifice? That the answer was yes filled me with intense relief.

The moment on the ships leads inevitably to the moment where Batman has to commit to sacrificing his apparent purity for the greater good, and I agree that it all feels wonderfully...fated. If the people of Gotham hadn't proved themselves worth the sacrifice, it would have been an ending as bitter as ashes, but as it is it ends up satisfying--I think that's the perfect word. Not happy, not triumphant, but satisfying. I'll take a satisfying movie over a cheerful one any day. :)

[naga_battousai]

Yes, I think we all know that Harvey will turn bad at the end, but the plot was changed enough from the comics (did you like the nod to the comic origin at Harvey's first scene at the courtroom?), Aaron Eckhart was so *good*, and they did such a fantastic job of setting things up so that so much was riding on Harvey Dent that I ended up rooting for him too because the alternative was too horrible, even if I know how it will probably end up.

One of the most bittersweet moments I remembered was after Harvey and Rachel dragged half the Gotham mafia into court (that was hilarious!) and Major Carbonell was ripping him a new one when Harvey said - "Imagine what you could do with several weeks of clean city" and Carbonell just *stopped*. You could see how stunned he was, that the possibility didn't even occur to him before. It's this kind of 'couldhaves' littered across the movie that was shattered with Rachel's death that was so painful.

I really like how you said that the ferry scene determines whether Gothamites are worthy of sacrifice, I never thought of it that way but of course it made perfect sense now. And it resonates with Batman's words later on too - "sometimes faith will be rewarded". (Oh Lucius... I went through a lot of oh in this movie, pretty much every freaking characters have that moment)

//I'll take a satisfying movie over a cheerful one any day. :)//

You mean like Ironman? ;) Not to say I didn't love that movie, but it didn't get me to think like this one does.

Oh, and btw? Just reading on your other comments, do go and see it a second time. Seriously, this movie benefits from a second viewing because there is just too many things going on. I spent the first viewing gaping at the sheer awesomeness of the whole thing and getting the major plot-points, and the second one scrutinising the acting and getting 'aha' moments on some of the more subtle plot points. Wrote a very long and rambling 2-part reviews myself in this community just to get all the circling thoughts out of my head:

http://community.livejournal.com/worlds_finest/507686.html?thread=1898022#t1898022

And how much do you love that Bruce gets all High-tech Detective and went around detecting things this time around rather than just sneaking around things?

[jij]

Yes, I think we all know that Harvey will turn bad at the end, but the plot was changed enough from the comics (did you like the nod to the comic origin at Harvey's first scene at the courtroom?)

The courtroom scene was great! In my case, I think seeing it later than most people was part of the problem. People were very careful not to spoil me, but I did pick up enough to figure out Rachel was going to die, and I figured Harvey's turn would be related to that...(I thought he was amazing in Rachel's death scene as well).

It's this kind of 'couldhaves' littered across the movie that was shattered with Rachel's death that was so painful.

It's true, he really was doing so much and was incorruptable...again, I really think my own over-awareness of his fate blinded me to how tragic his story is. I think when I go back and watch it again (oh yes, I shall be doing that) I'll have a better appreciation for it. This Harvey was a much better man than many of the comics versions I've seen, destroyed not by his own dark impulses so much as loving too much and too fiercely and being unable to bear the cost of his idealism.

And oh yes, I very much agree seeing Bruce do his detecting and putting pieces together was very cool. And spying! Yep, morally gray and he does it all the time in the comic books, so, uh...I'm not complaining. :)