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ghibit January 28 2010, 23:02:24 UTC
Now, don't slay me like the liberal dragon I am, but you speak as if everyone isn't corrupt and haven't been in the past governments. I agree that there are plenty of things wrong with Obama, but what about Bush, what about Nixon and Watergate. You suggest that liberals are the reason why this country is going to hell in a hand-basket, well those who came before Obama were not all liberal and those who will come after, won't be either. And yet, corruption will still be rampant in the White House and all other factions of government.

And about working hard, I work hard and my family work hard and we are all liberals. And there are plenty of us hardworking liberals out there. Now, I can't speak for all liberals/everyone but what my family wants is for Health Care to be available to all people, for our dollars to be put to good use at home and in our government, to not fear a war-thirsty government, to feel safe both in terms of outside threats as well as threats from each other and our government. i.e. You seem to confuse being liberal with wanting to be controlled, it's just the opposite, we want freedom. I guess your vision of freedom differs from ours.

I understand that you don't like Obama, but please don't assume that all liberals are lazy assholes. We all want to live in a Utopian society, it's just a matter of perspective whether or not that Utopia is liberal or conservative.

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jennaharper January 29 2010, 01:40:56 UTC
Yes, I am aware that Obama is not the only President who has made mistakes. Others have and others will, yes. It is human nature; no one is perfect. But, there is a huge distinction between an ordinary mistake and Obama. Mistakes happen by accident, and are usually apologized for once it is recognized as a mistake. Then, if necessary, a solution is decided on in order to fix that mistake. The difference is that Obama doesn't admit to his mistakes because he does not see them as mistakes and he is very well aware of what he is doing. And, when his plans go haywire, he brushes the blame onto someone else or pushes it aside with a smooth-talking lecture about how there are bigger things to be worrying about. The media ignores everything and anything negative about Obama, so it's no wonder why so many people are in the dark. And, are you really playing the Bush card? Typical Liberal. The list of errors that landed upon Bush from the Clinton administration dug Bush into a hole that he had to get himself out of. But, no one would ever blame the perfect Liberal Messiah, Bill Clinton. Oh, no, no, no. He was especially reliable after he cheated on his wife while in office. That really set his values out in the open for the U.S. But, you're right. Bush was way worse.

And, no I'm not confusing being a Liberal with wanting to be controlled. I know Liberals don't want to be controlled. They want to control everyone else. That's why they are keeping the poor people down, so they can rise to the top. Teachers are dumbing down their students in their little formed unions. The Liberals want big government, and more taxes (only for the wealthy, of course). They put crazy taxes on small businesses and give them no incentives. Small and privately owned businesses are what this country thrives on, not corrupt big businesses ran by the government.

You're missing my point. I didn't say that all Liberals are lazy and I didn't assume it either. However, I do not see how one can be a Liberal without the mindset that they are entitled to things they have not earned.

Lastly, I would like to address that little thing you threw in there about a "war-thirsty" government. That is a ridiculous statement and you have again proved my point about Liberals. Bush did not declare war on Iraq because he thought it would be fun. Our country was attacked by vicious terrorists, and almost 3,000 innocent Americans were killed on 911. Families were broken apart forever. Some would never get to see their children grow up. We went to war with Iraq to stand up for this country and to PROTECT ourselves against these insane terrorists. But, you Liberals would have wanted us to go the Obama way and "sit down and talk to them". Because, clearly, they respect us so much and would be willing to have a chat with us. Wrong.

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ghibit January 29 2010, 03:06:44 UTC
I don't remember too many other politicians ever apologizing for anything. This is no excuse for Obama, but the fact of the matter is that each 4 years a government is inherited from those past. And yes, Clinton made horrendous mistakes as well, I simply mention Bush because he got me so riled up as well as the fact that Obama is taking what Bush left him. And as for Obama brushing over things, I am no political genius but I have to wonder if perhaps his cabinet is "advising" him in regards to what he says and/or does not say/glosses over. Again, not a reason to hide your faults and thusly lie to the country. However, in my eyes, Obama seems fairly benign in terms of devious behavior so far. As with my opinion of many politicians though, I may be soon eating my words.

I don't wish to control everyone else, I do like being heard however and I must say that I am glad we're having a discussion on these topics, though I wish you wouldn't label me as being "typical" and thusly take this discussion into the uncivil realm. But in terms of control, let's say for instance I am pro-choice (for example) that doesn't mean I say everyone must have an abortion or even needs to believe in it, I would want for there to be the option. However, this is another argument entirely, considering the fact that many think that abortion is murder. But when someone doesn't, they should be allowed to take their dealings into their own hands and do as they please. With taxes, my father was still liberal and making well over $200,000 a year, so believe me, we were paying out the nose for taxes. And as for small businesses, I don't know that Republicans care too terribly much about small businesses either.

By using the word lazy I meant to reinterpret your idea about being entitled to so much. You want honesty, here goes, no matter what form government takes, I will never be able to sit on my ass and have things given to me. What I do think, however, is that as a country we should be more inclined to help our people. Whether or not anyone will take that upon ourselves, I don't know.

As for "war-thirsty" I wasn't really referring to anyone in particular. I was simply saying that Democrat or Republican, Liberal or Conservative I don't want to have to fear that war will take my friends, or set foot on our soil. And no, I don't believe that terrorists would sit down and have a normal discussion with anyone. Anyone who is willing to hijack planes and kill thousands of people is a fucking nut-job. I just wish that we didn't have to deal with wars all-together. The problem is, that our world, just like our government, is an extension of our past. And people, by nature, are warlike. I just wish we weren't.

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jennaharper January 29 2010, 21:04:47 UTC
Well, I have to admit that your last post surprised me a little bit, and thus I have to change my mind. You are not a typical Liberal....however I still do not agree with you on many things. For starters, I am Pro-life. I do not believe in abortions. The single case in which an abortion should be allowed is in the case of rape. Otherwise, women should have to take responsibility for their actions.

I do agree with you in that our country has lost a sense of togetherness. The want to help others in not as evident as it once was. People have become extremely selfish, self-centered and closed-minded, but that's a whole other topic in itself.

And, I don't think anyone enjoys warfare, but sometimes there is no other way. I do agree with you on another point int that history repeays itself and we need to be watching that more carefully.

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ghibit January 30 2010, 00:50:27 UTC
I must say, you surprised me as well. :)

I figured as much about the abortion issue, but I'm happy to see that there are some Conservatives who believe a woman should be able to receive one when raped. If my boyfriend and I got pregnant I would have to double think an abortion, but if I was not able to get one when raped, I would feel so helpless and angry.

Indeed, people are truly selfish. Being human makes everyone intrinsically selfish, but it's become ridiculous. But yes, another topic entirely. (Abortion was too, but I tried to find a way to illustrate the point about freedoms).

I don't know that people enjoy war either, unless very far removed from it. And even then it may not be enjoyment coming directly from war but from that which war might gain you: spoils. I just meant that peoples of all times have engaged in war and it terrifies me that I'll loose more people I know in the war now and in wars to come.

Anyway, thanks for the dialogue. I appreciated getting into your head and vice versa. It's something everyone needs to do more often. :)

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jennaharper January 30 2010, 04:08:01 UTC
Yea, thank you for commenting in the first place. I had no idea my response to one question would get so many replies. I even learned a little (:

P.S. Still urging you to come over from the "dark side". (:

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ghibit January 30 2010, 05:32:16 UTC
lol. I was about to tell you that you should enter the world of politics. :)

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jennaharper January 30 2010, 16:27:09 UTC
(: I think I just might.

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