Stages of Grace

[izhilzha]

Thanks to whitemartyr, to her man Craig, and to one of my pastors for the thoughts which take form beneath the cut. This is something I've been struggling to frame for a while, and what better way to begin the season of Lent?

Comments

[izhilzha]

I have to disagree with your comments on points 2 & 3, at least partially. I agree that congregations need structure, but that's because none of us are at the same stages--rules help bridge the gaps in experience and understanding.

But I'm starting to be absolutely sure that we can, in fact, live in stage #3 while we are here on this earth. I'm not there yet, but I know people who are close, and I am beginning to see what that might be like.

Also? I have spent my life saying things like, "We will need the rules, at least the sensible ones that don't interfere with real love, until the new world." And you know what? All those times I said that, they were nothing but excuses to remain in bondage, to stay "safe" because I didn't trust that what was in myself was good and holy and completely worth giving to others.

It's not just rules taken too far that grace takes us beyond; grace pushes us beyond the need for rules at all, because we become able to rely on love rather than on boundaries we've drawn or had others draw for us.

Love has to become art, not stay formula. As in writing, once you know the rules, you can break them right and left and center, and only then, in that convergence of knowledge and creativity, where you can utterly trust yourself, ditch the self-conscious fear of not doing it right, and just spill out your heart, does passionate, true, powerful communication and expression happen.

And that's what I'm learning right now.

[feliciakw]

I guess I'm a little confused on what you mean by "rules." Are you talking about God's rules, or man's rules? Because I'm thinking of Romans 6:15.

I grew up in a church that had both, and there was a distinction between them. Rules based on scripture were defined as such (and I don't recall feeling condemned by that). "Rules" (more like traditions or customs) of the congregation were/are changeable. Oft times people forgot there is a difference between God's rules and man's traditions, and that's something that gets addressed fairly frequently in my experience.

where you can utterly trust yourself

This brings me in mind of Proverbs 3:5-6. I don't think we ever reach a point where we can trust ourselves completely. We ditch the self-conscious fear and spill out our hearts because of our trust in God. Yes, I think we can get to a point where we have confidence in our decisions; that comes with a confidence in our relationship with God.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you?

I have some thoughts, but I can't really formulate them right now, nor am I completely comfortable discussing them in a journal. Neither do I want to press a point that is counterproductive for you and your spiritual growth. We are on different levels of development and experience, and I'm unsure that my thoughts will be of benefit to you.

This is a lovely entry and gives much to cogitate on.

[izhilzha]

Very often, it seems to me, what people call "God's rules" are only "man's rules" labeled with authority. For instance, what about women wearing head coverings when they pray? Does your church think of that as a rule of men or of God, since it's in the Bible as a practice the church encouraged?

I'm not trying to be provocative for the sake of it, here; I'm just curious as to your experience of discerning that difference. (It will be different from mine, I am sure, but that means it's valuable.)

My beef is mostly with how people use rules (theirs or God's) to insist that we all be clones of each other in some way, rather than allowing the great differences that God creates as he opens each of us up to receive His love and to love others. Putting each other in a box can be just as damaging as putting God in our boxes, no matter how good the intention.

I don't think we ever reach a point where we can trust ourselves completely. We ditch the self-conscious fear and spill out our hearts because of our trust in God.

To try and clarify:

Here's what I am NOT saying: I am not saying that we can ever be certain that everything we do will be perfect and excellent and never cause harm. We are finite human beings, whose knowledge is limited and whose hearts are still being healed and made whole. So in that sense, no, we cannot completely trust ourselves.

Here's what I AM saying: It's not just that we can trust in God. It is not just that we reach a point of comfort in our decision-making because we trust that we have a good relationship with Him. It's far deeper than that. When God is pouring His spirit into us, it actually transforms us. We are not simply His puppets, we are changed into His substance, from glory to glory. I can trust that what is in my heart and mind is good and worthy and righteous, because He has been at work in me and is at work in me.

I trust myself (am learning to trust myself), because I was created and am continually being re-created by Him, as I partner with and embrace Him.

I trust Him, too, to take care of the consequences when I overstep my finite human bounds.

[feliciakw]

I almost deleted my original comment, realizing that we're coming from two totally different directions, and feeling that this most probably was not a response you wanted.

Re: head coverings . . . Head coverings specifically were/are a cultural practice. For a woman to be seen without a head covering would be like a woman today wearing a sexy little black cocktail number, with a slit up to there and the neck cut down to there, to church. Or wearing a bikini to church. Respectful? Worshipful? No.

Yes, the thing about head coverings is in the Bible. Does it apply to us in the specific practice of head coverings? I don't believe so. Does the admonition to be respectful and worshipful apply to us? Yes, very much.

I guess it then becomes a question of one's focus on the passage: is it on the practice of head coverings, or is it on the respectful worship of God? Is respectful worship one of man's rules, or one of God's rules?

However, if a woman deems it necessary to wear some sort of head covering to worship, I'm not going to call her out on it. It's her choice, and she has her reasons.

I find it interesting that a lot of our points of divergence have to do with things that Paul wrote. I'm not sure what to make of that.

I can't comment on the rest right now.

[izhilzha]

I find it interesting that a lot of our points of divergence have to do with things that Paul wrote. I'm not sure what to make of that.

It occurs to me that this may be partly because I am fascinated by Paul's theology. He's a clear thinker, a strong speaker (using very strong language at times), and he comes out of a culture of zeal for perfection by the Law, which speaks to me powerfully because of my own experience growing up in the church and then being called to minister to those outside it (if you will, "the Gentiles"). Galatians I just keep reading over and over (and Romans, too)--it's a startling book, and I don't know who I haven't seen it taught more often in more churches.

Anyway. Not sure where I was going with that, except that I think your observation is interesting.

[feliciakw]

I find Paul to be very direct and plain and no-non-sense in his teachings, and when I took an in-depth study of Paul-the-person, I realized that he is often extremely misunderstood in a lot of corners. He was a very passionate person, both before and after his conversion. He's often the person I think of when I think of how God made each of our personalities and temperaments, and it'a a matter of how and where we choose to focus that.

I meant to tell you: You give me things to think about and ponder and cogitate on. That's a good thing.

[scionofgrace]

I have spent my life saying things like, "We will need the rules, at least the sensible ones that don't interfere with real love, until the new world." And you know what? All those times I said that, they were nothing but excuses to remain in bondage, to stay "safe" because I didn't trust that what was in myself was good and holy and completely worth giving to others.

I think you're absolutely right about that. From all you've written, I think that you (as in you, Izh) do need to throw out the rules. They were killing you. The stuff you've been writing lately has so much more passion and art, is so much more full of life. That alone convinces me that you're doing the right thing.

But as you are different and unique from everyone else, so each of us is different from each other. I've met lots of people who, like you, need to ditch the rules. They've been shackled and blinkered and stunted - I know for myself that ditching my old rules about emotions and expressing them is necessary (and a long-term project). But there are people with the opposite problem, who are aimless and wayward, or keep falling into the same pits. For them, a rule can be a signpost in the wilderness or a ladder out of a pit, helping them define what was previously chaos. You had too much security (or rather, security in rules instead of security in knowing that you were loved regardless and meant to be beautiful in your difference). Some people have no security at all, and thus, like the Psalmist, delight in the rules.

This is why we have Paul telling people to live freely, while James was telling them to work. They're not contradicting each other. They're talking about two completely different problems.

Those of us who've lived in tiny constricted worlds need to learn freedom, while those who've been running amok need to learn discipline. Each path is beautiful and right to the one who needs it.

[izhilzha]

I don't disagree with your description of two different, well, types or groups of people. My dad actually gave me a similar description of this split a few months ago when I was talking with him about rules and freedom--he said, "Your mom and I have noticed that we have two types of kids. One type is fine with accepting boundaries and rules as the way life should be and learning to live that way. The other type needs to wrestle with everything. We used to think you were the first type, but really, you're the second."

I find it hard to believe that ultimately we won't all be living in the same space--the same utter completion and trust and wholeness. It's not a matter of type, not fundamentally; only of degree and time. Some of us need more time with the rules, to be trained in love, and some of us need more time with freedom, to be trained in love in a different way.

I don't know, I'm still feeling this out. It feels right to say that freedom is the ultimate goal, and that rules are never more than our guardian into that life--both here and afterward.

But heck, if you don't see it that way, I'm in for a rough time with the rest of my church community too. ;)

ETA: I think my biggest issue is that no one talks about freedom. Or if they do, it's *only* in the context of keeping the rules. God had to show me this the hard way, and I'm kind of angry that's how it had to play out. Where was the wisdom of those who were in Christ long before me, telling me I didn't have to be a slave?

[scionofgrace]

We're all different.

I just spent the evening with a friend who relishes discipline. She grew up without it, and is delighted by it. It doesn't weigh her down. It doesn't imprison her. It helps her grow.

I can go both ways. I've seen my rules turn into idols, and my defiance of rules turn into idols. I really have to listen to God on that some days.

You're right, we need freedom. The Church should be teaching this more. We need to know that God desires us to be free, to have no fear of doing absolutely anything, of living and growing without restrictions. Seriously, I'm sorry I never realized that's what you were dealing with. Your learning this the hard way may just be so that you can bring that freedom to others, because you know what it's like to be enslaved.

On the other hand, human ingenuity is nearly limitless. I think it's possible for having no rules to actually become a rule.

I think we'll "live in the same space", but I also think that trust and wholeness can be expressed in infinitely different ways. We must grow as God made us to grow best. Freely, according to how we are made.

[izhilzha]

On the other hand, human ingenuity is nearly limitless. I think it's possible for having no rules to actually become a rule.

ROTFLOL. I suppose that's true. I don't feel any need to go around breaking rules just because they're rules--perhaps I am too practical (for instance, I am a meticulous driver: 14 years behind the wheel and 0 accidents). But wow, it is something to be able to say, I'm me, my story is not yours, it's mine, and therefore even if it's wildly different and I am not who you think I should be, I am still God's and He is doing something through me that He wouldn't be able to do through you. (And vice versa, of course.)

Seriously, I'm sorry I never realized that's what you were dealing with.

Don't be too sorry. :) I barely knew myself, until I had worked through the hard part of failing at everything and found myself on the other side, where God loves me and it honestly doesn't matter if I "measure up" to expectations or not.

I hope God in his grace can use even the rougher parts of this learning curve, though. I'm kind of tired of the emotional swing of learning this new freedom. I want more, but I also want to rest more.

[futuremrizh]

The two types of kids thing is why you need to watch Pleasantville. :)

[izhilzha]

Okay, you have convinced me. :) WE should watch that sometime soon. Or I should, at least.