SPN "Heart": mini-meta on PRS scene (family roles)

[innie_darling]

Hi, everybody!

I've never committed meta in public before. Hmmm. And of course I'd pick not the shattering scene but the funny scene. Spoilers only for "Heart." Anyway, the Paper, Rock, and Scissors from "Heart" is obviously supposed to be a little bit of comic relief, and judging by the ep reactions I read, it worked. Even simply as comic

Comments

[i_speak_tongue]

Really interesting insights! I think you've got a great handle on the power dynamics there. When Dean threw scissors for the second time though, I figured he was simply over-thinking things, predicting that Sam would predict he'd throw something else since he'd just pointed to the fact that Dean always throws scissors, and dean might think, that if Sam thinks he's going to throw rock now instead of scissors, then Sam would throw paper. And scissors cut paper, so he should really just throw scissors again! Get it?

But seriously, I look back on that whole rock, paper, scissors scene now as being very fatalistic. I felt like the whole ep was just a long set up for him to be placed in a position where Sam felt as though he had no choice but to shoot Madison. And the corner Sam is backed into is fundamentally determined by the outcome of that game, which to me is really quite depressing. It sort of feeds into the whole "you can't change your destiny" line of thought. Sam was fated and destined to win that game. And that really kinda sucks.

Anyway, that's what it made me think about.

[andromakhe001]

Sam was fated and destined to win that game. And that really kinda sucks.

Only because Sam is too competitive to allow himself to lose. Sam has a choice, he had a choice in that game.

[i_speak_tongue]

Saying he could allow himself to lose implies he knew for certain Dean was going to throw scissors. I'm not too sure about that. I think he took a risk.

And even if it was a win/lose choice, he had no idea what the implications of that choice would be, right?

Wahh! I hate these probability riddles! That's why I don't gamble! ;)

[pheebs1]

I agree with you that he took a risk, but he probably knows Dean well enough to know Dean will go Scissors again...like Dean knew that Sam would be uncomfortably Sat on the sofa...

I love your insight that Sam was destined to lose the game tho' and so have to do that deed at the end. It's a sort of rite of passage that as a hunter Sam would have to go through at some point - although Dean would HAPPILY shield Sam from it as long as he can - Sam has to 'grow up' and not let Dean at some point,like he did here.

That's how I saw their tears at the end. My friend watched it with me last night, and pointed out that both boys were probably upset at the end cause this mirrors what Dean may have to do to Sam at some point, at I must say, I hadn't really seen that, so upset was I for the Sam/Madison situation....

sorry, I have rambled on at you i speak!

Anyway interesting discussion innie, to the point where I have now asked my flist what other games they played! :)

[innie_darling]

Thank you very much! I like your "reverse psychology" read on why Dean might have thrown scissors the second time, but I honestly believe it's even simpler than that - that he just has a weird allegiance to scissors and can't bring himself to throw anything else. I really don't think he deliberately lost.

I really like the notion of something huge (having to kill Madison) depending on something so seemingly trivial as the PRS games, but I'm not sure that I think the line between the two events is completely straight. Madison herself is a huge variable, you know?

But yay, thinky thoughts! I love our show!