Religion..Now There Is A Safe Topic.
A friend of mine recently posted a essay on religion, half of which was written by Ben Stein, and half of which was written by a big fat liar pretending to be Ben Stein.
This got me thinking and questioning, so now we have a bit of commentary and questioning thoughts on religion, by me. All of it is by me, I wrote the whole thing and will not pretend to be someone famous in order to give my ideas credit that they are not due. But, were I to post anything like the writer of the second half of the essay I would imagine that I would need all the help I could get to have people take me seriously.
Oh, and incase anyone is wondering I have noting but respect and good feelings towards my friend who originaly posted the essay. So there.
My thoughts…
Why does your religion need the governments help? Would a strong healthy religion need the governments help in the first place? It would seem to me that a religion which needs the governments help is in pretty bad shape to begin with. Also, if a government is allowed to help a religion that sets the precedent for the government to harm a religion. It seems that everyone who supports government involvement with religion thinks that their religion will always be the one on top. History shows us that this is not always the case.
Doesn't it degrade the religion to have people follow its tents by force of law rather than belief? How does it reflect on your faith to have others forced to follow the same beliefs? If I really and truly believed in something (and there are things I do believe in thankyouverymuch) I wouldn't want to see people acting like they believe it out of fear. It would make what I feel less meaningful.
How is not being allowed to force others to follow your beliefs an attack? "Oh No, We cant Put Up Out Giant Ten Commandments In The Middle Of The Courthouse!! You Are Attacking Jesus!!!"
I dont think so.
If you are allowed to force others, others are allowed to force you also. This is what leads to religious wars. Along with what I said above, forcing others to your religion just screams insecurity to me.
Have you ever been stopped from practicing your religion? Some people make this claim, but as far as I can tell it’s always them trying to force others to follow their beliefs. Well, at least in the modern USA, in the past and in many other countries there are pleanty of instances of people being stoped (sometimes quite violently) from practicing their religion. None of these times and places were/are particualrly peasent, so why try and make the USA that way?
Isn't it disrespectful towards a religion for others to pretend to practice your beliefs rather than doing do so because of belief? This is one reason I dislike going to church. I find that bowing/kneeling/singing hymns/group prayers/ect to be disrespectful to those who are doing so out of belief. I don't like feeling dishonest.
"God Did This Because.." to me is a dangerous way to start a sentence.
If you believe in God, who are you to claim to know the mind of God? God, the eternal, all powerful, all knowing, the creator of the universe and all that is within it, the alpha and the omega, and yet You claim to know what was on his mind.
Right.
Now if you don't believe in God, it's just an excuse to spread your beliefs with some
sort of threat behind it.
Now here is the essay that inspired all this..
The following was written by Ben Stein and recited by him on CBS
Sunday Morning Commentary. It was presented around the "Holiday
Season" and someone just sent it to me in an email this week. I think
this fits right in to the Jewish New Year as we consider our world,
our community, and ourselves over the past year, and for the next
year.
My confession:
I am a Jew, and every single one of my ancestors was Jewish. And it does
not bother me even a little bit when people call those beautiful lit up,
bejeweled trees Christmas trees. I don't feel threatened. I don't feel
discriminated against. That's what they are: Christmas trees.
It doesn't bother me a bit when people say, "Merry Christmas" to me. I
don't think they are slighting me or getting ready to put me in a ghetto.
In fact, I kind of like it. It shows that we are all brothers and sisters
celebrating this happy time of year. It doesn't bother me at all that
there is a manger scene on display at a key intersection near my beach
house in Malibu. If people want a crche, it's just as fine with me as is
the Menorah a few hundred yards away.
I don't like getting pushed around for being a Jew, and I don't think
Christians like getting pushed around for being Christians. I think people
who believe in God are sick and tired of getting pushed around, period. I
have no idea where the concept came from that America is an explicitly
atheist country. I can't find it in the Constitution and I don't like it
being shoved down my throat.
Or maybe I can put it another way: where did the idea come from that we
should worship Nick and Jessica and we aren't allowed to worship God as we
understand Him? I guess that's a sign that I'm getting old, too. But
there are a lot of us who are wondering where Nick and Jessica came from
and where the America we knew went to.
In light of the many jokes we send to one another for a laugh, this is a
little different: This is not intended to be a joke; it's not funny, it's
intended to get you thinking.
Billy Graham's daughter was interviewed on the Early Show and Jane Clayson
asked her "How could God let something like this happen?" (regarding
Katrina) Anne Graham gave an extremely profound and insightful response.
She said, "I believe God is deeply saddened by this, just as we are, but
for years we've been telling God to get out of our schools, to get out of
our government and to get out of our lives. And being the gentleman He
is, I believe He has calmly backed out. How can we expect God to give us
His blessing and His protection if we demand He leave us alone?"
In light of recent events...terrorists attack, school shootings, etc. I
think it started when Madeleine Murray O'Hare (she was murdered, her body
found recently) complained she didn't want prayer in our schools, and we
said OK.
Then someone said you better not read the Bible in school. The Bible says
thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not steal, and love your neighbor as
yourself. And we said OK.
Then Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when they
misbehave because their little personalities would be warped and we might
damage their self-esteem (Dr. Spock's son committed suicide). We said an
expert should know what he's talking about. And we said OK.
Now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they
don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill
strangers, their classmates, and themselves.
Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can figure it out.
I think it has a great deal to do with "WE REAP WHAT WE SOW."
Funny how simple it is for people to trash God and then wonder why the
world's going to hell. Funny how we believe what the newspapers say, but
question what the Bible says. Funny how you can send 'jokes' through
e-mail and they spread like wildfire but when you start sending messages
regarding the Lord, people think twice about sharing. Funny how lewd,
crude, vulgar and obscene articles pass freely through cyberspace, but
public discussion of God is suppressed in the school and workplace.
Are you laughing?
Funny how when you forward this message, you will not send it to many on
your address list because you're not sure what they believe, or what they
will think of you for sending it.
Funny how we can be more worried about what other people think of us than
what God thinks of us.
Pass it on if you think it has merit. If not then just discard it... no
one will know you did. But, if you discard this thought process, don't sit
back and complain about what bad shape the world is in. My Best Regards.
Honestly and respectfully,
Ben Stein
Amen!
In a reply we find out that while the first half is true, the second
is full of lies. Ben didn't even write the second, which is good as I
like Ben, even if I don't often agree with him.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/benstein2.asp
My Reply: I don't much like this, for two main reasons. First, I
recall anyone being stopped from worshiping god, unless their form of
worship calls for them to force other to worship along with them.
Second, I don't like the idea that god sent Katrina as a punishment
because of prayer being removed from the schools. Perhaps it was a
Native American god who sent it because he was pissed off at how his
people were treated. Or, maybe it was just a combination of weather
and bad civic engendering. I mean, it's easy to say god caused thing A
happened because of thing B which conveniently enough you don't happen
to like either, but who knows the mind of god?
Wow, that was long
This got me thinking and questioning, so now we have a bit of commentary and questioning thoughts on religion, by me. All of it is by me, I wrote the whole thing and will not pretend to be someone famous in order to give my ideas credit that they are not due. But, were I to post anything like the writer of the second half of the essay I would imagine that I would need all the help I could get to have people take me seriously.
Oh, and incase anyone is wondering I have noting but respect and good feelings towards my friend who originaly posted the essay. So there.
My thoughts…
Why does your religion need the governments help? Would a strong healthy religion need the governments help in the first place? It would seem to me that a religion which needs the governments help is in pretty bad shape to begin with. Also, if a government is allowed to help a religion that sets the precedent for the government to harm a religion. It seems that everyone who supports government involvement with religion thinks that their religion will always be the one on top. History shows us that this is not always the case.
Doesn't it degrade the religion to have people follow its tents by force of law rather than belief? How does it reflect on your faith to have others forced to follow the same beliefs? If I really and truly believed in something (and there are things I do believe in thankyouverymuch) I wouldn't want to see people acting like they believe it out of fear. It would make what I feel less meaningful.
How is not being allowed to force others to follow your beliefs an attack? "Oh No, We cant Put Up Out Giant Ten Commandments In The Middle Of The Courthouse!! You Are Attacking Jesus!!!"
I dont think so.
If you are allowed to force others, others are allowed to force you also. This is what leads to religious wars. Along with what I said above, forcing others to your religion just screams insecurity to me.
Have you ever been stopped from practicing your religion? Some people make this claim, but as far as I can tell it’s always them trying to force others to follow their beliefs. Well, at least in the modern USA, in the past and in many other countries there are pleanty of instances of people being stoped (sometimes quite violently) from practicing their religion. None of these times and places were/are particualrly peasent, so why try and make the USA that way?
Isn't it disrespectful towards a religion for others to pretend to practice your beliefs rather than doing do so because of belief? This is one reason I dislike going to church. I find that bowing/kneeling/singing hymns/group prayers/ect to be disrespectful to those who are doing so out of belief. I don't like feeling dishonest.
"God Did This Because.." to me is a dangerous way to start a sentence.
If you believe in God, who are you to claim to know the mind of God? God, the eternal, all powerful, all knowing, the creator of the universe and all that is within it, the alpha and the omega, and yet You claim to know what was on his mind.
Right.
Now if you don't believe in God, it's just an excuse to spread your beliefs with some
sort of threat behind it.
Now here is the essay that inspired all this..
The following was written by Ben Stein and recited by him on CBS
Sunday Morning Commentary. It was presented around the "Holiday
Season" and someone just sent it to me in an email this week. I think
this fits right in to the Jewish New Year as we consider our world,
our community, and ourselves over the past year, and for the next
year.
My confession:
I am a Jew, and every single one of my ancestors was Jewish. And it does
not bother me even a little bit when people call those beautiful lit up,
bejeweled trees Christmas trees. I don't feel threatened. I don't feel
discriminated against. That's what they are: Christmas trees.
It doesn't bother me a bit when people say, "Merry Christmas" to me. I
don't think they are slighting me or getting ready to put me in a ghetto.
In fact, I kind of like it. It shows that we are all brothers and sisters
celebrating this happy time of year. It doesn't bother me at all that
there is a manger scene on display at a key intersection near my beach
house in Malibu. If people want a crche, it's just as fine with me as is
the Menorah a few hundred yards away.
I don't like getting pushed around for being a Jew, and I don't think
Christians like getting pushed around for being Christians. I think people
who believe in God are sick and tired of getting pushed around, period. I
have no idea where the concept came from that America is an explicitly
atheist country. I can't find it in the Constitution and I don't like it
being shoved down my throat.
Or maybe I can put it another way: where did the idea come from that we
should worship Nick and Jessica and we aren't allowed to worship God as we
understand Him? I guess that's a sign that I'm getting old, too. But
there are a lot of us who are wondering where Nick and Jessica came from
and where the America we knew went to.
In light of the many jokes we send to one another for a laugh, this is a
little different: This is not intended to be a joke; it's not funny, it's
intended to get you thinking.
Billy Graham's daughter was interviewed on the Early Show and Jane Clayson
asked her "How could God let something like this happen?" (regarding
Katrina) Anne Graham gave an extremely profound and insightful response.
She said, "I believe God is deeply saddened by this, just as we are, but
for years we've been telling God to get out of our schools, to get out of
our government and to get out of our lives. And being the gentleman He
is, I believe He has calmly backed out. How can we expect God to give us
His blessing and His protection if we demand He leave us alone?"
In light of recent events...terrorists attack, school shootings, etc. I
think it started when Madeleine Murray O'Hare (she was murdered, her body
found recently) complained she didn't want prayer in our schools, and we
said OK.
Then someone said you better not read the Bible in school. The Bible says
thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not steal, and love your neighbor as
yourself. And we said OK.
Then Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when they
misbehave because their little personalities would be warped and we might
damage their self-esteem (Dr. Spock's son committed suicide). We said an
expert should know what he's talking about. And we said OK.
Now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they
don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill
strangers, their classmates, and themselves.
Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can figure it out.
I think it has a great deal to do with "WE REAP WHAT WE SOW."
Funny how simple it is for people to trash God and then wonder why the
world's going to hell. Funny how we believe what the newspapers say, but
question what the Bible says. Funny how you can send 'jokes' through
e-mail and they spread like wildfire but when you start sending messages
regarding the Lord, people think twice about sharing. Funny how lewd,
crude, vulgar and obscene articles pass freely through cyberspace, but
public discussion of God is suppressed in the school and workplace.
Are you laughing?
Funny how when you forward this message, you will not send it to many on
your address list because you're not sure what they believe, or what they
will think of you for sending it.
Funny how we can be more worried about what other people think of us than
what God thinks of us.
Pass it on if you think it has merit. If not then just discard it... no
one will know you did. But, if you discard this thought process, don't sit
back and complain about what bad shape the world is in. My Best Regards.
Honestly and respectfully,
Ben Stein
Amen!
In a reply we find out that while the first half is true, the second
is full of lies. Ben didn't even write the second, which is good as I
like Ben, even if I don't often agree with him.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/benstein2.asp
My Reply: I don't much like this, for two main reasons. First, I
recall anyone being stopped from worshiping god, unless their form of
worship calls for them to force other to worship along with them.
Second, I don't like the idea that god sent Katrina as a punishment
because of prayer being removed from the schools. Perhaps it was a
Native American god who sent it because he was pissed off at how his
people were treated. Or, maybe it was just a combination of weather
and bad civic engendering. I mean, it's easy to say god caused thing A
happened because of thing B which conveniently enough you don't happen
to like either, but who knows the mind of god?
Wow, that was long