Series 5-7: all the timelines, plot holes, and ways to fill some of them

[ibishtar]

I’ve attempted to make sense of the plot of Series 5-7 of Doctor Who (up to and including The Time of the Doctor). I’ll have to heavily summarise this in order to put it in infographic form, but here’s the full version of my write-up in case anyone’s interested. I’ve pointed out all the timeline changes as long as they pertain to the series arc (

Comments

[aylinn]

>LMAO the idea of Nine just assuming he must have done it although he can't actually remember it is so dodgy to me, I'd rather not go there.

not so much assuming because he can't remember as assuming because he doesn't WANT to remember. PTSD. remember, 10 is the one who regrets. 10 is the one who thinks things over. remember - 9 is very shortlived and very irrational and very PTSD. look at the lone dalek episode. 9 just blanks it all out & runs. and returns to what 8 was doing to try & clean things up from the war. (I refer you to the beginning of his conversation with the nestene consciousness in "rose")

Then who did the timelock? it wasn't done by the moment's detonation because she didn't detonate. the timelords? given how hard Rassilon was fighting to get back into existence (which still holds up as using the whitestar diamond & the master's link to pull them back from "outside the universe" rather than "inside the timelock") I rather doubt that. that would leave the daleks - and if they had that capability wouldn't they have used it sooner? unless the Moment was REALLY playing games & decided to go back with gallifrey and timelock instead of detonate?

how much was the Bad Wolf involved? or her Ladyship the Tardis? remember - the Doctor wasn't the only one present in 13 incarnations! *grin*

[ibishtar]

But 10 has the same memories of the Time War as 9 and if he is the one who thinks things over he would also have noticed the gaps in his memory of that day. Also, lines from the Dalek Emperor in S1:

"You destroyed us, Doctor. The Dalek Race died in your inferno, but my ship survived, falling through time, crippled but alive."

The Dalek Emperor witnessed and barely survived that moment of destruction by the Doctor, it would have noticed if it had been a case of Gallifrey disappearing and Daleks destroying each other in crossfire. It also corroborates the 9's description of what happened: "[The Daleks] all burnt, all of [them]. Ten million ships on fire. The entire Dalek race wiped out in one second. [...] I watched it happen. I made it happen. [And the Time Lords are] dead. They burnt with [them]. The end of the last great Time War. Everyone lost."

There's other arguments for the aborted timeline theory, but when I look at Christopher Eccleston's and David Tennant's portrayal, I don't believe there's a chance the Doctor's memories of that day are hazy at all.

[knightowl85]

Also, in TDotD when the official Time Lords ask the Doctor(s) why they should let him put them in the bubble universe Ten specifically says that the only alternative is that Gallifrey burns and that he has seen that future and doesn't want it repeated. So that does imply that in another timeline Gallifrey did burn or that at the moment Gallifrey was saved, a branched off timeline was created.

However, Eleven also says that he kind of remembered meeting himself before jumping back in time. This points to it being the same timeline where Gallifrey burned....Ugh...or maybe the Fez is really just a big red universe reset button that Eleven presses every time something doesn't go his way.

For a moment during tDotD I thought Ten, Eleven, (and de facto Nine) were going to end up sacrificing their incarnations because the War Doctor could never have become those men without the emotional ramifications of the Time War. I thought that timeline would be erased and the Capaldi Doctor would be rebooted as a ‘grown up' guilt free Ninth Doctor, thus also skirting the number of regeneration left question as well.

Honestly, the lost of Ninth, Tenth, and Eleventh Doctor's timeline would have been the logical result of saving Gallifrey. I cannot believe Nine and Ten, as we know them, would have had the strong reactions they had without actually witnessing the destruction of Gallifrey. It didn't seem like vague guilt over something they barely remembered. However, the fans (including me) would have had a fit if they erased from the ‘canon' all three of the ultra popular NuWho Doctors, so the War Doctor had to conveniently forget what happened (even though the majority of the action and the changes occurred within his timeline and not Eleven's.)

[ibishtar]

However, Eleven also says that he kind of remembered meeting himself before jumping back in time. This points to it being the same timeline where Gallifrey burned....Ugh...or maybe the Fez is really just a big red universe reset button that Eleven presses every time something doesn't go his way.

I think you've hit on the truth XD

Honestly, the lost of Ninth, Tenth, and Eleventh Doctor's timeline would have been the logical result of saving Gallifrey. I cannot believe Nine and Ten, as we know them, would have had the strong reactions they had without actually witnessing the destruction of Gallifrey. It didn't seem like vague guilt over something they barely remembered. However, the fans (including me) would have had a fit if they erased from the ‘canon' all three of the ultra popular NuWho Doctors, so the War Doctor had to conveniently forget what happened (even though the majority of the action and the changes occurred within his timeline and not Eleven's.)

Yeah, agree with this completely.

Sorry it took me so long to reply.