Using Words
So, discussion last night.
It went amazingly well. He left work early so that he could come home and talk with me and minimize the length of time I'd have to be awake. It's something we've talked about before, how I wish I could stay up to see him more often, but when you get up at 4 in the morning for work, 11:30/12 is just waaaaaay late.
So, he got home at 10, and we ended up talking until around 1. Which really makes me happy that he came home early, because otherwise we'd probably have talked until around 3, and being awake for nearly 24 hours sucks. I've done it before, and I'm sure I'll have to do it again, but damn, it sucks. Especially since I haven't been sleeping well this week anyway.
So, we talked about the neighbor thing, he apologized (side note, he is REALLY good at apologizing. Acknowledgment + Remorse + Resolution to never be so dumb again = really good apology), and told me that it a case of he thought I was mad because the neighbor hadn't been specific enough about what was going to happen, and when, and how much. He realizes now that he needed to give me more information about THEIR conversation, and he needed to be sure that I actually did know that they had that conversation and not just assume that I did know. That went a huge way toward helping me feel better.
We talked about how I have a hard time believing he's actually happy, based on X, Y, Z instances and Q, R, S behaviors. He assured me again that he is actually happy with being married to me, that he loves our family very much. After further talking, it comes down to that it's been eight years that we've been doing this opposite shift thing, and he's just really, really tired. It's a crappy schedule that he's keeping, and as he's getting older it's wearing on him more. Things will ease up this year with all three of the spawn being in school full time. He can get up, get them out the door to school, walk the dog, and actually go back to bed to get real sleep, and not end up sitting on the couch dozing in an out for a few hours trying to keep an ear out for the kids while feeling so exhausted. He does think that changing shifts should wait until next school year, when Monkey will be 12, because then he's legally old enough to babysit for us, and Bubba will be older and hopefully more mature. Then we can move his shift in line with ours, and start to rely a bit more on Monkey to help out with the younger kids if there's times when both of us can't be home. Monkey is in favor of this idea too, from previous converstions we've had, because we've made it clear to him that if he takes on this responsibility, he will get some compensation for it. So, light at the end of the tunnel, at least.
So. About the guys harrassing me thing. New information about that. He told me that after I ran off the dance floor, the guys were actually going to come after me (to apologize, although I sincerely doubt they'd be as good at that as Beloved), and he stepped in at that point and told them to just leave me alone, drop it, and not approach me again. When the one guy did try to come talk to me when I came back in, he was just about to step in again, but I shut him down pretty effectively on my own, so he didn't say anything. Beloved thought that I would feel better if I thought that I had handled it on my own, without his interference. He knows that I value independence and feeling strong within myself, and didn't want to step on that particularly after I had obviously just felt threatened. So we hashed out the difference between knowing that I can take care of myself, and the idea that I don't want/need his support. We both expect that there will be times when we get this wrong again, but at least we know where we're coming from. I told him it actually changes the whole event in my head, to know that he did step up and talk to those guys, it takes away that feeling that he didn't have my back. And I really wish he had said something back then, because while I don't think of that event very often, when I did it was a sore spot. I feel WORLDS better about this now.
(TW- Molestation and discussion of rape)
About the enthusiastic consent- I told him that I know I told him at one point that I had been molested, but we hadn't talked about it in depth, because in part it's not something that I dwell on, and in part because it's wicked uncomfortable to discuss. But, I felt like I needed him to know now exactly what had happened, if I hadn't already told him (and honestly, I don't remember how in depth we got on that before). So I told him all about it. I told him about waking up to find someone I trusted in my room, touching me where he shouldn't be, whispering things in my ear- specifically that this jerk was trying to plant "subliminal" messages while I slept about how I would interact with him while I was awake. For me, the fact that he was trying to control my mind was at least as horrifying as what he was doing to my body. I told him that it took me a few days/nights of going through this before I could figure out what the hell I was going to do, that I decided to confront my molester directly, to shame him, and that it worked. Retrospectively, I realize how lucky I was with that, because it doesn't always.
He said that this helps him understand the way I react to him while I'm sleeping. He said it's something that's bothered him for a while, but he didn't feel like he could 'confront' me about it, because he knew it wasn't something I'm in control of. But, when he gets into bed, or if he sees me sleeping in the chair, if he leans in to kiss me, or tries to scoot in to snuggle, I jerk away and make angry noises. He's just trying to be affectionate, get a "good night" kiss kind of thing, and it hurt him. The times when I woke up to find him being... wrong. in his actions with my sleeping body, those were times when I didn't jerk away and make angry noises, so he was hoping he could seduce me awake and we could have sexyfuntimes together. He feels horrible that it didn't work out that way, and can see how that just ends up making things even worse. I told him that I really don't have a problem with him trying to wake me up first for sexyfuntimes, but it has to be wake up->ask->then proceed. We're clear on it now, very clear. And as hard and uncomfortable as that conversation was, I am very glad we had it. He feels better too, because he said that while he knew intellectually that I obviously enjoy having him touch me and I enjoy having sex with him while I'm awake, he thought that my sleeping reactions might be a sign that I don't actually like him as much as I think I do. Knowing about the specifics of how I was molested makes it much, much more clear to him.
(/TW)
Ummm... what else did we talk about? I told him how much I appreciated the way he's acted the last couple of days, that he gave me my space to think, that he didn't pester me or make apologizing all about how awful HE felt. He was very relieved to hear that. He's spent the past couple of days really worried and unhappy too, but he wanted to do the right thing by me. He wasn't 100% sure that not talking to me was the right thing, but he was pretty sure that bugging me would just piss me off more.
We both talked about how when one of us is angry at the other (which, I mean, really- it's going to happen from time to time), it feels like being angry at ourselves, and it sucks and really hurts, and that's why it's so, SO important to make sure we actually talk about all of it, and not just let it blow over.
So, TL;DR, it was an awesome discussion, and we both feel so, so much better. I feel like this ended up being a Very Good Thing(tm) in the end.
It went amazingly well. He left work early so that he could come home and talk with me and minimize the length of time I'd have to be awake. It's something we've talked about before, how I wish I could stay up to see him more often, but when you get up at 4 in the morning for work, 11:30/12 is just waaaaaay late.
So, he got home at 10, and we ended up talking until around 1. Which really makes me happy that he came home early, because otherwise we'd probably have talked until around 3, and being awake for nearly 24 hours sucks. I've done it before, and I'm sure I'll have to do it again, but damn, it sucks. Especially since I haven't been sleeping well this week anyway.
So, we talked about the neighbor thing, he apologized (side note, he is REALLY good at apologizing. Acknowledgment + Remorse + Resolution to never be so dumb again = really good apology), and told me that it a case of he thought I was mad because the neighbor hadn't been specific enough about what was going to happen, and when, and how much. He realizes now that he needed to give me more information about THEIR conversation, and he needed to be sure that I actually did know that they had that conversation and not just assume that I did know. That went a huge way toward helping me feel better.
We talked about how I have a hard time believing he's actually happy, based on X, Y, Z instances and Q, R, S behaviors. He assured me again that he is actually happy with being married to me, that he loves our family very much. After further talking, it comes down to that it's been eight years that we've been doing this opposite shift thing, and he's just really, really tired. It's a crappy schedule that he's keeping, and as he's getting older it's wearing on him more. Things will ease up this year with all three of the spawn being in school full time. He can get up, get them out the door to school, walk the dog, and actually go back to bed to get real sleep, and not end up sitting on the couch dozing in an out for a few hours trying to keep an ear out for the kids while feeling so exhausted. He does think that changing shifts should wait until next school year, when Monkey will be 12, because then he's legally old enough to babysit for us, and Bubba will be older and hopefully more mature. Then we can move his shift in line with ours, and start to rely a bit more on Monkey to help out with the younger kids if there's times when both of us can't be home. Monkey is in favor of this idea too, from previous converstions we've had, because we've made it clear to him that if he takes on this responsibility, he will get some compensation for it. So, light at the end of the tunnel, at least.
So. About the guys harrassing me thing. New information about that. He told me that after I ran off the dance floor, the guys were actually going to come after me (to apologize, although I sincerely doubt they'd be as good at that as Beloved), and he stepped in at that point and told them to just leave me alone, drop it, and not approach me again. When the one guy did try to come talk to me when I came back in, he was just about to step in again, but I shut him down pretty effectively on my own, so he didn't say anything. Beloved thought that I would feel better if I thought that I had handled it on my own, without his interference. He knows that I value independence and feeling strong within myself, and didn't want to step on that particularly after I had obviously just felt threatened. So we hashed out the difference between knowing that I can take care of myself, and the idea that I don't want/need his support. We both expect that there will be times when we get this wrong again, but at least we know where we're coming from. I told him it actually changes the whole event in my head, to know that he did step up and talk to those guys, it takes away that feeling that he didn't have my back. And I really wish he had said something back then, because while I don't think of that event very often, when I did it was a sore spot. I feel WORLDS better about this now.
(TW- Molestation and discussion of rape)
About the enthusiastic consent- I told him that I know I told him at one point that I had been molested, but we hadn't talked about it in depth, because in part it's not something that I dwell on, and in part because it's wicked uncomfortable to discuss. But, I felt like I needed him to know now exactly what had happened, if I hadn't already told him (and honestly, I don't remember how in depth we got on that before). So I told him all about it. I told him about waking up to find someone I trusted in my room, touching me where he shouldn't be, whispering things in my ear- specifically that this jerk was trying to plant "subliminal" messages while I slept about how I would interact with him while I was awake. For me, the fact that he was trying to control my mind was at least as horrifying as what he was doing to my body. I told him that it took me a few days/nights of going through this before I could figure out what the hell I was going to do, that I decided to confront my molester directly, to shame him, and that it worked. Retrospectively, I realize how lucky I was with that, because it doesn't always.
He said that this helps him understand the way I react to him while I'm sleeping. He said it's something that's bothered him for a while, but he didn't feel like he could 'confront' me about it, because he knew it wasn't something I'm in control of. But, when he gets into bed, or if he sees me sleeping in the chair, if he leans in to kiss me, or tries to scoot in to snuggle, I jerk away and make angry noises. He's just trying to be affectionate, get a "good night" kiss kind of thing, and it hurt him. The times when I woke up to find him being... wrong. in his actions with my sleeping body, those were times when I didn't jerk away and make angry noises, so he was hoping he could seduce me awake and we could have sexyfuntimes together. He feels horrible that it didn't work out that way, and can see how that just ends up making things even worse. I told him that I really don't have a problem with him trying to wake me up first for sexyfuntimes, but it has to be wake up->ask->then proceed. We're clear on it now, very clear. And as hard and uncomfortable as that conversation was, I am very glad we had it. He feels better too, because he said that while he knew intellectually that I obviously enjoy having him touch me and I enjoy having sex with him while I'm awake, he thought that my sleeping reactions might be a sign that I don't actually like him as much as I think I do. Knowing about the specifics of how I was molested makes it much, much more clear to him.
(/TW)
Ummm... what else did we talk about? I told him how much I appreciated the way he's acted the last couple of days, that he gave me my space to think, that he didn't pester me or make apologizing all about how awful HE felt. He was very relieved to hear that. He's spent the past couple of days really worried and unhappy too, but he wanted to do the right thing by me. He wasn't 100% sure that not talking to me was the right thing, but he was pretty sure that bugging me would just piss me off more.
We both talked about how when one of us is angry at the other (which, I mean, really- it's going to happen from time to time), it feels like being angry at ourselves, and it sucks and really hurts, and that's why it's so, SO important to make sure we actually talk about all of it, and not just let it blow over.
So, TL;DR, it was an awesome discussion, and we both feel so, so much better. I feel like this ended up being a Very Good Thing(tm) in the end.