Comments | gibson22: Writer's Block: Church & State

gibson22

Writer's Block: Church & State

Sep 28, 2008 11:18

People complain that the problem is with church encroaching upon state, but I think that is far from the truth. My opinion is that state is beginning to impede on the freedoms of religion and that state is forcing us to abandon our religious rights. There are several examples of this, and the most prominent is prayer in schools. If ( Read more... )

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Wow... vampire_ninja September 28 2008, 19:00:54 UTC

The "theory" of evolution is a theory in the same way that we have a "theory" that the earth is round. Evolution is a fact; take a few science classes before you start shooting off your mouth. Evolution didn’t “happen”, it is still happening. Why do you think our antibiotics, pesticides and herbicides are rapidly becoming useless? The pesky things we use them against are becoming resistant due to evolution. And that’s just one of thousands of viable examples ( ... )

Re: Wow... readiness September 28 2008, 19:12:31 UTC

amen to that! You've said this so much better than I ever could have

Re: Wow... scun September 28 2008, 20:03:44 UTC

seconded with the amen.

Re: Wow... gibson22 September 29 2008, 00:50:30 UTC

We know the world is round because we can SEE it. I know what kind of angle you are playing at. You like to think that anyone who is religious minded cannot possibly comprehend the "mysteries of the universe" or that the earth is round. That is ridiculous. How insulting and how condescending must you be to think that anyone who believes differently than you is somehow less than you? Nobody disguises religion as science. We all know that it requires faith and belief and we know that it can never be proven without a shadow of a doubt. There must always be a certain amount of faith in those who teach and in what we've learned. That is the funny thing in this instance: you are exactly like me ( ... )

Re: Wow... vampire_ninja September 29 2008, 01:58:44 UTC

Right, and we can see evolution: Evolution boils down to mutations in DNA that cause a change in expressed traits, and some of those traits are more adaptive than others. Scientist can see these changes when they sequence an organism's genetic code, as they have figured out through decades of research what many genes are responsible for. We can SEE difference in expressed traits in living organisms that affect their reproductive fitness in a given environment. On that note, scientific theories are being constantly challenged and retested, because science is rarely set in stone unless broad ideas apply to it (see Darwin’s conditions for evolution.) And you’re right, no one disguises religion as science. Intelligent Design doesn’t even attempt to disguise the fact that it’s religious doctrine.

You like to think that anyone who is religious minded cannot possibly comprehend the "mysteries of the universe" or that the earth is round. That is ridiculous. How insulting and how condescending must you be to think that anyone who ( ... )

Re: Wow... gibson22 September 29 2008, 09:04:31 UTC

What is it about atheists that drive them to call Christians hypocrites? And no offense, but when did you ever think that much of me in the first place? At least be honest. I have never said I know all the mysteries of the universe. You seem to think you do though ( ... )

Re: Wow... vampire_ninja September 29 2008, 19:00:02 UTC

I’m not calling you a hypocrite because you’re a Christian, I’m calling you a hypocrite because you call ME condescending. And also, trying to tell me what I think. If you really want to understand why I find your original post’s subject so disturbing, read this. Honestly, I have tried to believe. I can’t ignore everything I’ve been taught over the years that makes sense to me in how everything works, and what makes the existence of God so highly improbable. We can’t “prove” he doesn’t exist, I’m very well aware of that. So don’t try to tell me that I’m “close minded” when I won’t “try” to understand why people “know” God to exist. They claim they “know” because they’re simpletons who are incapable of thinking critically ( ... )

Re: Wow... gibson22 September 29 2008, 19:26:21 UTC

Of course I can call you condescending when you automatically assume that I have never picked up a science book. I have never attacked atheists in my former post. It was you who made it personal. So please spare us the sob story about how "oppressed" you were. It is obvious that you were looking for a fight and a debate and you found it ( ... )

Re: Wow... vampire_ninja September 29 2008, 21:00:09 UTC

Sob story eh? Your original post is a sob story. "oh boo hoo, government won't let us pray in state-run schools, they won't let religious doctrine be taught in science class, they won't let us undermine human rights because of ambiguous bible quotes, therefore, religion is oppressed". In essence, your entire post could be summed up thus: "BAAAAAAAAWWWWWW!!!!" Religious people have not been oppressed except by other religious people, and the government is just trying to keep your Bible crap out of schools ( ... )

Re: Wow... gibson22 September 30 2008, 01:28:18 UTC

There is a difference from getting a wedgie at recess because you couldn't keep your mouth shut and then having state bear down and enforce when, where, and how religious freedoms can be exercised ( ... )

Re: Wow... vampire_ninja September 30 2008, 03:48:17 UTC

That really doesn’t capture the point of atheist oppression. You can’t really compare centuries of oppression with limitations on the church’s influence in schools. But I don’t want to argue on that any further, really ( ... )

Re: Wow... gibson22 October 1 2008, 01:17:25 UTC

It's good that the conversation is getting a little more inquisitive and civil on both sides and that we can still agree on certain things. I have a place to run to but I'll try to answer your questions when I can. Meanwhile, I think you would enjoy this article by Micheal Crichton. He's a pretty strong advocate of evolution, but I enjoy reading this speech because the first bit sums up my feelings of certain scientific fields. It is on global warming later on, but I think you will enjoy the read. Even then, it is still an interesting read. Let me know what you think.

http://www.crichton-official.com/speech-ourenvironmentalfuture.html

Re: Wow... gibson22 October 2 2008, 02:21:50 UTC

Ugh...twelve hour work day...Alright. Here I go. First off, no problem with the assumption of what I meant toward homosexual marriages. It's easy to assume the worst when you have churches like Westboro out there ( ... )

Re: Wow... vampire_ninja October 3 2008, 02:11:53 UTC

Agh, don't get me started on Westboro... until they came along, I had no idea that people could be THAT nuts ( ... )

Re: Wow... gibson22 October 3 2008, 04:53:06 UTC

Ha ha, yeah, I know. A friend sent me a link to the Westboro site one time saying, "Look at these crazies." When I opened it up I thought to myself, "Hoo boy...this isn't really going to reflect kindly on the rest of us, will it?" :D ( ... )

Re: Wow... gibson22 October 3 2008, 04:56:19 UTC

"Don't worry men! Nobody would willingly make an idiot out of themselves!"

"Evidently, you've never been in love!"

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