I guess Qaf has began as a Brian/michael(ewwwwww and bleah) story.
It shows on the pilot, it shows about C/L declaration at the times that they recognize themselves each one in both characters ( I'd like to know which one of them was Michael,:P)
But even on the pilot (especially on it) Gale/Randy♥ chemistry was too big, too perfect, too deep and beautiful to deny it, so I guess they have had to gave up their first (pathetic) project.
To totally try to reverse this thing at the end, I mean 513 was only about Brian and Michael, a pretty sad pathetic attempt to come back to the very first minutes of the pilot, or "how to ruin a masterpiece part 1,2,3,4...etc.":(((((((( to not forget that at the end Michael is happy and fullfilled and Brian is punished taking him away his son and his love:(
The infamous "final scene" the one with "the new blonde trick under the lampost"...I've read that C/L used to have a "test group" of people to show the scenes before to be on air, and I've read that the test group pretty much said "NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!" to that. And this shows us how much C/L both loved and hated Qaf, their own creature (it happens, yeah) because it would be the final coup de grace.
About Michael character and Hal Sparks both it would be pretty and polite for me to be silent *grin*, I guess both the actor and the character can be good to those who doesn't love like me Brian and Justin, Randy and Gale. Duh, everybody is entitled to their tastes and opinions;)
Gloria, I love you. :) You have the same thoughts I do on most things. Yes, I felt the same at the end that everyone else was pretty happy while Brian lost both Justin and Gus. (Plus the whole "that's who you are" vibe Michael kept spewing when Brian was ready to give up Babylon... There was always this give and take between Michael he kept harping at Brian to change, but freaked out the minute he showed progress of changing telling him that "it wasn't right" or some b.s. similar.... I never understood that.)
I kept meaning to watch the UK version to see how things went in that series even knowing the whole storyline, but honestly? I could never have seen a Brian/Michael ending. I don't think Brian would have respected Michael at any point and only continued to do the things he did at the beginning....then later resenting Michael for just putting up with it. Michael on the other hand would probably be all starry eyed if Brian agreed to dating/living with/etc meanwhile Brian would continue on with his self-destructive behavior. Justin challenged him in that way by expecting more from him.
You've never seen Qaf Uk? Well, it could seems the same plot of the Usa ones...but for me it's totally different.
Stuart the "Brian" of the Uk version is a real total bastard, no inner fears, no soft inside, no escape from a horror family, no inner secret desire to love and be loved...just a cold gay playboy who use people for his own pleasure.
And it's not my opinion, it was in the author's intention.
Vince the "Michael" is emphatic, cute and strong. Yeah he's in love with Stuart, but he's not the petty little betrayed wife that is Michael sometimes, not at all. He has his own life, he's not at all "all about Stuart"
Nathan the "Justin" is a cold beautiful pupil who goes with Stuart just to learn how to be like him.
It's a cute series, full of delicious English humor, but the sex is cold and meaningless, no comparison with the Usa version.
When you'll watch it I'd love to know your opinion:)
Ita with you with your insight of what it would be a Brian/Michael relationship, a real disaster... even if sometimes I think that it's quite the opposite, I mean Brian "seems" to be the "strong harsh one" and Michael "the sweet weak one", but at the end, looking inside the whole Qaf with open eyes, heart and soul I see a weak sweet selfless caring Brian and a selfish self-centered sometimes mean Michael.
Infact in the end Michael is the "winner", maybe the authors intended to "reward" him for his "sweetness" and "caring heart" (insert sarcasm), I see it just like another fake good man rewarded from life, meanwhile the real good one is punished just because he's brave bold and caring even in his wicked ways*g*
Talking about bigotes, I assure you that even gay people like C/L can be sanctimonious, they "needed" to create Brian just to destroy him:((((
Makes me wonder, a lot, of how even in Rl things often are not how they seems at first sight.
No, I've never seen it. I've seen people discuss it and how it compares with the US version. Katya sent me it (with the US version), but I never watched it. However, she like others have gone into vast differences of why they like one vs. the other. Differences between the shows, etc. I just haven't really sat down to watch it.
I agree with you on your take when you think of it in those terms. Brian was brutally blunt, but honest. It's funny how some people really are that way in life but we don't respect/value them, but people cared so much for Brian for being the same way. :) He had his issues, but he did a lot of things he didn't have to over time. I think I made a joke one time at my journal how for someone who never was in a relationship he sure did solve many relationship issues of others.
That's how I felt that Michael was rewarded and Brian was punished in a sense. Throughout the entire series Michael tended to do little back stabbing things all over the place and each time he kept trying to prove what a better person he was, how much better his life was compared to Brian's, but he's tried so hard to mess things up in Brian's life. It makes me wonder how things would have been different if Michael didn't have to interfere so often or work on other's insecurities as often as he did. (He was constantly after Justin even during the time that Brian/Justin split and Justin was with Ian.)
they "needed" to create Brian just to destroy him
Sadly people do that. :(
I have to say this and it's slightly off topic, but I find it interesting how easily people are willing to give characters in books or tv shows a chance. Brian can be an asshole at times given his brutal honesty but I also saw a lot of his actions for what they were, possibly because of my own personal experience. However, people don't provide the same measure in real life. They take things at face value and if they don't know about that person's past or things that may have made them the way they are they don't care. They don't give them a chance at all in most cases, they only see how things affect them or hurt them. I've seen it many times, and I'm guilty of it too but I have been trying to be a better person and more understanding of other's actions. (Not saying I don't get upset at times, but I try to remind myself that there might be more to it that I don't know about.)
However, on the flip side people can put blinders on for some people and ignore any bad behavior and act as though it doesn't happen. I, for example, saw a lot of negative things from Hal, but there are those who don't see things he's said that I consider pretty ugly as bad. *shrugs*
It shows on the pilot, it shows about C/L declaration at the times that they recognize themselves each one in both characters ( I'd like to know which one of them was Michael,:P)
But even on the pilot (especially on it) Gale/Randy♥ chemistry was too big, too perfect, too deep and beautiful to deny it, so I guess they have had to gave up their first (pathetic) project.
To totally try to reverse this thing at the end, I mean 513 was only about Brian and Michael, a pretty sad pathetic attempt to come back to the very first minutes of the pilot, or "how to ruin a masterpiece part 1,2,3,4...etc.":(((((((( to not forget that at the end Michael is happy and fullfilled and Brian is punished taking him away his son and his love:(
The infamous "final scene" the one with "the new blonde trick under the lampost"...I've read that C/L used to have a "test group" of people to show the scenes before to be on air, and I've read that the test group pretty much said "NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!" to that.
And this shows us how much C/L both loved and hated Qaf, their own creature (it happens, yeah) because it would be the final coup de grace.
About Michael character and Hal Sparks both it would be pretty and polite for me to be silent *grin*, I guess both the actor and the character can be good to those who doesn't love like me Brian and Justin, Randy and Gale.
Duh, everybody is entitled to their tastes and opinions;)
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I kept meaning to watch the UK version to see how things went in that series even knowing the whole storyline, but honestly? I could never have seen a Brian/Michael ending. I don't think Brian would have respected Michael at any point and only continued to do the things he did at the beginning....then later resenting Michael for just putting up with it. Michael on the other hand would probably be all starry eyed if Brian agreed to dating/living with/etc meanwhile Brian would continue on with his self-destructive behavior. Justin challenged him in that way by expecting more from him.
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Stuart the "Brian" of the Uk version is a real total bastard, no inner fears, no soft inside, no escape from a horror family, no inner secret desire to love and be loved...just a cold gay playboy who use people for his own pleasure.
And it's not my opinion, it was in the author's intention.
Vince the "Michael" is emphatic, cute and strong.
Yeah he's in love with Stuart, but he's not the petty little betrayed wife that is Michael sometimes, not at all. He has his own life, he's not at all "all about Stuart"
Nathan the "Justin" is a cold beautiful pupil who goes with Stuart just to learn how to be like him.
It's a cute series, full of delicious English humor, but the sex is cold and meaningless, no comparison with the Usa version.
When you'll watch it I'd love to know your opinion:)
Ita with you with your insight of what it would be a Brian/Michael relationship, a real disaster... even if sometimes I think that it's quite the opposite, I mean Brian "seems" to be the "strong harsh one" and Michael "the sweet weak one", but at the end, looking inside the whole Qaf with open eyes, heart and soul I see a weak sweet selfless caring Brian and a selfish self-centered sometimes mean Michael.
Infact in the end Michael is the "winner", maybe the authors intended to "reward" him for his "sweetness" and "caring heart" (insert sarcasm), I see it just like another fake good man rewarded from life, meanwhile the real good one is punished just because he's brave bold and caring even in his wicked ways*g*
Talking about bigotes, I assure you that even gay people like C/L can be sanctimonious, they "needed" to create Brian just to destroy him:((((
Makes me wonder, a lot, of how even in Rl things often are not how they seems at first sight.
Love you too♥
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I agree with you on your take when you think of it in those terms. Brian was brutally blunt, but honest. It's funny how some people really are that way in life but we don't respect/value them, but people cared so much for Brian for being the same way. :) He had his issues, but he did a lot of things he didn't have to over time. I think I made a joke one time at my journal how for someone who never was in a relationship he sure did solve many relationship issues of others.
That's how I felt that Michael was rewarded and Brian was punished in a sense. Throughout the entire series Michael tended to do little back stabbing things all over the place and each time he kept trying to prove what a better person he was, how much better his life was compared to Brian's, but he's tried so hard to mess things up in Brian's life. It makes me wonder how things would have been different if Michael didn't have to interfere so often or work on other's insecurities as often as he did. (He was constantly after Justin even during the time that Brian/Justin split and Justin was with Ian.)
they "needed" to create Brian just to destroy him
Sadly people do that. :(
I have to say this and it's slightly off topic, but I find it interesting how easily people are willing to give characters in books or tv shows a chance. Brian can be an asshole at times given his brutal honesty but I also saw a lot of his actions for what they were, possibly because of my own personal experience. However, people don't provide the same measure in real life. They take things at face value and if they don't know about that person's past or things that may have made them the way they are they don't care. They don't give them a chance at all in most cases, they only see how things affect them or hurt them. I've seen it many times, and I'm guilty of it too but I have been trying to be a better person and more understanding of other's actions. (Not saying I don't get upset at times, but I try to remind myself that there might be more to it that I don't know about.)
However, on the flip side people can put blinders on for some people and ignore any bad behavior and act as though it doesn't happen. I, for example, saw a lot of negative things from Hal, but there are those who don't see things he's said that I consider pretty ugly as bad. *shrugs*
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