People had the same issues over here about Alf Garnett in Till Death which All in the Family was based on. (That some people agreed with the views expressed.)
Although I don't think Garnett was ever meant to be seen as an essentially good man. He was a man tormented by a world he could he couldn't understand and rather than coming to terms with it he retreated into venom and bigotry.
It did. Severely. Archie wasn't presented as tormented by a world he couldn't understand, but--more or less--as a fundamentally decent common man, who distrusted anyone who might alter a nice steady status quo. His bigotry was chalked up to ignorance more often than it was to genuine hatred or real fear of the other.
I think that AitF was a little too subtle for much of its audience; I had a jerk of an uncle who thought that Archie was an OK guy.
It never seemed to me that he came across as a good person, though. He always seemed to me to be a mean, small man, who--like almost everyone--did occasionally show a glimpse of a few good qualities. That's generally true except for sociopaths. Hitler liked dogs... What I liked about AitF was that it didn't make the kids look perfect, either. Which is realistic. I think if Lear had made Archie too much of a caricature, he'd have lost the audience.
And bigots will always find ways to justify jerks
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I think that AitF was a little too subtle for much of its audience; I had a jerk of an uncle who thought that Archie was an OK guy.
I had one uncle and several cousins who saw Archie as not only an okay guy but as being the only spokesman they had.
So yeah, I'll go with too subtle for the audience.
It never seemed to me that he came across as a good person, though. He always seemed to me to be a mean, small man, who--like almost everyone--did occasionally show a glimpse of a few good qualities.
Oh, he didn't come across as good to me, but most of the people I talked to about the show over the years felt that Archie was fundamentally decent, just misguided or confused.
And I agree that I'm glad Lear didn't make Mike and Gloria perfect, either.
What I didn't like was their killing off Edith. She was the heart of the show, even though I could NOT stand her screechy voice or her artificial coyness when she was trying to be flirtatious with old dumbass.That was actually Jean Stapleton's idea--she felt that the role of Edith had
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Awww.... If it was Stapleton's decision, I don't feel so bad about it, and I don't blame her. After awhile the Edith suit must've been pretty restrictive. I never watched Bunker's place because I'd rather have root canal than watch Archie Bunker solo.
Yes, that I agreed with him about, oddly. I never wanted to agree with Archie on anything, but I did feel that Mike and Gloria should have been looking for work, at least, a lot more than the show indicated they were.
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Although I don't think Garnett was ever meant to be seen as an essentially good man. He was a man tormented by a world he could he couldn't understand and rather than coming to terms with it he retreated into venom and bigotry.
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I suspect the US version couldn't cope with/bowdlerised the fact that Alf was a mess.
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It never seemed to me that he came across as a good person, though. He always seemed to me to be a mean, small man, who--like almost everyone--did occasionally show a glimpse of a few good qualities. That's generally true except for sociopaths. Hitler liked dogs... What I liked about AitF was that it didn't make the kids look perfect, either. Which is realistic. I think if Lear had made Archie too much of a caricature, he'd have lost the audience.
And bigots will always find ways to justify jerks ( ... )
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I had one uncle and several cousins who saw Archie as not only an okay guy but as being the only spokesman they had.
So yeah, I'll go with too subtle for the audience.
It never seemed to me that he came across as a good person, though. He always seemed to me to be a mean, small man, who--like almost everyone--did occasionally show a glimpse of a few good qualities.
Oh, he didn't come across as good to me, but most of the people I talked to about the show over the years felt that Archie was fundamentally decent, just misguided or confused.
And I agree that I'm glad Lear didn't make Mike and Gloria perfect, either.
What I didn't like was their killing off Edith. She was the heart of the show, even though I could NOT stand her screechy voice or her artificial coyness when she was trying to be flirtatious with old dumbass.That was actually Jean Stapleton's idea--she felt that the role of Edith had ( ... )
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Thanks!
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