My Two Cents on Prop 8
A lot of the people on my friends-list have been writing about Prop 8. Some of you, like penknife, who wrote about three attitudes that are serious obstacles to same-sex marriage, have been dispassionate. Others are hurt but putting their hopes on legal challenges...which, in fact, are already starting. The San Francisco City Attorney's office says he plans to challenge the validity of a ballot measure that would change the state constitution to ban gay marriage. And civil rights groups have already filed legal challenges with the California Supreme Court.
I've seen a lot of people getting very angry--justifiably so--about Prop 8. How, they ask, could anyone deny someone else their rights? How could there be so much hatred?
The thing is, I don't think that it's all about hatred. I suspect that a lot of the problem on the grassroots level stems from woeful ignorance and a rather stultified view of what marriage is.
Let me tell you about a conversation I had with my next-door neighbor about three weeks before the election. It went something like this.
Me: *makes a comment indicating strong support for gay marriage*
Next-Door Neighbor: Oh, Gehayi! You CAN'T support that!
Me: Why not?
NDN: *deeply upset* Because the Catholic church says it's wrong!
Me (thinking, 'Why would I care what the Catholic church says?'): We have separation of church and state in this country. All citizens should have equal rights under the law. The Church's opinion is irrelevant.
NDN: *shocked* You don't mean that!
Me: *puzzled* Well, yeah, I do.
NDN: *dramatically* Do you WANT to see homosexuals marrying each other in church?
Me (thinking, 'Damn straight I do!): *patiently* What's generally referred to as gay marriage has nothing to do with religious ceremonies.
NDN: *puzzled* But they're talking about marriage. You can't have a marriage without religion.
Me: My mother did.
NDN: What?!
Me: My mother and father got married by a justice of the peace. My mother was Catholic and my father was Protestant. He didn't want to convert and she wasn't going to listen to all the weeping and wailing if she got married by a minister. So they had a civil ceremony. *ramming the point home* A civil PARTNERSHIP.
NDN: But...but then they weren't really married!
Me: Would you like me to show you the wedding ring and the marriage license?
NDN: *frowning, clearly not understanding this* But a marriage has to be performed by someone religious.
Me: A captain of a ship can perform a marriage. He's not a priest or minister or rabbi, is he?
NDN: That was in olden times! They don't still do that!
Me: Oh, yes, they do. It's still quite legal. Lots of people get married on shipboard every year. They think it's romantic.
NDN: But...but just going to a judge or a captain doesn't make it a real marriage.
Me: No, what makes it a real marriage is the commitment the people put into it.
NDN: *totally lost* Huh?
Me: And believe me, a civil marriage IS a marriage under the law. Certainly it was legal enough to require my parents to get divorced when they split up.
NDN: *triumphant* But that kind of marriage wouldn't give them God's blessing!
Me: *patiently* Gays aren't ASKING for God's blessing. They aren't asking for anything from various religions. They are asking the state--the government, if you like that better--to allow them to be married in civil ceremonies by judges and justices of the peace. Religion doesn't come into it at all.
NDN: *frowning and trying to make sense of this, then giving up* Oh, Gehayi, don't be silly. Of course they're asking for God's approval. They're asking for MARRIAGE.
Me: No, they're asking for civil ceremonies. Your problem is that you're picturing two men in front of an altar in a Catholic church. And one of them is wearing a white wedding dress.
NDN: *furious* Yes! That's exactly what it would be like!
Me: Actually, it would be two men both wearing suits going to City Hall. Or two women in dresses at City Hall. Like I said--Religion. Is. Not. Involved.
NDN: But...but City Hall? That's not a real marriage!
Me: You saying that my parents weren't really married?
NDN: Well, no...but...but...oh, I can't talk to you! *slams into the house*
***
I'm not saying hatred and bigotry aren't involved. God knows, there are plenty of both. But I think that this kind of person is a HUGE part of the reason that Prop 8 passed in the first place.
I've seen a lot of people getting very angry--justifiably so--about Prop 8. How, they ask, could anyone deny someone else their rights? How could there be so much hatred?
The thing is, I don't think that it's all about hatred. I suspect that a lot of the problem on the grassroots level stems from woeful ignorance and a rather stultified view of what marriage is.
Let me tell you about a conversation I had with my next-door neighbor about three weeks before the election. It went something like this.
Me: *makes a comment indicating strong support for gay marriage*
Next-Door Neighbor: Oh, Gehayi! You CAN'T support that!
Me: Why not?
NDN: *deeply upset* Because the Catholic church says it's wrong!
Me (thinking, 'Why would I care what the Catholic church says?'): We have separation of church and state in this country. All citizens should have equal rights under the law. The Church's opinion is irrelevant.
NDN: *shocked* You don't mean that!
Me: *puzzled* Well, yeah, I do.
NDN: *dramatically* Do you WANT to see homosexuals marrying each other in church?
Me (thinking, 'Damn straight I do!): *patiently* What's generally referred to as gay marriage has nothing to do with religious ceremonies.
NDN: *puzzled* But they're talking about marriage. You can't have a marriage without religion.
Me: My mother did.
NDN: What?!
Me: My mother and father got married by a justice of the peace. My mother was Catholic and my father was Protestant. He didn't want to convert and she wasn't going to listen to all the weeping and wailing if she got married by a minister. So they had a civil ceremony. *ramming the point home* A civil PARTNERSHIP.
NDN: But...but then they weren't really married!
Me: Would you like me to show you the wedding ring and the marriage license?
NDN: *frowning, clearly not understanding this* But a marriage has to be performed by someone religious.
Me: A captain of a ship can perform a marriage. He's not a priest or minister or rabbi, is he?
NDN: That was in olden times! They don't still do that!
Me: Oh, yes, they do. It's still quite legal. Lots of people get married on shipboard every year. They think it's romantic.
NDN: But...but just going to a judge or a captain doesn't make it a real marriage.
Me: No, what makes it a real marriage is the commitment the people put into it.
NDN: *totally lost* Huh?
Me: And believe me, a civil marriage IS a marriage under the law. Certainly it was legal enough to require my parents to get divorced when they split up.
NDN: *triumphant* But that kind of marriage wouldn't give them God's blessing!
Me: *patiently* Gays aren't ASKING for God's blessing. They aren't asking for anything from various religions. They are asking the state--the government, if you like that better--to allow them to be married in civil ceremonies by judges and justices of the peace. Religion doesn't come into it at all.
NDN: *frowning and trying to make sense of this, then giving up* Oh, Gehayi, don't be silly. Of course they're asking for God's approval. They're asking for MARRIAGE.
Me: No, they're asking for civil ceremonies. Your problem is that you're picturing two men in front of an altar in a Catholic church. And one of them is wearing a white wedding dress.
NDN: *furious* Yes! That's exactly what it would be like!
Me: Actually, it would be two men both wearing suits going to City Hall. Or two women in dresses at City Hall. Like I said--Religion. Is. Not. Involved.
NDN: But...but City Hall? That's not a real marriage!
Me: You saying that my parents weren't really married?
NDN: Well, no...but...but...oh, I can't talk to you! *slams into the house*
***
I'm not saying hatred and bigotry aren't involved. God knows, there are plenty of both. But I think that this kind of person is a HUGE part of the reason that Prop 8 passed in the first place.