My Name is SometimePoet and I like Vidjeo Games!
So, I was chatting with a guy online in a forum I am not going to name, and he mentioned that he was having trouble with a writing assignment. Here's the conversation that resulted. I have only taken out the introductions (us greeting each other) and then a bit where we got off topic and discussed racism. Yeah. Enjoy!
(11:34:44 am)thekrazykaveman:well, i'm writing about sexism in video games
(11:34:58 am)thekrazykaveman:and i have trouble justifying the most recent paragraph i wrote
(11:34:59 am)SometimePoet:haha, that's actually pretty difficult
(11:35:01 am)thekrazykaveman:because it's just crap
(11:35:01 am)thekrazykaveman:haha
(11:35:07 am)thekrazykaveman:Going into a game store and simply scanning over the vast array of selections, it’s obvious what sells in the gaming industry - big breasted, skimpy clothed women! The visual representation of women in video games doesn’t actually leave much to the imagination; in no way, with the video games out today, that a female character in a video game will be anything resembling an average woman because clearly women enjoy watching their avatar’s breasts giggle as they run down a corridor as much as the next male gamer.
(11:35:43 am)thekrazykaveman:jiggle, not giggle
(11:35:45 am)SometimePoet:so, i take it you're writing saying there IS sexism in video games?
(11:36:00 am)thekrazykaveman:of course there is
(11:36:06 am)thekrazykaveman:i'm actually writing two papers
(11:36:07 am)SometimePoet:I have to disagree
(11:36:11 am)thekrazykaveman:one for sexism against females
(11:36:15 am)thekrazykaveman:and one for sexism against males
(11:36:31 am)thekrazykaveman:i'm not necessarally saying whether it's right or it's wrong, but it's there
(11:36:43 am)thekrazykaveman:even if it is just the representation of women; it's still sexism
(11:36:49 am)thekrazykaveman:and the representation of men, too
(11:36:51 am)SometimePoet:*shrug* sex sells
(11:36:59 am)SometimePoet:it's a target demograhpic though
(11:37:04 am)thekrazykaveman:the ends doesn't justify the means, though
(11:37:14 am)SometimePoet:I understand but how exactly is it sexist?
(11:37:34 am)SometimePoet:so what if the hero is a buxom woman with too big tits
(11:37:35 am)thekrazykaveman:the latest outbreak of it is having gender specific games
(11:37:44 am)SometimePoet:gender specific?
(11:37:52 am)thekrazykaveman:but games like imagine: dream wedding destination
(11:38:07 am)SometimePoet:haha, they had that stuff on PC with barbie when i was a kid
(11:38:23 am)SometimePoet:it's giving girls an introduction into video games
(11:38:25 am)thekrazykaveman:...i must live under a rock
(11:38:32 am)SometimePoet:^_^
(11:38:37 am)SometimePoet:it's fun to pretend
(11:38:50 am)SometimePoet:and I see those games as saying to little girls "gaming is for you too!"
(11:39:01 am)SometimePoet:there's a small step between nintendogz to harvest moon
(11:39:09 am)SometimePoet:and from there advanced wars and so on
(11:39:21 am)thekrazykaveman:i see those games as saying "you're a girl, you have to be thin, busty and do feminine jobs"
(11:39:35 am)SometimePoet:again, I guess I have to disagree
(11:39:40 am)thekrazykaveman:i don't see imagine: lawyer
(11:39:43 am)thekrazykaveman:or imagine: ceo
(11:39:51 am)thekrazykaveman:no, imagine: movie star, fashion designer, teacher
(11:39:54 am)thekrazykaveman:ugh, great and all
(11:39:55 am)SometimePoet:HAHA, they don't have those for boys either
(11:40:06 am)thekrazykaveman:cooking mama
(11:40:09 am)SometimePoet:no game that has them play as anything other than a muscle brained killing machine
(11:40:18 am)SometimePoet:cooking mama was targeted for girls
(11:40:22 am)thekrazykaveman:not true
(11:40:29 am)thekrazykaveman:for the brawn over brain
(11:40:43 am)SometimePoet:While a game itself may include a thought process
(11:40:44 am)thekrazykaveman:there's a whole genre geared towards thinkers
(11:40:48 am)SometimePoet:the character itself is not
(11:40:50 am)thekrazykaveman:they're rpg's
(11:40:51 am)SometimePoet:OH!
(11:40:53 am)thekrazykaveman:puzzles and whatnot
(11:41:00 am)SometimePoet:the Portal girl was average sized
(11:41:16 am)SometimePoet:laura croft's boobs have shrunk
(11:41:20 am)thekrazykaveman:portal girl?
(11:41:30 am)SometimePoet:the character you play as in Portal?
(11:41:34 am)thekrazykaveman:they shrunk because you couldn't fit them on a regular size television
(11:41:38 am)SometimePoet:orange box?
(11:41:42 am)SometimePoet:haha, yeeeah
(11:41:43 am)thekrazykaveman:under a rock
(11:41:45 am)thekrazykaveman:i swear
(11:41:54 am)SometimePoet:YOU HAVEN'T PLAYED PORTAL?!?!
(11:42:00 am)thekrazykaveman:i grew up playing NES, Sega Genesis
(11:42:05 am)SometimePoet:*LAUGHS*
(11:42:06 am)SometimePoet:i know
(11:42:09 am)SometimePoet:i LOVE shining force
(11:42:27 am)thekrazykaveman:well, you clearly aren't the audience i'm writing towards
(11:42:32 am)thekrazykaveman:since you played video games regardless
(11:42:36 am)thekrazykaveman:but that's my point
(11:42:44 am)SometimePoet:but it seems like you don't know a lot of modern games
(11:43:00 am)thekrazykaveman:i scoured gamestop
(11:43:04 am)SometimePoet:you're point is based on the sex filled 90's games where every girl had gratuitous boobage
(11:43:11 am)SometimePoet:and yet you didn't know about portal?
(11:43:17 am)thekrazykaveman:well, before that
(11:43:28 am)thekrazykaveman:my gripe is against the roles that these females always play
(11:43:33 am)SometimePoet:?
(11:43:46 am)SometimePoet:final fantasy X2 is about a girl
(11:43:51 am)SometimePoet:who is not "well endowed"
(11:44:02 am)SometimePoet:and she kicks ass
(11:44:30 am)thekrazykaveman:women are always portrayed as weaker physically than men
(11:44:31 am)SometimePoet:and older, diablo had a strong female character
(11:44:33 am)thekrazykaveman:thus needing rescue
(11:44:43 am)thekrazykaveman:you created the character
(11:44:53 am)SometimePoet:i know, but you could pick her
(11:45:03 am)thekrazykaveman:you could do the same in ultima online
(11:45:08 am)thekrazykaveman:doesn't change anything
(11:45:17 am)thekrazykaveman:the representation of women is still horribly off
(11:45:20 am)thekrazykaveman:even in diablo
(11:45:25 am)SometimePoet:I wouldn't go so far as to say horribly
(11:45:34 am)SometimePoet:i can't beat up a guy
(11:45:46 am)SometimePoet:but a guy friend could
(11:45:59 am)SometimePoet:it's a, what's the word, blanket statment
(11:46:18 am)SometimePoet:to say that all women are unable to defend themselves
(11:46:22 am)SometimePoet:but it's true for a majority
(11:46:44 am)thekrazykaveman:and the majority of men can't defend themselves, either
(11:46:55 am)SometimePoet:not true, a percentage of them cannot
(11:47:02 am)SometimePoet:most men can overcome another man
(11:47:12 am)SometimePoet:I see my guy friends wrestle all the time
(11:47:13 am)thekrazykaveman:err, wrong
(11:47:15 am)SometimePoet:*rolls eyes*
(11:47:20 am)thekrazykaveman:only half the men can overcome other men
(11:47:26 am)SometimePoet:HAHA, point
(11:47:55 am)SometimePoet:But still, women are physically weaker then men, that sucks, but it's true
(11:47:59 am)thekrazykaveman:but we're no longer a society that needs to be physically strong
(11:48:04 am)SometimePoet:I know
(11:48:09 am)SometimePoet:but we've been that way for eons
(11:48:15 am)SometimePoet:it's almost hardwired into our brains
(11:48:19 am)thekrazykaveman:so then why would men care if they can physicallyd efend themselves?
(11:48:27 am)thekrazykaveman:we've got knives, guns, bats
(11:48:51 am)SometimePoet:most women don't have the phsyical power to back up most weapons, and aren't prone to carrying guns
(11:49:10 am)SometimePoet:men are the brutish kind, that originally protected women
(11:49:24 am)SometimePoet:it's just, i dunno, instinct or something
(11:49:37 am)thekrazykaveman:but that's sexism in itself
(11:49:43 am)thekrazykaveman:we're equals
(11:49:49 am)SometimePoet:.....
(11:49:53 am)thekrazykaveman:you should be protecting me just as much as i should be protecting you
(11:49:55 am)SometimePoet:I am not equal to certain men
(11:50:04 am)SometimePoet:I cannot lift twice my body weight
(11:50:14 am)SometimePoet:but some men are not equal to me
(11:50:19 am)thekrazykaveman:now you're selling yourself short
(11:50:29 am)SometimePoet:I think it's sexist that you're saying I should feel the need to be equal to anybody
(11:50:40 am)thekrazykaveman:did you know that you really usually can only access 90% of your actual strength
(11:50:55 am)SometimePoet:ok, my 90% is far less then someone else's 90%
(11:51:07 am)thekrazykaveman:maybe for upper body
(11:51:14 am)thekrazykaveman:but i can assure you that your lower body is stonger than mine
(11:51:34 am)SometimePoet:regardless, sexism is about forcing an opinon on someone else
(11:51:35 am)thekrazykaveman:but yes, in a strugle, there's no question i'm going to win
(11:51:42 am)SometimePoet:getting rid of sexism is about choice, and education
(11:52:03 am)SometimePoet:I think it's ridiculous to call a game sexist
(11:52:07 am)thekrazykaveman:it's not about forcing an opinion on anyone; it's more like oppressing them based on something that they are
(11:52:15 am)SometimePoet:how is it oppressing?
(11:52:33 am)SometimePoet:my male gamer friends don't NOT lust after me because I don't have double Ds
(11:52:45 am)SometimePoet:or because I'm not lithe and limber
(11:52:55 am)thekrazykaveman:it's oppressing because it's in a sense limiting your potential
(11:53:05 am)SometimePoet:how does it limit MY potential?
(11:53:10 am)thekrazykaveman:it's saying that because you're a girl you won't be physically strong
(11:53:15 am)thekrazykaveman:it enforces subconcious barriers
(11:53:19 am)SometimePoet:how?
(11:53:30 am)SometimePoet:how am I treated differently because a man plays tomb raider?
(11:53:37 am)thekrazykaveman:like you said, look at the difference in characters
(11:53:48 am)SometimePoet:how do I value my self worth off a VIDEO game character
(11:53:50 am)thekrazykaveman:your typical female character is either very agille and quick
(11:54:00 am)thekrazykaveman:or meek and a healer
(11:54:00 am)SometimePoet:I'm more threatened by the twigs on the cover girl cover
(11:54:03 am)SometimePoet:than of PIXELS
(11:54:20 am)SometimePoet:most girls are smarter than that
(11:54:36 am)thekrazykaveman:what does assuming do?
(11:54:36 am)SometimePoet:I haven't met one girl crying because she can't play imagine: CEO
(11:54:46 am)SometimePoet:you've been assuming the whole toime
(11:54:48 am)SometimePoet:*tim
(11:54:55 am)thekrazykaveman:and i haven't met a guy crying because he can't play imagine: porn star
(11:55:07 am)SometimePoet:I'm female, I play video games, I have dated gamers
(11:55:29 am)SometimePoet:never once have I felt that I was somehow less of a person because of the image on the screen
(11:55:49 am)SometimePoet:it's a game, and it's insulting to think that I would be so, WEAK as to base myself off a fake, imaginary character
(11:55:51 am)thekrazykaveman:maybe it's not something that conciously affects people
(11:55:58 am)SometimePoet:.........
(11:56:07 am)thekrazykaveman:but again, i'm using examples of YOUNG girls
(11:56:26 am)thekrazykaveman:not 20 year olds who are obviously well versed
(11:56:33 am)SometimePoet:and when I was a YOUNG girl, I wasn't allowed to play video games because it was my "brothers"
(11:56:41 am)SometimePoet:and was given barbie dolls to play with
(11:56:54 am)thekrazykaveman:and trust me, i hate those way, way, way more than video games
(11:56:54 am)SometimePoet:I grew up in a male domineering household
(11:57:02 am)SometimePoet:I LOVE BARBIE!
(11:57:08 am)SometimePoet:it's just a toy
(11:57:09 am)thekrazykaveman:not i
(11:57:17 am)SometimePoet:I never wanted to grow up to be barbie!
(11:57:25 am)SometimePoet:and she was at least a doctor, a vet, etc
(11:57:39 am)thekrazykaveman:lol
(11:58:01 am)SometimePoet:it's less about the psychology of video games, but about the morals the parents are instilling in their children
(11:58:21 am)SometimePoet:I was able to disassociate myself from a game, because I had outside stimulous
(11:58:30 am)thekrazykaveman:it's like our generation with television, or at least my childhood
(11:58:39 am)thekrazykaveman:parents sit us in front of something to be our babysitter
(11:58:50 am)thekrazykaveman:video games or television
(11:58:52 am)SometimePoet:exactly, it's more the raising than the content
(11:59:38 am)thekrazykaveman:there are so many educational games out there and yet parents subject their children to gender-stereotypical games
(11:59:53 am)SometimePoet:so, who's fault is that really?
(11:59:58 am)SometimePoet:the video game market wanting to make money?
(12:00:10 pm)SometimePoet:or the mom who thinks it's more "appropriate" to have her daughter play
(12:00:17 pm)SometimePoet:"LET'S TAKE CARE OF BABIES!"
(12:00:19 pm)thekrazykaveman:like when you'd said "sex sells" and i said "but the ends doesn't justify the means"
(12:00:37 pm)SometimePoet:they sell what people want to buy is my point
(12:00:43 pm)SometimePoet:there's no malicious thought at all
(12:00:59 pm)SometimePoet:but there is on the parents who are asking for "tamer" games for their kids, daughters specifically
[This is where we get off topic.... It included whether or not hate is still hate when it is taught (I say it is) and then we delved into the idea of whether people are entitled to, basically, their prejudices. Can you guess what I said? Well don't, cuz here it is]
(12:07:16 pm)SometimePoet:people are entitled to their opinon, and in this country, entitled to their hate
(12:07:18 pm)thekrazykaveman:women, on the other hand, clearly the inferior gender, lol, jk
(12:07:22 pm)SometimePoet:haha
(12:07:34 pm)thekrazykaveman:nobody is entitled to hate anybody else, that's just wrong!
(12:07:43 pm)SometimePoet:free will hun
(12:07:50 pm)SometimePoet:we can think and feel any way we want
(12:07:53 pm)SometimePoet:and it's not wrong
(12:08:02 pm)thekrazykaveman:there's plenty wrong with hate
(12:08:10 pm)SometimePoet:*sigh* bad things come from it
(12:08:16 pm)SometimePoet:but as you said, some don't act on it
(12:08:36 pm)thekrazykaveman:and as you said, plenty do
(12:08:37 pm)SometimePoet:whether for good reasons or bad, we live in a society where we sacrifice some of our personal "rights" to have some security
(12:08:51 pm)SometimePoet:and no i did not
(12:08:55 pm)SometimePoet:i said it's still hate
(12:08:58 pm)SometimePoet:xp
(12:09:02 pm)thekrazykaveman:liberties, not rights, sorry
(12:09:15 pm)SometimePoet:i think if you're entitled to it, it's a right
(12:09:21 pm)SometimePoet:liberties means it's like a luxury
(12:09:42 pm)SometimePoet:I have a right to think and say and act however i want
(12:09:49 pm)thekrazykaveman:liberties are more encompassing than that, but usually that's what it refers to
(12:09:49 pm)SometimePoet:but if i want to keep my life the way it is
(12:09:59 pm)SometimePoet:i don't act on those things
(12:10:21 pm)thekrazykaveman:well, technically you don't have the right to do anything you want; you can't infringe upon the liberties of any others
(12:10:32 pm)SometimePoet:again, not true
(12:10:38 pm)thekrazykaveman:physically, sure, you can do whatever you want
(12:10:48 pm)SometimePoet:i can infringe all i want, they would just have to defend
(12:10:52 pm)thekrazykaveman:but in order to live in our society, you can't infringe upon the liberties of anybody else
(12:11:01 pm)SometimePoet:exactly, the sacrifice i mentioned above
(12:11:11 pm)SometimePoet:we sign a social contract the moment we're born
(12:11:14 pm)thekrazykaveman:all i was touching on
(12:11:26 pm)thekrazykaveman:we sign it when we get citizenship
(12:11:38 pm)SometimePoet:^_^
(12:11:40 pm)SometimePoet:ok
(12:11:42 pm)thekrazykaveman:but i'll agree
(12:12:05 pm)thekrazykaveman:well, social contract/contract for your soul...same thing, right?
(12:12:45 pm)SometimePoet:eh? that's different... if you believe in a soul and if you're talking about changing your morality in order to achieve something be it on the physical plane or the religious sense
(12:13:02 pm)thekrazykaveman:i was making a joke
(12:13:05 pm)SometimePoet:oh
(12:13:06 pm)SometimePoet:whoops!
(12:13:08 pm)SometimePoet:^_^
(12:13:20 pm)SometimePoet:anyway, with the video games
(12:13:45 pm)SometimePoet:i think it has more to do with raising and education of a subject and less on the subconsious and soncious effects of the video game itself
(12:13:55 pm)SometimePoet:all a video game is data to be input-ed
(12:14:11 pm)SometimePoet:the filter it goes through is something that SHOULD have been set by its education
(12:14:23 pm)thekrazykaveman:anything that has to do with a computer is just inputed data
(12:14:35 pm)SometimePoet:our brains are like computers
(12:14:42 pm)SometimePoet:insert image, out comes a name
(12:15:06 pm)SometimePoet:but, a child should know that in the real world, they can be anything they want
(12:15:21 pm)SometimePoet:but in fantasy land, they can CHOOSE to be whatever they want
(12:15:34 pm)SometimePoet:so what if sometimes in SOME games they HAVE to be something?
(12:15:38 pm)SometimePoet:it's entertainment
(12:15:46 pm)SometimePoet:and if they had a problem with it, they wouldn't play it
(12:15:53 pm)SometimePoet:or their parents shouldn't BUY it
...... SERIOUSLY? *string of profanities* THIS is what happens when you let CENSORSHIP and "POLITICAL CORRECTNESS" shit all over our society! If we EDUCATED our sons and daughters, then we wouldn't have people crying that "video games make them inferior". JESUS. It's in the entertainment center not the section for "How to feel worthless in everything you do". That's in Weddings.