Them Fucking

[gabrielleabelle]

Guys, I...um...with my last post, I thought it was a given that the comics represented a change in the portrayal of Buffy's sexuality. Apparently, there's some disagreement on that. I'm quite willing to be wrong

Comments

[ceciliaj]

pr0n!

[gabrielleabelle]

Yep! Very tame porn, but porn nonetheless. :)

[ceciliaj]

Hee hee icon. Lj makes me giggle today.

[penny_lane_42]

Thank you.

What I think the people who aren't offended or at the very least, slightly uncomfortable, need to understand is that we are not wrong to feel uncomfortable. Stories, especially stories such as these, are not about objective standards. They're about subjectivity. A lot of people think S6 crossed a line as far as darkness goes. Other people do not. You could try to objectify, reduce everything to numbers and then make comparisons, and then you could try to convince people who feel that way that they're wrong, but it's not going to change their feelingsPorn is, oftentimes, in the eye of the beholder. So if you see porn here (or in WTWTA or if you think they used JM's body in ways he wasn't comfortable with in S6), you're not wrong. And nothing anyone is going to say will change you feelings about that

[gabrielleabelle]

Yep. The main point of my last post was to put that discomfort many women feel into context. The fact that we're bombarded with these images and that our own bodily autonomy is often up for grabs (so seeing our hero's body being used in this new and porny way is upsetting).

I'm especially concerned because of SMG's no-nudity clause in her contract, so, obviously, maintaining control of her body was important to her in some sense (A female actor having a clause like that will drastically reduce what parts they can play). And that's not just Buffy's body in the comics; that's her body. It squicks me.

[penny_lane_42]

And I think you did a really great job with it. Too bad other people just don't understand. I keep seeing all these people (yes, mostly men, but some women, too) all over the internet trying to explain why it isn't porn.

But hey: I know it when I see it. ;D

Exactly. It's obviously something she feels deeply about, and that's one of the reasons I'm so uncomfortable.

[gabrielleabelle]

I don't think it even matters whether it's "porn" or not (Cause nobody can ever seem to agree on a definition for that). It's the fact that Buffy was never depicted this way in the series. It's undeniably more graphic that what we've seen before.

[gigi_tastic]

i have to go wash my eyes. bangel sex upsets them

[gabrielleabelle]

My apologies.

Cake? :)

[me_llamo_nic]

I looked through the three most like scenes that came to my mind (Bangel in Amends, Biley in Where the Wild Things Are, and Spuffy in Wrecked) and you seem to be right, IMHO. I thought Spuffy in Wrecked would be pretty close, but she was wearing a shirt (which I had forgotten).

[gabrielleabelle]

Yeah, Buffy's fully clothed in Wrecked. And in Amends, we see, at most, her shoulders. WTWTA is probably where she shows the most skin, but even that is not the full-body, hands hiding breasts nudity that the comic shows.

Whenever Buffy is naked in the series, it's obvious that SMG could get away with wearing a halter top and some short shorts during the scene because not much of her body is actually shown.

[me_llamo_nic]

Mostly I thought of Amends because I remember it being hotter than Surprise. On the whole, Whedon sex scenes are remarkably tame in my opinion (until the comics). I respect that about his shows. There may be incidental sexiness, but it's never really about the sex and that's cool. (Oh, and also that scene in Dollhouse where Eliza's in the shirt-dress and we have a solid minute of 'Just Dance'. That one felt very much about the sex, mostly needlessly, probably as a way to fill time, and it kind of pissed me off.)

As for the Buffy comics...they're sort of reminding me of Torchwood S1, in the sense that they're just doing stuff because they haven't done it before. Especially with that interview about breaking the "final taboo".

*grumbles incoherently*

[gabrielleabelle]

Heh. Well, a sex scene can be quite hot without showing a lot of skin. I think Smashed has one of the hottest sex scenes EVER, and both Buffy and Spike are fully clothed (Actually, I think that makes it even hotter).

As for the Buffy comics...they're sort of reminding me of Torchwood S1, in the sense that they're just doing stuff because they haven't done it before. Especially with that interview about breaking the "final taboo".

I think that's a good comparison. God, I hated Torchwood S1. Put me off the whole damn show.

[shapinglight]

Georges Jeanty did say he'd consulted some sex manuals before drawing this. It does rather look like sex by numbers.

[gabrielleabelle]

Yep. The actual porn (as opposed to instructional porn) I looked at was far more adventurous.