The religion of atheism

[fpb]

There is one tremendous and widespread mistake about atheism: that is, that it is not a religion - that it somehow even opposes religion. Many of us, including many Christians, accept this claim implicitly, using the nouns "atheism" and "religion" as opposites.

Comments

[filialucis]

1. Bravo.

2. "...its first chapter has the Spirit of God hovering over a pre-existent primordial mass which it simply puts in order, ..."

Really? Interesting. I'd always read that to mean God first created the heaven and the earth and then put in order the primordial mass ("the earth without form, and void") that resulted from Genesis I:1.

3. "I regard all these neo-paganisms as religious masturbation."

Hee!

4. "...occasional Christian claims that all previous religions except Hebraism were ran by demons;"

On that subject: if not by demons, by what did (or do) Christians reckon that previous religions were run? I.e. do Christians (especially, for present purposes, Catholic Christians) believe that the pagan gods are real supernatural beings of some sort, or purely imaginary constructs?

5. If atheism (as I fully concur) is not the opposite of religion, what is?

[fpb]

2. That is certainly how Christians read it. However, scholars maintain that Genesis I and Genesis II are alternative accounts of the beginning of all things originally from different texts, and I think that, as compared with Genesis II, Genesis I strongly suggests the pre-existence of shapeless matter ("the waters"). I think this is a widespread scholarly theory.

4. I do not think there is any specific Catholic teaching on this matter. Many Fathers took the living and aggressive paganism of their day to be powered by demons; they were facing something present and powerful, and took reports of miracles at shrines and such very seriously, so they could not but suspect demonic activity behind it. ON the other hand, Eusebius argued that all previous religious ideas had at least important features that were Praeparatio Evangelica, and wrote a gigantic historical work on this theme. But it must not be forgotten that Eusebius, however zealous and hard-working, died in the Arian heresy, and that his views may have been affected by its

[headnoises]

On 4: I recall but can't find the explanation that basically people make the false faiths, and demons make the "miracles."

Hard to get more evil than what folks can come up with.

[fpb]

So you are disposed to ascribe everything that is not Christian to the Devil? The wisdom and nobility of Confucius? The beauty of Chinese or Indian art? Socrates? Virgil? Plato? I have a problem with that. I would rather say, with St.Justin Martyr (the first Christian philosopher), that "everything in the world that has been well done belongs to us Christians!"

[headnoises]

Actually, I'm "disposed" to figure that folks know, by their base makeup-- made by God, who's known to be a trixy person-- that there is Some Great Truth out there. (Evidenced by the major themes of religion) There are a lot of really pretty metaphors to describe this, but I'm going to pass on chopping them up for quotes and guess you know of them; you're both older and better read.

Driven by that inborn idea of what is right--sometimes cast in a negative light, sadly-- folks make religions.

Now, the supernatural actions-- THOSE, being from a supernatural source other than God (or his angels; same dif) would be demonic.

Sadly, this assumes that the reader accepts things outside of their knowledge that are able and willing to act in supernatural manners.

[fpb]

This seems to me a better formulation. Maybe some other time one of us will write a full-scale article on the matter and then we can have a more elaborate debate.

[headnoises]

I try to follow KISS. Explaining the why (we have a God-shaped hole) tends to make folks get distracted (PROVE YOUR THEOLOGICAL VIEWS!!!11!11)

I also generally try to avoid that kind of an article-- even with the massive free time I have right now, I don't have the time for the trolls.

About the closest I've gotten was a post on personal conversations on levels of evil.
http://sailorette.blogspot.com/2008/04/levels-of-evil.html

Given your level of brainpower, I'd be interested in your response-- here or there, as is easy.

[fpb]

And given what just took place between the two of us, I would point out that conflict cannot really be avoided. Trolls (of which you definitely are not one) are an inevitability, and my attitude has always been to try and stare them down rather than avoid them. Not that I would not love to, but I do not think the planet exists. To misquote Chesterton, "Under green skies, in front of cliffs of gold and solid emerald, you will find letters that say THOU SHALT NOT STEAL - and an ugly graffito that says, up yer granny."

[headnoises]

"Hell is other people"?

[fpb]

It certainly is full of them. But then, so is Paradise.