Progression in art
I just had a stimulating conversation with an old friend, and I wonder what everyone else thinks?
Tossmann (2:55:02 PM): oy, I'm bored.
Jesse Neubauer (2:55:10 PM): me too
Jesse Neubauer (2:55:20 PM): I wish I had some commissions to work on
Tossmann (2:55:32 PM): well, just work on other stuff in the mean time, for your shop
Jesse Neubauer (2:55:38 PM): like what?
Tossmann (2:55:57 PM): a porcupine
Jesse Neubauer (2:56:07 PM): but why would that be for the shop?
Jesse Neubauer (2:56:33 PM): you could order a porcupine :>
Tossmann (2:57:19 PM): um... because not everything has to be commissiond.
Jesse Neubauer (2:57:25 PM): but I can only make so many things that aren't
Tossmann (2:57:29 PM): people don't always know what they want.
Jesse Neubauer (2:57:38 PM): if nobody buys it, it's a waste of space and materials
Jesse Neubauer (2:57:51 PM): and I already have enough samples
Tossmann (2:58:10 PM): but why not make something if you want to make something?
Tossmann (2:58:17 PM): you might be surprised at who would be interested.
Jesse Neubauer (2:58:20 PM): because it won't do me any good
Tossmann (2:58:24 PM): it won't?
Jesse Neubauer (2:58:27 PM): people all want the same things
Tossmann (2:58:28 PM): the practice won't benefit you?
Tossmann (2:58:37 PM): perhaps you try something unlike anything you've done before
Tossmann (2:58:40 PM): learn from it
Tossmann (2:58:47 PM): it's only a waste if you make it that way
Jesse Neubauer (2:58:48 PM): I kind of feel like I've plateaued a bit
Jesse Neubauer (2:58:58 PM): but if I make something TOO unique, nobody will buy it
Jesse Neubauer (2:59:03 PM): and it'll just collect dust
Tossmann (2:59:35 PM): but if you make the process valuable, it hasn't been a waste
Tossmann (2:59:39 PM): do you get what I'm saying here?
Jesse Neubauer (2:59:45 PM): not really
Tossmann (2:59:57 PM): it's very difficult to speak to you sometimes.
Tossmann (3:00:02 PM): think of it like sketching
Tossmann (3:00:07 PM): you work out ideas on a sketch
Tossmann (3:00:12 PM): you don't plan on selling it
Jesse Neubauer (3:00:19 PM): I mean, would you just go out and buy a canvas and use up all your paints on it, knowing that nobody would buy the end result and you'd be stuck with it?
Tossmann (3:00:19 PM): but do you consider it a waste of paper or materials?
Tossmann (3:00:19 PM): no
Tossmann (3:00:24 PM): because you've worked something out on it
Tossmann (3:00:35 PM): Yes, my friend, if I need to.
Jesse Neubauer (3:00:40 PM): need?
Tossmann (3:00:57 PM): I'm working in oils on small pieces of panel to work out some techniques i need for my current series
Tossmann (3:01:08 PM): and as long as I learn something, it is not wasteful
Jesse Neubauer (3:01:26 PM): I'm not sure if there's much left for me to learn
Tossmann (3:01:35 PM): then you need to do something else.
Jesse Neubauer (3:01:35 PM): there's no teachers for this sort of thing
Tossmann (3:01:44 PM): so push your boundaries!
Jesse Neubauer (3:01:49 PM): I wrote a little booklet once...
Tossmann (3:01:52 PM): try to make the smallest pipey you've ever seen
Tossmann (3:01:56 PM): or the biggest!
Jesse Neubauer (3:02:00 PM): I did that :3
Jesse Neubauer (3:02:10 PM): made one with half a stem
Jesse Neubauer (3:02:14 PM): and another with two hundred
Tossmann (3:02:25 PM): so make different rules for yourself
Jesse Neubauer (3:02:31 PM): ?
Tossmann (3:02:34 PM): take something that usually takes 3 pieces, and do it in 1
Tossmann (3:02:45 PM): make non-animal objects
Jesse Neubauer (3:02:49 PM): I've done that
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:01 PM): airplane, motorcycle, TARDIS, personality core
Tossmann (3:03:03 PM): fuck, child, you're a creator. Use our imagination!
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:10 PM): they're not my forte, but they're doable
Tossmann (3:03:16 PM): your*
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:21 PM): I haven't gots an imagination
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:24 PM): I'm just a crafter
Tossmann (3:03:45 PM): are you content with that?
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:47 PM): not a single piece of intellectual property to speak of
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:50 PM): just a medium
Jesse Neubauer (3:04:01 PM): can't say I am, but whatcha gonna do?
Tossmann (3:04:09 PM): try something DIFFERENT
Jesse Neubauer (3:04:22 PM): that's what school is for
Tossmann (3:04:36 PM): so you thinkt hat once you're through with school, you should know everything there is to know?
Tossmann (3:04:44 PM): or that you can't learn unless you're there?
Jesse Neubauer (3:04:47 PM): or at least some ideas of where to start
Jesse Neubauer (3:05:09 PM): but yeah, I'm not too great at finding stuff out unless it's bein' stuffed down my throat
Tossmann (3:05:19 PM): then give up
Jesse Neubauer (3:05:20 PM): took me years to look up intarsia :<
Jesse Neubauer (3:05:44 PM): when I was about to do it without instruction
Tossmann (3:05:44 PM): creativity, by definition, is synthesis.
Jesse Neubauer (3:06:01 PM): making stuff out of other stuff?
Tossmann (3:06:09 PM): yeah
Tossmann (3:06:12 PM): experimentation
Tossmann (3:06:14 PM): discovery
Tossmann (3:06:33 PM): and you don't get that from doing only what someone has shown you how to do.
Jesse Neubauer (3:06:34 PM): I guess that applies to my marketing at this point
Tossmann (3:06:43 PM): what do you mean?
Jesse Neubauer (3:06:50 PM): but like, I already developed the technique
Tossmann (3:07:01 PM): you can always get better
Jesse Neubauer (3:07:04 PM): and I'm really not sure there's much else to really do
Tossmann (3:07:05 PM): you can always push the limits
Jesse Neubauer (3:07:20 PM): I'd like to know how
Jesse Neubauer (3:07:26 PM): so I could try
Tossmann (3:07:38 PM): like I said, do something different
Tossmann (3:07:42 PM): try something you haven't tried before
Tossmann (3:07:44 PM): it's not hard
Tossmann (3:07:49 PM): if you goof up, you've learned something
Jesse Neubauer (3:07:53 PM): what, like crocheting?
Tossmann (3:07:57 PM): if you learn something, you can still keep going.
Tossmann (3:08:04 PM): sure, crochet with pipe clean ers.
Jesse Neubauer (3:08:08 PM): o.o
Tossmann (3:08:11 PM): that could lead to interesting stuff
Jesse Neubauer (3:08:21 PM): I know a guy who makes "chainmail"
Jesse Neubauer (3:08:30 PM): seems kinda pointless though
Jesse Neubauer (3:08:41 PM): completely goes against the medium's inherent properties
Tossmann (3:08:41 PM): why?>
Tossmann (3:08:54 PM): what does?
Tossmann (3:09:08 PM): isn't that part of what's exciting about creativity?
Jesse Neubauer (3:09:10 PM): weaving/crocheting/making chainmail out of them
Tossmann (3:09:12 PM): turning something into something else?
Jesse Neubauer (3:09:29 PM): it disregards the maleability
Tossmann (3:09:38 PM): glass that looks like fabric, paper that looks like concrete, greasy pigment that looks like a beautiful landscape?
Tossmann (3:09:56 PM): that's the whole point!
Jesse Neubauer (3:10:01 PM): fuzzy wires that look like an elephant
Jesse Neubauer (3:10:17 PM): *shrugs*
Tossmann (3:10:24 PM): yeah, so why can't fuzzy wires be turned into something not so cuddly?
Jesse Neubauer (3:10:43 PM): I made a big ol' insectoid boss monster thing once
Jesse Neubauer (3:10:57 PM): that was kind of new, with the way its legs worked
Jesse Neubauer (3:11:27 PM): there was another time when I put jingle-eyes on a dragonfly
Jesse Neubauer (3:11:49 PM): I mean, sure sometimes you get something unique in one or another
Jesse Neubauer (3:11:56 PM): but is that really learning?
Jesse Neubauer (3:12:01 PM): I don't know
Tossmann (3:12:23 PM): well not if you already know how to do all of that.
Jesse Neubauer (3:12:35 PM): it's just something I make up on the fly
Jesse Neubauer (3:12:43 PM): it's in my brain, I just haven't thought of it yet
Jesse Neubauer (3:13:21 PM): like you say porcupine and my mind already starts thinking of how to engineer the quills
Jesse Neubauer (3:13:37 PM): and how stressful that'd be on my fingertips x.x
Tossmann (3:14:06 PM): wellperhaps you develop a tool with which you can execute such details without stressing your fingers.
Tossmann (3:14:10 PM): wouldn't that be a worthwhile endeavor?
Jesse Neubauer (3:14:13 PM): pliers, yep
Jesse Neubauer (3:14:20 PM): picked 'em up at the jeweler's
Tossmann (3:14:29 PM): good, so go give it a shot
Jesse Neubauer (3:14:34 PM): I have, they help
Tossmann (3:14:40 PM): the PORCUPINE
Jesse Neubauer (3:14:42 PM): they're a little cumbersome, though
Tossmann (3:14:48 PM): well then you need practice
Jesse Neubauer (3:14:55 PM): if it turns out well, will you buy it? :-D
Tossmann (3:15:11 PM): no, I was just suggesting something that I thought perhaps you haven't tried
Tossmann (3:15:35 PM): what I've been trying to say this whole time is that using materials for practice is not a waste.
Jesse Neubauer (3:15:51 PM): but what happens when my room is full of things that nobody wants?
Tossmann (3:15:59 PM): throw them a way
Jesse Neubauer (3:16:03 PM): eepers
Tossmann (3:16:03 PM): take them apart
Tossmann (3:16:08 PM): practice with that stuff
Jesse Neubauer (3:16:28 PM): I think I'm much too product-oriented for that
Jesse Neubauer (3:16:42 PM): I get attached to them when they're done
Jesse Neubauer (3:16:54 PM): a lady bought a little godzilla once just so she could stomp on it
Jesse Neubauer (3:17:01 PM): she gave it back, all crumpled to smithereens
Jesse Neubauer (3:17:08 PM): I fixed him up and gave him to a good home
Tossmann (3:17:27 PM): Should have sold it as it was, called it "Tokyo's Revenge."
Tossmann (3:17:42 PM): You need to start thinking outside the box, kiddo.
Tossmann (3:17:45 PM): you are forever trapped in there.
Jesse Neubauer (3:17:47 PM): 'xcept nobody's gonna want a little crumpled up thing
Tossmann (3:17:55 PM): how do you know that?
Tossmann (3:18:00 PM): people buy Jackson Pollock
Jesse Neubauer (3:18:11 PM): his stuff is pretty, at least
Tossmann (3:18:14 PM): people buy pre-ripped jeans.
Tossmann (3:18:15 PM): I don't think so.
Jesse Neubauer (3:18:19 PM): he was what, the founding father of impressionism?
Tossmann (3:18:25 PM): no.
Tossmann (3:18:34 PM): impressionists were about a hundred years before him.
Jesse Neubauer (3:18:43 PM): well gosh, what was it called...
Tossmann (3:18:51 PM): expressionism
Jesse Neubauer (3:18:58 PM): that's the one
Jesse Neubauer (3:19:08 PM): but if someone took a knife to one of his pieces and ripped it to shreds, nobody would buy that
Tossmann (3:19:26 PM): They'd arrest whoever did it, and try to restore it
Jesse Neubauer (3:19:29 PM): right
Tossmann (3:19:31 PM): but again, you don't know that.
Jesse Neubauer (3:19:32 PM): that's all I was doing
Tossmann (3:19:37 PM): remember the deconstructivists??
Jesse Neubauer (3:19:45 PM): don't think I got to them
Jesse Neubauer (3:19:58 PM): all I can think of is ready-made stuff but I don't think that's what you mean
Tossmann (3:21:00 PM): well, it doesn't matter
Tossmann (3:21:09 PM): what matters is that you're thinking in a one-track way
Tossmann (3:21:21 PM): I think you need some hallucinogens.
Jesse Neubauer (3:21:26 PM): possibly
Tossmann (3:21:26 PM): that might loosen you up
Jesse Neubauer (3:21:40 PM): but then I'd come to my senses and realize what a terrible idea I just had
Tossmann (3:21:57 PM): what makes a terrible idea?
Jesse Neubauer (3:22:05 PM): if it doesn't make sense to anyone else
Tossmann (3:22:20 PM): but what if in the process, you found something really cool that would?
Jesse Neubauer (3:22:40 PM): you've lost me a bit
Tossmann (3:22:55 PM): You're a kid, and you're learning to ride a bike.
Tossmann (3:23:04 PM): You squeeze the break on your handle bars
Tossmann (3:23:09 PM): the bike stops, and you take a nose dive.
Tossmann (3:23:11 PM): you get hurt
Tossmann (3:23:15 PM): but what happens?
Tossmann (3:23:21 PM): you learn not to squeeze that hard.
Tossmann (3:23:41 PM): Do you see what I'm getting at?
Jesse Neubauer (3:23:43 PM): now I'm not sure how that applies
Tossmann (3:23:58 PM): you are the most literal thinker I've ever met.
Jesse Neubauer (3:24:01 PM): yep
Jesse Neubauer (3:24:10 PM): I might have been watching too much Bones lately
Tossmann (3:24:14 PM): you learn from mistakes, or "terrible ideas."
Tossmann (3:24:24 PM): as long as you're learning, it's worth it.
Jesse Neubauer (3:24:50 PM): but what do you do once you know how to ride a bike?
Tossmann (3:25:53 PM): ride it on new terrain
Tossmann (3:25:56 PM): ride a tandem bike
Tossmann (3:25:59 PM): ride a unicycle
Tossmann (3:26:09 PM): ride it off a ramp
Tossmann (3:26:10 PM): do a wheelie
Jesse Neubauer (3:26:30 PM): I don't know what the new terrain is
Jesse Neubauer (3:26:52 PM): there's nobody that's done this before, who can tell me what I need to learn next
Jesse Neubauer (3:27:00 PM): or what else there is
Tossmann (3:27:11 PM): You have to figure it out FOR YOURSELF.
Jesse Neubauer (3:27:18 PM): I don't know howwww D:
Tossmann (3:27:29 PM): I don't understand.
Tossmann (3:27:30 PM): at all
Tossmann (3:27:48 PM): you've never tried something that you've not heard someone else did?
Jesse Neubauer (3:27:55 PM): that's what I'm doing now
Jesse Neubauer (3:28:01 PM): but I can't think of anything else
Tossmann (3:28:12 PM): what do you mean?
Jesse Neubauer (3:28:29 PM): I mean, I've got the basic mechanics in my head
Jesse Neubauer (3:28:34 PM): they can be adapted to any situation
Jesse Neubauer (3:28:38 PM): what else is there?
Tossmann (3:29:07 PM): make a solid sculpture
Tossmann (3:29:16 PM): make little pipey bricks and build new stuff.
Tossmann (3:29:21 PM): there are ENDLESS possibilities.
Tossmann (3:29:26 PM): if you think you've got it all, you've limited yourself.
Tossmann (3:29:30 PM): beyond measure.
Jesse Neubauer (3:30:06 PM): I guess I don't see the point of bricks?
Tossmann (3:30:17 PM): trying something new
Tossmann (3:30:20 PM): and with that
Tossmann (3:30:23 PM): I'm leaving.
Jesse Neubauer (3:30:25 PM): mmkay
Jesse Neubauer (3:30:31 PM): at least I cured your boredom, I hope
Tossmann (3:31:15 PM): got me flustered is what you did.
Tossmann (3:31:23 PM): later
Jesse Neubauer (3:31:25 PM): toodles
Tossmann (2:55:02 PM): oy, I'm bored.
Jesse Neubauer (2:55:10 PM): me too
Jesse Neubauer (2:55:20 PM): I wish I had some commissions to work on
Tossmann (2:55:32 PM): well, just work on other stuff in the mean time, for your shop
Jesse Neubauer (2:55:38 PM): like what?
Tossmann (2:55:57 PM): a porcupine
Jesse Neubauer (2:56:07 PM): but why would that be for the shop?
Jesse Neubauer (2:56:33 PM): you could order a porcupine :>
Tossmann (2:57:19 PM): um... because not everything has to be commissiond.
Jesse Neubauer (2:57:25 PM): but I can only make so many things that aren't
Tossmann (2:57:29 PM): people don't always know what they want.
Jesse Neubauer (2:57:38 PM): if nobody buys it, it's a waste of space and materials
Jesse Neubauer (2:57:51 PM): and I already have enough samples
Tossmann (2:58:10 PM): but why not make something if you want to make something?
Tossmann (2:58:17 PM): you might be surprised at who would be interested.
Jesse Neubauer (2:58:20 PM): because it won't do me any good
Tossmann (2:58:24 PM): it won't?
Jesse Neubauer (2:58:27 PM): people all want the same things
Tossmann (2:58:28 PM): the practice won't benefit you?
Tossmann (2:58:37 PM): perhaps you try something unlike anything you've done before
Tossmann (2:58:40 PM): learn from it
Tossmann (2:58:47 PM): it's only a waste if you make it that way
Jesse Neubauer (2:58:48 PM): I kind of feel like I've plateaued a bit
Jesse Neubauer (2:58:58 PM): but if I make something TOO unique, nobody will buy it
Jesse Neubauer (2:59:03 PM): and it'll just collect dust
Tossmann (2:59:35 PM): but if you make the process valuable, it hasn't been a waste
Tossmann (2:59:39 PM): do you get what I'm saying here?
Jesse Neubauer (2:59:45 PM): not really
Tossmann (2:59:57 PM): it's very difficult to speak to you sometimes.
Tossmann (3:00:02 PM): think of it like sketching
Tossmann (3:00:07 PM): you work out ideas on a sketch
Tossmann (3:00:12 PM): you don't plan on selling it
Jesse Neubauer (3:00:19 PM): I mean, would you just go out and buy a canvas and use up all your paints on it, knowing that nobody would buy the end result and you'd be stuck with it?
Tossmann (3:00:19 PM): but do you consider it a waste of paper or materials?
Tossmann (3:00:19 PM): no
Tossmann (3:00:24 PM): because you've worked something out on it
Tossmann (3:00:35 PM): Yes, my friend, if I need to.
Jesse Neubauer (3:00:40 PM): need?
Tossmann (3:00:57 PM): I'm working in oils on small pieces of panel to work out some techniques i need for my current series
Tossmann (3:01:08 PM): and as long as I learn something, it is not wasteful
Jesse Neubauer (3:01:26 PM): I'm not sure if there's much left for me to learn
Tossmann (3:01:35 PM): then you need to do something else.
Jesse Neubauer (3:01:35 PM): there's no teachers for this sort of thing
Tossmann (3:01:44 PM): so push your boundaries!
Jesse Neubauer (3:01:49 PM): I wrote a little booklet once...
Tossmann (3:01:52 PM): try to make the smallest pipey you've ever seen
Tossmann (3:01:56 PM): or the biggest!
Jesse Neubauer (3:02:00 PM): I did that :3
Jesse Neubauer (3:02:10 PM): made one with half a stem
Jesse Neubauer (3:02:14 PM): and another with two hundred
Tossmann (3:02:25 PM): so make different rules for yourself
Jesse Neubauer (3:02:31 PM): ?
Tossmann (3:02:34 PM): take something that usually takes 3 pieces, and do it in 1
Tossmann (3:02:45 PM): make non-animal objects
Jesse Neubauer (3:02:49 PM): I've done that
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:01 PM): airplane, motorcycle, TARDIS, personality core
Tossmann (3:03:03 PM): fuck, child, you're a creator. Use our imagination!
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:10 PM): they're not my forte, but they're doable
Tossmann (3:03:16 PM): your*
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:21 PM): I haven't gots an imagination
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:24 PM): I'm just a crafter
Tossmann (3:03:45 PM): are you content with that?
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:47 PM): not a single piece of intellectual property to speak of
Jesse Neubauer (3:03:50 PM): just a medium
Jesse Neubauer (3:04:01 PM): can't say I am, but whatcha gonna do?
Tossmann (3:04:09 PM): try something DIFFERENT
Jesse Neubauer (3:04:22 PM): that's what school is for
Tossmann (3:04:36 PM): so you thinkt hat once you're through with school, you should know everything there is to know?
Tossmann (3:04:44 PM): or that you can't learn unless you're there?
Jesse Neubauer (3:04:47 PM): or at least some ideas of where to start
Jesse Neubauer (3:05:09 PM): but yeah, I'm not too great at finding stuff out unless it's bein' stuffed down my throat
Tossmann (3:05:19 PM): then give up
Jesse Neubauer (3:05:20 PM): took me years to look up intarsia :<
Jesse Neubauer (3:05:44 PM): when I was about to do it without instruction
Tossmann (3:05:44 PM): creativity, by definition, is synthesis.
Jesse Neubauer (3:06:01 PM): making stuff out of other stuff?
Tossmann (3:06:09 PM): yeah
Tossmann (3:06:12 PM): experimentation
Tossmann (3:06:14 PM): discovery
Tossmann (3:06:33 PM): and you don't get that from doing only what someone has shown you how to do.
Jesse Neubauer (3:06:34 PM): I guess that applies to my marketing at this point
Tossmann (3:06:43 PM): what do you mean?
Jesse Neubauer (3:06:50 PM): but like, I already developed the technique
Tossmann (3:07:01 PM): you can always get better
Jesse Neubauer (3:07:04 PM): and I'm really not sure there's much else to really do
Tossmann (3:07:05 PM): you can always push the limits
Jesse Neubauer (3:07:20 PM): I'd like to know how
Jesse Neubauer (3:07:26 PM): so I could try
Tossmann (3:07:38 PM): like I said, do something different
Tossmann (3:07:42 PM): try something you haven't tried before
Tossmann (3:07:44 PM): it's not hard
Tossmann (3:07:49 PM): if you goof up, you've learned something
Jesse Neubauer (3:07:53 PM): what, like crocheting?
Tossmann (3:07:57 PM): if you learn something, you can still keep going.
Tossmann (3:08:04 PM): sure, crochet with pipe clean ers.
Jesse Neubauer (3:08:08 PM): o.o
Tossmann (3:08:11 PM): that could lead to interesting stuff
Jesse Neubauer (3:08:21 PM): I know a guy who makes "chainmail"
Jesse Neubauer (3:08:30 PM): seems kinda pointless though
Jesse Neubauer (3:08:41 PM): completely goes against the medium's inherent properties
Tossmann (3:08:41 PM): why?>
Tossmann (3:08:54 PM): what does?
Tossmann (3:09:08 PM): isn't that part of what's exciting about creativity?
Jesse Neubauer (3:09:10 PM): weaving/crocheting/making chainmail out of them
Tossmann (3:09:12 PM): turning something into something else?
Jesse Neubauer (3:09:29 PM): it disregards the maleability
Tossmann (3:09:38 PM): glass that looks like fabric, paper that looks like concrete, greasy pigment that looks like a beautiful landscape?
Tossmann (3:09:56 PM): that's the whole point!
Jesse Neubauer (3:10:01 PM): fuzzy wires that look like an elephant
Jesse Neubauer (3:10:17 PM): *shrugs*
Tossmann (3:10:24 PM): yeah, so why can't fuzzy wires be turned into something not so cuddly?
Jesse Neubauer (3:10:43 PM): I made a big ol' insectoid boss monster thing once
Jesse Neubauer (3:10:57 PM): that was kind of new, with the way its legs worked
Jesse Neubauer (3:11:27 PM): there was another time when I put jingle-eyes on a dragonfly
Jesse Neubauer (3:11:49 PM): I mean, sure sometimes you get something unique in one or another
Jesse Neubauer (3:11:56 PM): but is that really learning?
Jesse Neubauer (3:12:01 PM): I don't know
Tossmann (3:12:23 PM): well not if you already know how to do all of that.
Jesse Neubauer (3:12:35 PM): it's just something I make up on the fly
Jesse Neubauer (3:12:43 PM): it's in my brain, I just haven't thought of it yet
Jesse Neubauer (3:13:21 PM): like you say porcupine and my mind already starts thinking of how to engineer the quills
Jesse Neubauer (3:13:37 PM): and how stressful that'd be on my fingertips x.x
Tossmann (3:14:06 PM): wellperhaps you develop a tool with which you can execute such details without stressing your fingers.
Tossmann (3:14:10 PM): wouldn't that be a worthwhile endeavor?
Jesse Neubauer (3:14:13 PM): pliers, yep
Jesse Neubauer (3:14:20 PM): picked 'em up at the jeweler's
Tossmann (3:14:29 PM): good, so go give it a shot
Jesse Neubauer (3:14:34 PM): I have, they help
Tossmann (3:14:40 PM): the PORCUPINE
Jesse Neubauer (3:14:42 PM): they're a little cumbersome, though
Tossmann (3:14:48 PM): well then you need practice
Jesse Neubauer (3:14:55 PM): if it turns out well, will you buy it? :-D
Tossmann (3:15:11 PM): no, I was just suggesting something that I thought perhaps you haven't tried
Tossmann (3:15:35 PM): what I've been trying to say this whole time is that using materials for practice is not a waste.
Jesse Neubauer (3:15:51 PM): but what happens when my room is full of things that nobody wants?
Tossmann (3:15:59 PM): throw them a way
Jesse Neubauer (3:16:03 PM): eepers
Tossmann (3:16:03 PM): take them apart
Tossmann (3:16:08 PM): practice with that stuff
Jesse Neubauer (3:16:28 PM): I think I'm much too product-oriented for that
Jesse Neubauer (3:16:42 PM): I get attached to them when they're done
Jesse Neubauer (3:16:54 PM): a lady bought a little godzilla once just so she could stomp on it
Jesse Neubauer (3:17:01 PM): she gave it back, all crumpled to smithereens
Jesse Neubauer (3:17:08 PM): I fixed him up and gave him to a good home
Tossmann (3:17:27 PM): Should have sold it as it was, called it "Tokyo's Revenge."
Tossmann (3:17:42 PM): You need to start thinking outside the box, kiddo.
Tossmann (3:17:45 PM): you are forever trapped in there.
Jesse Neubauer (3:17:47 PM): 'xcept nobody's gonna want a little crumpled up thing
Tossmann (3:17:55 PM): how do you know that?
Tossmann (3:18:00 PM): people buy Jackson Pollock
Jesse Neubauer (3:18:11 PM): his stuff is pretty, at least
Tossmann (3:18:14 PM): people buy pre-ripped jeans.
Tossmann (3:18:15 PM): I don't think so.
Jesse Neubauer (3:18:19 PM): he was what, the founding father of impressionism?
Tossmann (3:18:25 PM): no.
Tossmann (3:18:34 PM): impressionists were about a hundred years before him.
Jesse Neubauer (3:18:43 PM): well gosh, what was it called...
Tossmann (3:18:51 PM): expressionism
Jesse Neubauer (3:18:58 PM): that's the one
Jesse Neubauer (3:19:08 PM): but if someone took a knife to one of his pieces and ripped it to shreds, nobody would buy that
Tossmann (3:19:26 PM): They'd arrest whoever did it, and try to restore it
Jesse Neubauer (3:19:29 PM): right
Tossmann (3:19:31 PM): but again, you don't know that.
Jesse Neubauer (3:19:32 PM): that's all I was doing
Tossmann (3:19:37 PM): remember the deconstructivists??
Jesse Neubauer (3:19:45 PM): don't think I got to them
Jesse Neubauer (3:19:58 PM): all I can think of is ready-made stuff but I don't think that's what you mean
Tossmann (3:21:00 PM): well, it doesn't matter
Tossmann (3:21:09 PM): what matters is that you're thinking in a one-track way
Tossmann (3:21:21 PM): I think you need some hallucinogens.
Jesse Neubauer (3:21:26 PM): possibly
Tossmann (3:21:26 PM): that might loosen you up
Jesse Neubauer (3:21:40 PM): but then I'd come to my senses and realize what a terrible idea I just had
Tossmann (3:21:57 PM): what makes a terrible idea?
Jesse Neubauer (3:22:05 PM): if it doesn't make sense to anyone else
Tossmann (3:22:20 PM): but what if in the process, you found something really cool that would?
Jesse Neubauer (3:22:40 PM): you've lost me a bit
Tossmann (3:22:55 PM): You're a kid, and you're learning to ride a bike.
Tossmann (3:23:04 PM): You squeeze the break on your handle bars
Tossmann (3:23:09 PM): the bike stops, and you take a nose dive.
Tossmann (3:23:11 PM): you get hurt
Tossmann (3:23:15 PM): but what happens?
Tossmann (3:23:21 PM): you learn not to squeeze that hard.
Tossmann (3:23:41 PM): Do you see what I'm getting at?
Jesse Neubauer (3:23:43 PM): now I'm not sure how that applies
Tossmann (3:23:58 PM): you are the most literal thinker I've ever met.
Jesse Neubauer (3:24:01 PM): yep
Jesse Neubauer (3:24:10 PM): I might have been watching too much Bones lately
Tossmann (3:24:14 PM): you learn from mistakes, or "terrible ideas."
Tossmann (3:24:24 PM): as long as you're learning, it's worth it.
Jesse Neubauer (3:24:50 PM): but what do you do once you know how to ride a bike?
Tossmann (3:25:53 PM): ride it on new terrain
Tossmann (3:25:56 PM): ride a tandem bike
Tossmann (3:25:59 PM): ride a unicycle
Tossmann (3:26:09 PM): ride it off a ramp
Tossmann (3:26:10 PM): do a wheelie
Jesse Neubauer (3:26:30 PM): I don't know what the new terrain is
Jesse Neubauer (3:26:52 PM): there's nobody that's done this before, who can tell me what I need to learn next
Jesse Neubauer (3:27:00 PM): or what else there is
Tossmann (3:27:11 PM): You have to figure it out FOR YOURSELF.
Jesse Neubauer (3:27:18 PM): I don't know howwww D:
Tossmann (3:27:29 PM): I don't understand.
Tossmann (3:27:30 PM): at all
Tossmann (3:27:48 PM): you've never tried something that you've not heard someone else did?
Jesse Neubauer (3:27:55 PM): that's what I'm doing now
Jesse Neubauer (3:28:01 PM): but I can't think of anything else
Tossmann (3:28:12 PM): what do you mean?
Jesse Neubauer (3:28:29 PM): I mean, I've got the basic mechanics in my head
Jesse Neubauer (3:28:34 PM): they can be adapted to any situation
Jesse Neubauer (3:28:38 PM): what else is there?
Tossmann (3:29:07 PM): make a solid sculpture
Tossmann (3:29:16 PM): make little pipey bricks and build new stuff.
Tossmann (3:29:21 PM): there are ENDLESS possibilities.
Tossmann (3:29:26 PM): if you think you've got it all, you've limited yourself.
Tossmann (3:29:30 PM): beyond measure.
Jesse Neubauer (3:30:06 PM): I guess I don't see the point of bricks?
Tossmann (3:30:17 PM): trying something new
Tossmann (3:30:20 PM): and with that
Tossmann (3:30:23 PM): I'm leaving.
Jesse Neubauer (3:30:25 PM): mmkay
Jesse Neubauer (3:30:31 PM): at least I cured your boredom, I hope
Tossmann (3:31:15 PM): got me flustered is what you did.
Tossmann (3:31:23 PM): later
Jesse Neubauer (3:31:25 PM): toodles