first times, angst, Justin Timberlake (well, no, not really)
resonant8 posted about liking first-time stories and feeling cheated if the story doesn't clearly signal whether it's first-time or established relationship until halfway into the sex scene or something, and marycrawford made a post to herc_iolaus about the Hercules/Iolaus relationship and how that pairing isn't very first-time-y in nature, and how to work in the whole yes-they-have/no-they-haven't in a story about two people who act married anyway. It made me think about a conversation on SlashPoint many years ago (SP was a mailing list for general slash conversation, and I think this conversation took place back in 1996 or 1997), where it was suggested that a slash story must focus on the relationship, otherwise it's just an action-adventure story with sex scenes, and that first-time stories were easier to construct because they had an obvious goal/ending.
I've had that discussion in the back of my mind for a long time (obviously). I like first-time stories. Really a lot. I also like extended first times, by which I mean the set-up where you get the first realization of interest, the first rush of desire, the first kiss, the first sex act of choice (and then the second, and so on, and really this can be drawn out forever, with the first time A gives B a handjob and the first time B gives A a handjob and the first time A gives B a blowjob and... well, you get the picture, all the way to the rimming and anal penetration and possibly even toys), the first realization of love, the first declaration of love, and so on. (Individual order may vary by pairing. Contents may have settled during shipping. May contain traces of peanuts.)
That's an outline of a ten-story series, right there, but what I mean is that any of those events can be written in a way that imbues them with that first-time significance (it might be harder to sustain the same sense of breathless anticipation all through the ten stories). I think for me it's about a certain charge, a feeling that something about the relationship is important and up in the air and constantly on the characters' minds and needs to be dealt with, whether or not it's the main plot element, and whether or not they've had sex before. I'm very drawn to first-time stories, but a story doesn't have to be about the literal first time for a pairing in order to have that charge, that tension, which pretty much defines the appeal of slash for me.
(Of course, the corollary of that is that I also think a story can contain a literal first-time scene and not be a first-time story. In my head, Meet Another is gen. Okay, that might be stretching it. Isn't slash. And possibly what it is, is an action-adventure story with sex scenes, now that I think about it.)
destina commented that snark doesn't draw her to a pairing, but angst does, which leads me to conclude that we are matter and antimatter and should probably never meet because the universe will explode (implode?), which would be unfortunate. My own teeny tiny epiphany in conversation with elynross was that you really cannot sell me on a show, character, or pairing by saying that there's angst. I don't care. Make me like them, with the humor and the witty banter and the interestingness, and then they can angst, if they feel like it; so many of my favorite fannish ohmygod moments involve beloved characters in pain or about to be in pain (Giles walking up the stairs, Fraser at the window), but those moments only grab me by the throat because I already feel connected; I can't start there.
And now I have to work out a clever solution to the problem of meeting destina. Where's a snarky astrophysicist when you really need him?
I have all these vague thoughts about clams, curmudgeons, honorable stoics, repressed characters, and Justin Timberlake, but I can't make them fit together. I blame Justin, downfall of Western civilization and corrupter of thought processes.
I've had that discussion in the back of my mind for a long time (obviously). I like first-time stories. Really a lot. I also like extended first times, by which I mean the set-up where you get the first realization of interest, the first rush of desire, the first kiss, the first sex act of choice (and then the second, and so on, and really this can be drawn out forever, with the first time A gives B a handjob and the first time B gives A a handjob and the first time A gives B a blowjob and... well, you get the picture, all the way to the rimming and anal penetration and possibly even toys), the first realization of love, the first declaration of love, and so on. (Individual order may vary by pairing. Contents may have settled during shipping. May contain traces of peanuts.)
That's an outline of a ten-story series, right there, but what I mean is that any of those events can be written in a way that imbues them with that first-time significance (it might be harder to sustain the same sense of breathless anticipation all through the ten stories). I think for me it's about a certain charge, a feeling that something about the relationship is important and up in the air and constantly on the characters' minds and needs to be dealt with, whether or not it's the main plot element, and whether or not they've had sex before. I'm very drawn to first-time stories, but a story doesn't have to be about the literal first time for a pairing in order to have that charge, that tension, which pretty much defines the appeal of slash for me.
(Of course, the corollary of that is that I also think a story can contain a literal first-time scene and not be a first-time story. In my head, Meet Another is gen. Okay, that might be stretching it. Isn't slash. And possibly what it is, is an action-adventure story with sex scenes, now that I think about it.)
destina commented that snark doesn't draw her to a pairing, but angst does, which leads me to conclude that we are matter and antimatter and should probably never meet because the universe will explode (implode?), which would be unfortunate. My own teeny tiny epiphany in conversation with elynross was that you really cannot sell me on a show, character, or pairing by saying that there's angst. I don't care. Make me like them, with the humor and the witty banter and the interestingness, and then they can angst, if they feel like it; so many of my favorite fannish ohmygod moments involve beloved characters in pain or about to be in pain (Giles walking up the stairs, Fraser at the window), but those moments only grab me by the throat because I already feel connected; I can't start there.
And now I have to work out a clever solution to the problem of meeting destina. Where's a snarky astrophysicist when you really need him?
I have all these vague thoughts about clams, curmudgeons, honorable stoics, repressed characters, and Justin Timberlake, but I can't make them fit together. I blame Justin, downfall of Western civilization and corrupter of thought processes.