Meta: Jack/Ianto and Lurve, that old chestnut.
Notes: There may be bits of this that aren't 100% serious, I hope they are obvious. As to canon, I am counting all the television episodes, and the radio plays, not the books and other media. (I think the books get a little confusing and I know some people don't count them, so I won't) I also am well aware that the plays were written after CoE, but clearly set before, and yes, it seems written with some foreshadowing in mind.
I felt inspired to think about this by GDL's answers to questions at recent cons. Firstly his comment that "Ianto taught Jack about love" Also that whilst he fought to not have Jack say "I love you" in the final conversation (Well final for now), he felt that Jack did absolutely love Ianto. Then this weekend at the Welsh con, he was asked why Jack had been dismissive and said he hated the word couple. GDL replied that Jack was realising that he was in love with Ianto, and not coping well, trying to resist it.
Now of course some fans have said they hated those answers. Well fine, but one thing that strikes me about GDL, he isn't disingenuous, he gives thoughtful answers and this is how he interpreted his work. Good for him. Also I think there is a lot of support for this from the pre CoE interviews. Whether we think the writing and direction showed it or not, clearly someone thought this was a love story. Euros Lynne said this, and as the director, this is the vision that would be worked on with the actors. I have to say after seeing him interviewed I was almost worried the J/I love story would be too much, so yes, this is what he intended.
As to how I find them in canon. Well I think they are sweet. Really. I liked them in S1 and admit to being so lukewarm toward the first ep that I watched purely for the UST between J/I. Then ep 2 I didn't even like, but tuned in to ep 3 still for the UST. Ep 3 I felt more interest, then Cyberwoman had me hooked. I was happy with the background way they let it develop. Then KKBB. Jack's declaration that he has been thinking about things, and wants to ask Ianto out. Jack wants to take it further. In KKBB we can see the beginnings of what GDL means, In what way Jack may be taught about love. Ianto shows Jack unconditional love. We see him being a little jealous of John, and of the doctor, but he is genuinely glad to have Jack back. The others grouse a bit, not Ianto, he is just happy. When he expresses it in that episode, both to the team and to Jack, he is completely without guile. This loyalty and support are played out all the way through, even into CoE.
A really important aspect of loving someone unconditionally is accepting them for what they are. It's one thing Ianto does in spades. He is very realistic about Jack. The one person he seems to have shared this with is Gwen. Clearly they have gossiped about Jack to an extent. The scene in Sleeper about Jack having bad manners in bed suggests that, but also illustrates that Ianto doesn't mind, he just likes to tease.(I won't deny that his comment could be read as slightly possessive) My absolute favourite exchange between Gwen and Ianto is in The Golden Age:
The Duchess is shooting at Jack;
Ianto: "Hasn't seen him for 80 years, starts shooting at him"
Gwen "mmm, ex?"
Ianto "yep"
Also in The Dead Line, Rhys and Gwen are supportive of Ianto's need to stay at Jack's bedside. Ianto is very distressed as this isn't like a "death" for Jack, the possibilities are worse. Rhys insists on helping Gwen out so Ianto doesn't have to leave Jack. Not only does this lead to some classic Rhys/Gwen scenes, it is them taking the relationship seriously, there is no suggestion that it is casual, or that they don't love each other.
Now I don't really understand where some of the "couple" conversation came from in CoE, and as I have already re written it in my last meta, I won't again! I do think that The Dead Line plays on some insecurities that Ianto has about Jack being immortal, and probably leaving, but not about the "status" of their relationship.
Oh God, that's it. Ianto needed to update his Facebook status. He needed to know, he wanted to put "In a relationship with Captain Jack Harkness" Shame he didn't ever get the chance.
If they intended to show us a love story, clearly not like Ryan O'Neal and Ali McGraw, but within the confines of what we were given, I do think there would have been ways to show it. You can have Jack tell Ianto he loves him, it is possible without us gagging. There is the approach where Ianto says it for him:
Ianto, very poorly, on his last legs, "Jack, if only you'd bought me a pony, you know how much I love you, and thank you for loving me"
Jack "Oh you are very welcome Ianto Jones"
(By the way, I know that Jack does make it clear how he feels in that scene, offering to kill all the children in the world in return for Ianto is a pretty strong message, but I like my way better.)
Or you could have had Jack say it, earlier, when Ianto takes Jack aside,
Ianto "Why didn't you tell me about this, I could have helped, it must have been awful for you all these years. I tell you everything"
Jack "I know you do, but it's too much Ianto, I worry that if you knew everything, you might not love me quite so much."
Ianto "You must know by now that won't happen. I know I can only ever scratch the surface, and I've never pushed you to tell me anything. Let me help, I must be able to find something we can do, with 40 years of databases to hack into"
Jack: "Thank you, you have never pushed me, and I love you for it. I have to go and make a phone call, they're holding some of my family, I have a daughter, and a grandson and I need you to know"
Ianto, hugs Jack like a lover, not like a soldier, "I'll go and see what I can do"
I don't like overly smushy dialogue. Declarations of love are of course the death of a relationship, or a character. I prefer them not to happen. If they need to though, I do think it can work in this "show not tell" way. Where the words are just there as part of a conversation. In fact it was done really well in To the Last Man
This is really just my tuppence worth of thoughts. I could very easily write about a million words analysing every gesture and word that supports my feelings about this. So yes, tell me if you want me to. Then everyone would be as brown bread as poor Ianto, from sheer boredom, including myself.
I felt inspired to think about this by GDL's answers to questions at recent cons. Firstly his comment that "Ianto taught Jack about love" Also that whilst he fought to not have Jack say "I love you" in the final conversation (Well final for now), he felt that Jack did absolutely love Ianto. Then this weekend at the Welsh con, he was asked why Jack had been dismissive and said he hated the word couple. GDL replied that Jack was realising that he was in love with Ianto, and not coping well, trying to resist it.
Now of course some fans have said they hated those answers. Well fine, but one thing that strikes me about GDL, he isn't disingenuous, he gives thoughtful answers and this is how he interpreted his work. Good for him. Also I think there is a lot of support for this from the pre CoE interviews. Whether we think the writing and direction showed it or not, clearly someone thought this was a love story. Euros Lynne said this, and as the director, this is the vision that would be worked on with the actors. I have to say after seeing him interviewed I was almost worried the J/I love story would be too much, so yes, this is what he intended.
As to how I find them in canon. Well I think they are sweet. Really. I liked them in S1 and admit to being so lukewarm toward the first ep that I watched purely for the UST between J/I. Then ep 2 I didn't even like, but tuned in to ep 3 still for the UST. Ep 3 I felt more interest, then Cyberwoman had me hooked. I was happy with the background way they let it develop. Then KKBB. Jack's declaration that he has been thinking about things, and wants to ask Ianto out. Jack wants to take it further. In KKBB we can see the beginnings of what GDL means, In what way Jack may be taught about love. Ianto shows Jack unconditional love. We see him being a little jealous of John, and of the doctor, but he is genuinely glad to have Jack back. The others grouse a bit, not Ianto, he is just happy. When he expresses it in that episode, both to the team and to Jack, he is completely without guile. This loyalty and support are played out all the way through, even into CoE.
A really important aspect of loving someone unconditionally is accepting them for what they are. It's one thing Ianto does in spades. He is very realistic about Jack. The one person he seems to have shared this with is Gwen. Clearly they have gossiped about Jack to an extent. The scene in Sleeper about Jack having bad manners in bed suggests that, but also illustrates that Ianto doesn't mind, he just likes to tease.(I won't deny that his comment could be read as slightly possessive) My absolute favourite exchange between Gwen and Ianto is in The Golden Age:
The Duchess is shooting at Jack;
Ianto: "Hasn't seen him for 80 years, starts shooting at him"
Gwen "mmm, ex?"
Ianto "yep"
Also in The Dead Line, Rhys and Gwen are supportive of Ianto's need to stay at Jack's bedside. Ianto is very distressed as this isn't like a "death" for Jack, the possibilities are worse. Rhys insists on helping Gwen out so Ianto doesn't have to leave Jack. Not only does this lead to some classic Rhys/Gwen scenes, it is them taking the relationship seriously, there is no suggestion that it is casual, or that they don't love each other.
Now I don't really understand where some of the "couple" conversation came from in CoE, and as I have already re written it in my last meta, I won't again! I do think that The Dead Line plays on some insecurities that Ianto has about Jack being immortal, and probably leaving, but not about the "status" of their relationship.
Oh God, that's it. Ianto needed to update his Facebook status. He needed to know, he wanted to put "In a relationship with Captain Jack Harkness" Shame he didn't ever get the chance.
If they intended to show us a love story, clearly not like Ryan O'Neal and Ali McGraw, but within the confines of what we were given, I do think there would have been ways to show it. You can have Jack tell Ianto he loves him, it is possible without us gagging. There is the approach where Ianto says it for him:
Ianto, very poorly, on his last legs, "Jack, if only you'd bought me a pony, you know how much I love you, and thank you for loving me"
Jack "Oh you are very welcome Ianto Jones"
(By the way, I know that Jack does make it clear how he feels in that scene, offering to kill all the children in the world in return for Ianto is a pretty strong message, but I like my way better.)
Or you could have had Jack say it, earlier, when Ianto takes Jack aside,
Ianto "Why didn't you tell me about this, I could have helped, it must have been awful for you all these years. I tell you everything"
Jack "I know you do, but it's too much Ianto, I worry that if you knew everything, you might not love me quite so much."
Ianto "You must know by now that won't happen. I know I can only ever scratch the surface, and I've never pushed you to tell me anything. Let me help, I must be able to find something we can do, with 40 years of databases to hack into"
Jack: "Thank you, you have never pushed me, and I love you for it. I have to go and make a phone call, they're holding some of my family, I have a daughter, and a grandson and I need you to know"
Ianto, hugs Jack like a lover, not like a soldier, "I'll go and see what I can do"
I don't like overly smushy dialogue. Declarations of love are of course the death of a relationship, or a character. I prefer them not to happen. If they need to though, I do think it can work in this "show not tell" way. Where the words are just there as part of a conversation. In fact it was done really well in To the Last Man
This is really just my tuppence worth of thoughts. I could very easily write about a million words analysing every gesture and word that supports my feelings about this. So yes, tell me if you want me to. Then everyone would be as brown bread as poor Ianto, from sheer boredom, including myself.