French Ban on Public Muslim Prayer - Practical Reasons?
There are two sides to every story, but sometimes one of those sides is mainly BS.
With the recent story about France banning Muslim prayer my first reaction was that it was absurd. But then I thought about it...
Sometimes people follow a particular route legally because it's an easier way to solve an issue. For example, if a particular area has a lot of drunken violence, the solution may be to limit the availability of late night drinking in the area. Pubs and bars might get upset because it isn't the simple selling of drink that caused the problem, but the fact is that limiting the movement and providing extra policing is a logistical nightmare whereas limiting the availability of alcohol in the area will provide a similar, or even better, resolution to the issue.
So what's the practical issue that might be invovled with Muslim prayer? Well, it happens five times a day and here's an example of what's been happening due to insufficient space in a mosque:
The no entry sign makes clear that they are doing this in the road. As such, it's no inconceivable that, at some time during the five occasions each day, five days a week, someone might be inconvenienced. It also might not be considered entirely helpful by local shop owners to have a crowd of men bent over outside several times each day.
So why didn't the legislation reflect this? Well, I'll start off by admitting that I'm no law expert. However, I can imagine that finding specific people inconvenienced might make for a pretty flimsy case. With each case being judged in isolation, it would be unlikely to tackle the overall difficulty. Naturally you are on a slippery slope making laws against spending too long in the middle of the road. People inevitably have to cross the road on foot and sometimes getting out of the road isn't all that easy (such as if you've been hit by a car).
So perhaps this is just a reasonable request by local shop owners and road users to deal with what they see as a rather absurd state of affairs?
Well....
First of all, if that was the case, it's credibility is not helped by websites making comments like this.
Hey France - How you like all those Mohammedans and their enormous families you let in? Great, huh? They sure do assimilate! I guess it'll be less than a century before your country is France-istan!
(horrible link)
get the flame throwers out, burn the stinkin murdering bastards while praying all at once - besides the prayer is all about death to the infidels anyway - give the rat a BBQ , allbeit rotten
(horrible link)
Would Christians be allowed to pray in the strrets of a MUSLIM Country?VIVA LA FRANCE.If Muslims don't like the LAWS in FRANCE. LEAVE
(fairly horrible link - Daily Fail)
ALL muslims that come on the streets to pray should be considered as a provocation to French society and we should deport them each back to their rat infested hell hole countries. LEAVE OUR BEAUTIFUL COUNTRIES ALONE AND GO BACK TO YOUR RAT INFESTED BREEDING GROUNDS, you losers...
(nice link but horrible comment)
In fact it's been rather difficult to find a view in support of this ban that doesn't sound like it comes from a member of Stormfront.
Then there's a few other points to note:
1) The ban appears to have come at short notice, suggesting a lack of engagement with the Muslim community on the issue.
“We didn't receive any letters. We negotiated with the Paris Govenor's Office before June. But we didn't know that the ban would be put into effect this soon,” Mohamed Salah Hamza said, adding that most Muslims in France still do not know that they are not supposed to pray on the street ahead of this week's Friday prayer. He underscored that Muslims do not want to pray on streets and have demanded larger mosques.
(link)
2) Barriers have been put in place to prevent Muslims from building places of worship to cater for their membership.
French politicians use the country’s 1905 secularism law as reasoning why Muslims cannot be financially assisted by the government to build mosques. Right-wing mayors also allegedly refuse issuing construction permits to those who have the money.
(link)
Then finally and most importantly:
3) The French Muslim population keep bending over backwards to avoid a conflict. When Islamic dress (and, in the case of Christianity, "large crosses" *facepalm*) was banned from schools, Muslims had a hotline people could call if they were worried. They were reminded that following the law on the land was an important requirement for Muslims. Now that the nikab has been banned there hasn't been a violent backlash against that either. Now there's an effort to shove all the local Muslims into a disused fire station and make them pay a hefty sum for the privilege (with that space only available on Fridays) and the response has been (I kid you not) for the Imam to welcome people of all faiths.
“I can say that all prayers outside the mosques are over. We have undertaken a commitment to the authorities that prayers in the streets are over, and that this room is open to everyone without excluding anybody from other religions,” said a local imam, Mohamed Saleh Hamza.
(link)
Yes, Muslims are the only ones being banned from public prayer, but they happy to make their new private space a multi-faith zone. Now that's how you highlight injustice. Not integrating properly? Then how come they are sharing their worship space with non-Muslims in their community?
Meanwhile far-right French politician Le Pen has described Muslim prayers in the streets as "an occupation". A term which suggests that he is comparing it to the Nazi occupation during the Second World War. Overreacting much?
(Main Source: EuroNews)
Muslims using the new space provided after the recent French ban on Muslim prayer.
With the recent story about France banning Muslim prayer my first reaction was that it was absurd. But then I thought about it...
Sometimes people follow a particular route legally because it's an easier way to solve an issue. For example, if a particular area has a lot of drunken violence, the solution may be to limit the availability of late night drinking in the area. Pubs and bars might get upset because it isn't the simple selling of drink that caused the problem, but the fact is that limiting the movement and providing extra policing is a logistical nightmare whereas limiting the availability of alcohol in the area will provide a similar, or even better, resolution to the issue.
So what's the practical issue that might be invovled with Muslim prayer? Well, it happens five times a day and here's an example of what's been happening due to insufficient space in a mosque:
The no entry sign makes clear that they are doing this in the road. As such, it's no inconceivable that, at some time during the five occasions each day, five days a week, someone might be inconvenienced. It also might not be considered entirely helpful by local shop owners to have a crowd of men bent over outside several times each day.
So why didn't the legislation reflect this? Well, I'll start off by admitting that I'm no law expert. However, I can imagine that finding specific people inconvenienced might make for a pretty flimsy case. With each case being judged in isolation, it would be unlikely to tackle the overall difficulty. Naturally you are on a slippery slope making laws against spending too long in the middle of the road. People inevitably have to cross the road on foot and sometimes getting out of the road isn't all that easy (such as if you've been hit by a car).
So perhaps this is just a reasonable request by local shop owners and road users to deal with what they see as a rather absurd state of affairs?
Well....
First of all, if that was the case, it's credibility is not helped by websites making comments like this.
Hey France - How you like all those Mohammedans and their enormous families you let in? Great, huh? They sure do assimilate! I guess it'll be less than a century before your country is France-istan!
(horrible link)
get the flame throwers out, burn the stinkin murdering bastards while praying all at once - besides the prayer is all about death to the infidels anyway - give the rat a BBQ , allbeit rotten
(horrible link)
Would Christians be allowed to pray in the strrets of a MUSLIM Country?VIVA LA FRANCE.If Muslims don't like the LAWS in FRANCE. LEAVE
(fairly horrible link - Daily Fail)
ALL muslims that come on the streets to pray should be considered as a provocation to French society and we should deport them each back to their rat infested hell hole countries. LEAVE OUR BEAUTIFUL COUNTRIES ALONE AND GO BACK TO YOUR RAT INFESTED BREEDING GROUNDS, you losers...
(nice link but horrible comment)
In fact it's been rather difficult to find a view in support of this ban that doesn't sound like it comes from a member of Stormfront.
Then there's a few other points to note:
1) The ban appears to have come at short notice, suggesting a lack of engagement with the Muslim community on the issue.
“We didn't receive any letters. We negotiated with the Paris Govenor's Office before June. But we didn't know that the ban would be put into effect this soon,” Mohamed Salah Hamza said, adding that most Muslims in France still do not know that they are not supposed to pray on the street ahead of this week's Friday prayer. He underscored that Muslims do not want to pray on streets and have demanded larger mosques.
(link)
2) Barriers have been put in place to prevent Muslims from building places of worship to cater for their membership.
French politicians use the country’s 1905 secularism law as reasoning why Muslims cannot be financially assisted by the government to build mosques. Right-wing mayors also allegedly refuse issuing construction permits to those who have the money.
(link)
Then finally and most importantly:
3) The French Muslim population keep bending over backwards to avoid a conflict. When Islamic dress (and, in the case of Christianity, "large crosses" *facepalm*) was banned from schools, Muslims had a hotline people could call if they were worried. They were reminded that following the law on the land was an important requirement for Muslims. Now that the nikab has been banned there hasn't been a violent backlash against that either. Now there's an effort to shove all the local Muslims into a disused fire station and make them pay a hefty sum for the privilege (with that space only available on Fridays) and the response has been (I kid you not) for the Imam to welcome people of all faiths.
“I can say that all prayers outside the mosques are over. We have undertaken a commitment to the authorities that prayers in the streets are over, and that this room is open to everyone without excluding anybody from other religions,” said a local imam, Mohamed Saleh Hamza.
(link)
Yes, Muslims are the only ones being banned from public prayer, but they happy to make their new private space a multi-faith zone. Now that's how you highlight injustice. Not integrating properly? Then how come they are sharing their worship space with non-Muslims in their community?
Meanwhile far-right French politician Le Pen has described Muslim prayers in the streets as "an occupation". A term which suggests that he is comparing it to the Nazi occupation during the Second World War. Overreacting much?
(Main Source: EuroNews)
Muslims using the new space provided after the recent French ban on Muslim prayer.