What are the similarities and differences between fanfic and other similar communities?

[alias_sqbr]

Partly as a result of reading cupidsbow's essay on Why Fanfic makes us poor, I have been pondering the similarities and differences between fanfic and other creative groups. I'm involved in a couple myself and apart from a few references here and there in other discussions noone seems to be exploring the comparisons in much depth

Comments

[ginalin]

I happen to know quite a few male fanfiction writers. I think female writers are still the majority, but I keep running into more and more men who write fanfiction.
Particularly gay men who are writing male/male fanfiction. I think that goes directly to one of the reasons fanfiction exists, though. If you can't find what you're looking for in mainstream fiction or in the sources you're deriving your fanfiction from, you tend to want to write it yourself.
There seems to be a dearth of good romantic/erotic male/male professional fiction out there; compared to other genres, anyway.

[alias_sqbr]

Crap. I was pondering this post this morning before checking my email and thought "Argh, forgot to add the thing about male fanfic writers, what's the bet that's the first response I get" *rolls eyes at self*

I am actually quite interested in their POV, especially the way guys view slash. As well as gay guys reading/writing m/m you also have straight ones reading/writing f/f. And lots of lesbians writing m/m etc and so on ...so it ties in interestingly with both gender and sexuality.

[ginalin]

I'm married to a guy who although obviously straight (well, straight enough), loves to watch Stargate SGA and "sees slash" between some of the characters.
It makes it a lot of fun to watch the series with him, but it actually got me reading SGA slash. (I write slash in other fandoms, or did, but not that particular one.)
I know one straight writer who writes m/m, simply because he sees it between two characters in HP.
Apparently, gay fiction is still in the dark ages in professional fiction except for a very few writers (and some of that follows the old formula that gay people can't be presented in fiction as a protagonist or someone who isn't "odd" or stereotypical)so a lot of people still find fanfiction is the only genre that presents gay people in a satisfactory way.
Although obviously, fanfiction has it's own genre oddities, such as "chicks with dicks" and other slightly warped gender roles or the ever popular "We're only gay for each other" scenario.

[alias_sqbr]

Heh. See my husband tends to be rather anti slash and I keep pointing out examples and he's all "Ok, yes, they're slashy, but in general...". I think I'm wearing him down :)

I think it's definitely true that there's a remarkable variety of types of fanfic witers as well as reasons for reading and writing what they do. The recent kerfuffle over gen showed that people read and write that for lots of reasons too, and I think with slash this is even more true. But it's human nature to make assumptions and try to pigeonhole people.

[sidewinder]

Goodness, yes.

And also, some technique/craft-discussion type communities for it, especially for traditional methods (most of the discussion/how-to I see is for artists working in digital mediums.)

[alias_sqbr]

Glad to know I was right about something :)

Is it just me or is fanart not taken as seriously, is done mainly for the joy of it with less of a culture of deep analysis and complex themes etc? (Obviously a lot of fanfic works this way too, but there's a subset of writers and meta-ers who see it as Serious Stuff)

I mean that's certainly been my approach when I've drawn fanart myself, I put my Big Art Ideas (such as they are) into my original stuff.

[peasant_]

Are there communities of women writing non-fanfic porn together?

Oh yes. They even call themselves 'slashers' when it is m/m. 'Original slash' is a fairly common genre. The communities behave in exactly the same way as fandom based writers, with all he conventions of betas, feedback, mailing lists etc. they just write original characters.

[alias_sqbr]

Are all all ex-slashers doing original slash on the side, or is it a separate but related community with it's own momentum and history? I suppose yoai fits that description *realises I was going to do a bit about non-western fandom and forgot. Crud*

[peasant_]

Of the ones I know (hardly a proper sample!) there are some ex-fandom folk but also many who have never written anything except original stuff and who often view fanfic with the same disapproval as the general population. They are frequently unaware of what they owe to fanfic in terms of terminology and culture. I don't know enough about their history to know the true origins of the communities themselves, but I suspect there has always been a lot of cross-pollination between them and fanfic. I think most amateur writers online will sooner or later try both fanfic and original fic.

[alias_sqbr]

Well that's interesting then. I wonder how they compare to fanfic slashers and writers of original non-porn, and which group they resemble more. As you point out, these groups all overlap and blur but there's definitely subcommunities with their own expectations and cultures.

[rez_lo]

(reposted to fix the coding)

You might want to read cesperanza's essay on the question of legality, here.

I don't see a lot of essays discussing, say, vids in the context of modern cinema or the postmodern symbolism of photo manips.But most of the meta about fannish activity, of which fic is the biggest, doesn't address it in the context of modern literature, either, does it? Not the meta I read, at any rate. It's more about the subculture represented by writers and readers of fanfic and how that plays both for and against the cultural production/consumption of popular narratives. Where content is considered, it's usually against the backdrop of cultural narratives, at least implicitly, it seems to me

[yourlibrarian]

In rather ironic timing, apparently copyright is in the news again. A proposal called the Intellectual Property Protection Act of 2007 would:

Criminalize "attempting" to infringe copyright. Federal law currently punishes not-for-profit copyright infringement with between 1 and 10 years in prison, but there has to be actual infringement that takes place. The IPPA would eliminate that requirement and Increase penalties for violating the Digital Millennium Copyright Act's anticircumvention regulations. Criminal violations are currently punished by jail times of up to 10 years and fines of up to $1 million. The IPPA would add forfeiture penalties.

[alias_sqbr]

Guh! Argh! And I can't even say "Oh well, not my country, not my problem" since the australian government has shown itself entirely willing to extradite australian citizens to america for breaches of your copyright law. It just means my vote counts for even less towards changing the law than the average americans *mutters*

[yourlibrarian]

since the australian government has shown itself entirely willing to
extradite australian citizens to america for breaches of your copyright
law.

I'm glad you mentioned this as I'd been wondering if part of this law wasn't being geared towards non-Americans.

[blackjackrocket]

Well, the "Illegal/Grey Area" thing varies from country to country, I think. And even then it seems to be contradictory in places. Like how doujinshi is sold openly in Japan, yet there's that case a few years ago of someone being hauled off to jail for a Pokemon dj (How did that end, anyway? I'm even IN the fandom and I haven't heard about it in years).

[alias_sqbr]

Yes, I think fanfic is definitely in one of those annoying spaces between what the law says and what the law does. I keep hoping copyright law (everywhere, but especially in america since it's american companies who own most of the IP) will be made less restricitive and more consistent, so everyone knows where they stand and is in a position to openly celebrate all the great derivative creativity out there, but I'm not holding my breath.