Honestly, I don't get that series. I don't understand the mythology nor why Caleb who had all of one mention to my knowledge in canon is such a major player - and Dean's "big brother" at that. Dean having an older brother removes a major aspect of his characterization, IMHO - it takes away Dean's whole protector gig. While that can be fun to play with in the context of AUs where Sam and Dean switch ages, it doesn't work for me if there's a third party being introduced. I think I remember being annoyed at the extreme dirth of female characters in that AU as well - even canon has some girls hanging around.
All in all, I'll take canon over it any day. But if you like it, then that's awesome. There are series where I vastly prefer AUs over canon - HP is a big one in my mind for that same reason. There's a reason why "Drop Dead Gorgeous" is my preferred epilogue over what we actually got. Harry and Draco being snarky auror partners and actually learning over time how to deal with one another? Do want!
The only thing that amuses me about this secret is that, last I knew, people had complained about that AU because they thought Sam had been sidelined in favor of the Dean and Caleb relationship. This is the first time I've ever heard someone say they liked it specifically for Sam. *g*
Harry and Draco being snarky auror partners and actually learning over time how to deal with one another? More like "ANYONE actually learning over time how to deal with one another." :| By the last book, I was fed up with a lot of House stereotyping.
Not a biological brother, but he filled that role for Dean. If I remember right (and it's been a few months so someone with a better familiarity with the series is welcome to correct me) Caleb was written as being some eight years older than Dean and they very much had a fraternal vibe, with Caleb looking out for Dean. Which really got me because the largest reason Dean is so screwed up in canon is because no one was looking out for him - he spent his entire life looking out for everyone else. If he'd had even one person put him first after age four, I doubt his self esteem issues would be as epic as they became. So yeah, the Caleb dynamic didn't work for me at all.
More like "ANYONE actually learning over time how to deal with one another." :| By the last book, I was fed up with a lot of House stereotyping.
So this. I was worried about just that in OotP but HBP gave me hope again. Sadly DH screwed that over. Argh. So much for "House Unity" - what a load of crap.
So there were no changes to Dean's characterization at all? He was still as screwed up? Obvs he would still be pretty screwed up having a horrific childhood, but as you said, not as monumental.
Which really got me because the largest reason Dean is so screwed up in canon is because no one was looking out for him - he spent his entire life looking out for everyone else. If he'd had even one person put him first after age four, I doubt his self esteem issues would be as epic as they became.
Especially for someone like Dean! D: He needs so very little, but it was such a vicious circle. Even though he WANTED like any human being, he didn't want to bring attention to himself and make things harder for his family MORE, like in After School Special. He worked at making people write him off so he could stay in the background (possibly to take better care of Sammy, or so the teachers wouldn't notice/care if he skipped a few days to join John on a hunt or something).
I like to pretend the background characters didn't give a crap to house divisions and totally hung out and dated and had study groups all the time. Especially post-war. And if a Hufflepuff met a Slytherin (or any combo of house) at work and found out they worked on the same floor they'd even say hi because it's always comforting to find out you know someone on your first day, and be chill being assigned to work together -- you know, like normal people. They'd talk sometimes about 'yeah, those ~*~main characters~*~ were heroes and all, but they were also kinda dickish don't you think?' I mean, seriously, I doubt the visiting schools (Durmstang, etc) cared about what house a student was in.
Again, it's been a while since I last read any of the stories in the series, but Dean was somewhat messed up but was comfortable with his relationship with Caleb and would call on him if he got in trouble. I think the AU started when S1 was still playing and it sort of goes off that characterization - early S1, when Dean was obviously a bit messed up but no one had any idea of exactly how messed up he was.
I think he was more messed up in that AU than I'd have anticipated if he actually had someone he could reliably count on to have his back. Then again, part of my love for Dean is because he is so hard-as-nails self-reliant, you know? And Dean having an older brother figure, even one who wasn't around all the time, disturbs that characterization. Dean was still overprotective of Sam and had self esteem issues, but he often didn't feel like Dean to me. YMMV.
I'm not honestly sure how to really describe it. The writing was good, some of the plots were actually quite interesting, but the overall point of the series didn't appeal to me. There were things beyond Dean's characterization as well - it built up this whole mythos about Hunters being something of a secret society that canon has wiped clear away and it keeps playing with Sam and Dean apparently having some major role to play in said society but they can't know those roles yet or something - it's very long series and no easy way to tell (that I can remember) what order the stories go in, so I'm probably missing a lot of it.
I did enjoy some of the individual tales, particularly those that kept the focus limited mainly on the Winchesters, but it's not my favorite Supernatural AU. (I think for that I'd have to go with the Silent But Deadly 'verse, but my favorite changes at the drop of a hat. *g*)
Especially for someone like Dean! D: He needs so very little, but it was such a vicious circle.
So this! Dean was put in a position of being the second parent at an extremely young age; John was leaving him alone for days at a time to take care of Sam at age nine. John himself admits that he put too much on Dean, though the fact that Dean figured out that his father was possessed when he praised him is another honking big clue. XD Dean says that he's uncomfortable being singled out at birthday parties but I've got to ask exactly how many parties he had. When you don't get acknowledgment and recognition like that growing up, it's extremely hard to accept as an adult - but it doesn't mean that the need for it is any less. Not so much birthday parties in specific so much as a general acknowledgment of worthiness, but still!
As for HP, I was certain of that fact during the first several books. In Quidditch matches and House Cup scenes, the whole school seemed to rally around Gryffindor but during the calmer periods, there were plenty of times that you'd see all of Hufflepuff or Ravenclaw siding with Slytherin. It made me think that there was actually a lot more going on than we were aware of and that JKR just broke out the "yay Gryffindor!" because it made it seem like everyone was happy without, you know, doing to work to write it in logically. They definitely felt like plot holes to me. Not to mention that the reason Hufflepuff and Ravenclaw wanted Slytherin to loose in the first book was because Slytherin had taken the Cup for some seven years and I'm pretty sure Gryffindor had taken it for at least six during the series itself...
And yeah, very much dickish. I like most of them, but you can't ever tell me that causing a teenage girl permanent scarring labeling her a snitch or being annoyed at getting detentions for slicing another student's chest by using an unknown dark arts spell thereby risking his life were anything but dickish moves.
I sort of like the idea of houses and almost wish my high school'd had them, but the way the rivalry played out, especially with the one dimensional characterizations of a full quarter of the school as malicious, sneaky, and generally ugly got on my nerves.
All in all, I'll take canon over it any day. But if you like it, then that's awesome. There are series where I vastly prefer AUs over canon - HP is a big one in my mind for that same reason. There's a reason why "Drop Dead Gorgeous" is my preferred epilogue over what we actually got. Harry and Draco being snarky auror partners and actually learning over time how to deal with one another? Do want!
The only thing that amuses me about this secret is that, last I knew, people had complained about that AU because they thought Sam had been sidelined in favor of the Dean and Caleb relationship. This is the first time I've ever heard someone say they liked it specifically for Sam. *g*
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Harry and Draco being snarky auror partners and actually learning over time how to deal with one another?
More like "ANYONE actually learning over time how to deal with one another." :| By the last book, I was fed up with a lot of House stereotyping.
Reply
More like "ANYONE actually learning over time how to deal with one another." :| By the last book, I was fed up with a lot of House stereotyping.
So this. I was worried about just that in OotP but HBP gave me hope again. Sadly DH screwed that over. Argh. So much for "House Unity" - what a load of crap.
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Which really got me because the largest reason Dean is so screwed up in canon is because no one was looking out for him - he spent his entire life looking out for everyone else. If he'd had even one person put him first after age four, I doubt his self esteem issues would be as epic as they became.
Especially for someone like Dean! D: He needs so very little, but it was such a vicious circle. Even though he WANTED like any human being, he didn't want to bring attention to himself and make things harder for his family MORE, like in After School Special. He worked at making people write him off so he could stay in the background (possibly to take better care of Sammy, or so the teachers wouldn't notice/care if he skipped a few days to join John on a hunt or something).
I like to pretend the background characters didn't give a crap to house divisions and totally hung out and dated and had study groups all the time. Especially post-war. And if a Hufflepuff met a Slytherin (or any combo of house) at work and found out they worked on the same floor they'd even say hi because it's always comforting to find out you know someone on your first day, and be chill being assigned to work together -- you know, like normal people. They'd talk sometimes about 'yeah, those ~*~main characters~*~ were heroes and all, but they were also kinda dickish don't you think?' I mean, seriously, I doubt the visiting schools (Durmstang, etc) cared about what house a student was in.
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I think he was more messed up in that AU than I'd have anticipated if he actually had someone he could reliably count on to have his back. Then again, part of my love for Dean is because he is so hard-as-nails self-reliant, you know? And Dean having an older brother figure, even one who wasn't around all the time, disturbs that characterization. Dean was still overprotective of Sam and had self esteem issues, but he often didn't feel like Dean to me. YMMV.
I'm not honestly sure how to really describe it. The writing was good, some of the plots were actually quite interesting, but the overall point of the series didn't appeal to me. There were things beyond Dean's characterization as well - it built up this whole mythos about Hunters being something of a secret society that canon has wiped clear away and it keeps playing with Sam and Dean apparently having some major role to play in said society but they can't know those roles yet or something - it's very long series and no easy way to tell (that I can remember) what order the stories go in, so I'm probably missing a lot of it.
I did enjoy some of the individual tales, particularly those that kept the focus limited mainly on the Winchesters, but it's not my favorite Supernatural AU. (I think for that I'd have to go with the Silent But Deadly 'verse, but my favorite changes at the drop of a hat. *g*)
Especially for someone like Dean! D: He needs so very little, but it was such a vicious circle.
So this! Dean was put in a position of being the second parent at an extremely young age; John was leaving him alone for days at a time to take care of Sam at age nine. John himself admits that he put too much on Dean, though the fact that Dean figured out that his father was possessed when he praised him is another honking big clue. XD Dean says that he's uncomfortable being singled out at birthday parties but I've got to ask exactly how many parties he had. When you don't get acknowledgment and recognition like that growing up, it's extremely hard to accept as an adult - but it doesn't mean that the need for it is any less. Not so much birthday parties in specific so much as a general acknowledgment of worthiness, but still!
As for HP, I was certain of that fact during the first several books. In Quidditch matches and House Cup scenes, the whole school seemed to rally around Gryffindor but during the calmer periods, there were plenty of times that you'd see all of Hufflepuff or Ravenclaw siding with Slytherin. It made me think that there was actually a lot more going on than we were aware of and that JKR just broke out the "yay Gryffindor!" because it made it seem like everyone was happy without, you know, doing to work to write it in logically. They definitely felt like plot holes to me. Not to mention that the reason Hufflepuff and Ravenclaw wanted Slytherin to loose in the first book was because Slytherin had taken the Cup for some seven years and I'm pretty sure Gryffindor had taken it for at least six during the series itself...
And yeah, very much dickish. I like most of them, but you can't ever tell me that causing a teenage girl permanent scarring labeling her a snitch or being annoyed at getting detentions for slicing another student's chest by using an unknown dark arts spell thereby risking his life were anything but dickish moves.
I sort of like the idea of houses and almost wish my high school'd had them, but the way the rivalry played out, especially with the one dimensional characterizations of a full quarter of the school as malicious, sneaky, and generally ugly got on my nerves.
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