Better Call Saul - You know, it's easy to forget how early in the game Walt was already manipulating Jesse and putting him in danger for the sake of money
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I love that moment in '4 Days Out' where Walt slowly sits up with his jaw hanging open and Jesse gets all excited that a stroke of scientific genius has come upon him. Walt really is Jesse's "Doctor Chemistry!" superhero in the early eps
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Yay!!! It's finally posted! I love your recaps. :) :)
Jesse rejects this proposal because "We're not killing Badger, YO!" while Walt, who's been letting Jesse do all the talking, just seems exasperated because he knows the killing Badger suggestion would be so much easier. Walt will come to see prison shankings as the obvious solution later in S5.
Great link to season 5. It's interesting to watch old episodes when you know what's going to happen in season 5. For some reason, I'm worried for Badger... with Jesse, he is Hank's only living link to Heisenberg right now. Walt could consider Badger to be another loose end that needs to be eliminated.
It's one of their greatest moments of friendship and even equality when they high five over all the money they are going to make and Jesse convinces Walt that they should take the night off at a Deny's some place and maybe that'll actually be fun. Ah, yes. I love the bottle episodes too. Despite the relationship being completely unhealthy, Walt and Jesse do make a great team... they're still
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1) The usual: Favourite Walt and Jesse scene of S2, part 2? Definitely the crack-house scene. It's just so raw and gut-wrenching and, and I have no words how awesome that scene was.
2) In your opinion did Walt let Jane die for Jesse's sake or his own? At first I thought it was to get rid of the blackmailing threat but I'm changing my mind after reading your arguments. I totally agree with your reasoning that Jane wasn't a threat to Walt - she was a threat to Jesse. So he let her die to save Jesse. I can you hate and love a character for the exact same action???
Yeah, I wanted to ask the question about Walt's motivations because most fans do seem to just say that he did it to get rid of Jane's blackmail threat. But that doesn't really fit with Walt's motivations in 'Phoenix'. If Walt had sat at the bar with Donald and hinted that he was afraid someone was going to reveal a terrible secret about him and ruin his life then I'd say letting Jane die was all about the blackmail. But in the scenes preceding Jane's death all Walt's worries are focused on Jesse and his fear that Jesse is heading for an overdose.
I can you hate and love a character for the exact same action??? Yeah. I kind of feel this way about Jesse shooting Gale too. I hated that Gale died that way. Neither Jane nor Gale were innocents but they weren't bad people either and they didn't deserve their cruel fates. But Jesse shot Gale as a desperate act of love to save Walt and I think Walt did something similar - he didn't want Jane dead, he just realized her death could save Jesse. Of course the difference is Jesse killed Gale
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May I say this? Is it okay if I say this without sounding like an utter creep? Well, I just wanted to say that I really, REALLY love your analyses of Breaking Bad. Whenever you update, it's always one of the main highlights of my day
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I just wanted to say that I really, REALLY love your analyses of Breaking Bad. Whenever you update, it's always one of the main highlights of my day.
Not creepy at all! This is great to hear. Well, unlike other websites like youtube there's no way of telling how many people are visiting let alone reading these recaps so it's only when I get comments that I know my ramblings are in some way appreciated. So thank you so much for commenting!
Also thanks for sharing your own meta because that's what I was hoping for when I started these posts. Even with the zillions of BB podcasts and reviews out there I can never get enough Walt & Jesse discussion. I definitely agree with the comparison between Walt and Donald; both father figures believing their "child" is the innocent who's being corrupted and seeing their lover as the bad influence. Jane saw Walt as the overbearing father from the scene they met, with Walt pretending to be "Mr Jackson", Jesse's concerned invasive dad.
there's a definite case that's already been made by
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Sorry for responding months later like a creeper, but I found these posts, um...actually, I'm not sure how I got here -- some kind of wiki-walk, but the essays have been great so far.
there's a definite case that's already been made by several others that another reason Walt cares so much about Jesse and let Jane die is because of homoerotic subtext. But that's a whole other can of worms that it would take too long for me to open right now. Probably best to leave it for another day. I feel like there's more homoerotic subtext in later seasons, but in the first two there are definitely...symbolic elements which can be interpreted that way, is the best way to say it I guess. There are two main ones that I'm thinking of at the top of my head
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Not creeped out in the slightest! Thanks for commenting! :D
1. I definitely agree with the subtext of Jesse being 'the other woman'. Or you could say Jesse is Walt's equivalent 'Moll', a love interest who Walt can have crazy criminal adventures with because his wife was too strict and square. When Walt brings Jesse home to dinner it does feel like Walt is flaunting his other life at Skyler and the person he shares it with.
In the 5th season, the relationship between Walt and Jesse has all the same qualities of an abusive marriage. Skyler talks about being Walt's hostage, but Jesse was even more emotionally trapped by Walt at that stage. For all the parallels between Jesse and Junior I think there are bigger parallels between Jesse and Skyler that are sometimes missed.
Next episode Walt is all bored and bitter because he isn't dying anymore and so he has no good excuse to go out and break the law. Hahaha, basically!
It's Walter White and he's doing it for Jesse. In this moment, Walt has cast all his perfect schemes aside and all he wants is for Jesse to stop killing himself with drugs. I know this is some crazy twisted evil kind of tough love, but it still feels like love to me.Ah, God. I had to take such a long break after I finished watching this season for the first time. It just emotionally wrecked me. (Full disclosure/possible overshare, a few years ago my best friend died of an overdose and so I struggled a lot with Jane's death... it was hard for me not to think of my friend in her situation, and if someone had been able to help her, and didn't... the thought makes me near-literally black out with rage. sorry if that's an overshare but I just find it hard to talk too much about Jane without acknowledging that bit of my own personal history
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I guess it's very subjective but for me Walt has a Mr White face and he has a Heisenberg face. I think there are flashes of both in the moment Jane dies but there's more Walt in there IMO. I mean, it's Walt who sheds tears after he has let Jane's death happen. And of course, Walt 'doing it for Jesse' doesn't just mean Walt selflessly wanting to save Jesse's life, it also (always) means Walt wanting to keep Jesse for himself. It's possessive as much as it's protective
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I think he was a bit of a shell through most of the early part of S3 actually. Or at least his core Jesseness is buried like you say. After Walt leaves him at rehab, Jesse starts following the teachings of his NA leader instead. He doesn't really feel like Jesse again until the Fly episode for me. Or maybe that box speech.
Okay, yes, I agree. But one of the things that I like most about Jesse is that even though he's so insecure and malleable, he does keep his inner Jesseness, that kind of childlike and gentle core intact in there somewhere. Even though it makes his life harder. Wahh :'(
Okay, confession timehollywoodlawnOctober 29 2013, 02:07:33 UTC
So, I'm just going to put this out there--but I love this show so much, that in just the last year and a half since first discovering it, I've watched the complete series (barring the second half of 5) at least 15 or 18 times. I've re-watched it a lot.
One of the things that happens, is you'll watch an entire run from the pov of other characters besides Walt. And the first time I watched the show distinctly from Jesse's pov, I realized so many things about that character.
The two most important relationships Jesse has right now are both with people who don't wish to acknowledge that they really know Jesse.
This is so spot-on and something you can't help notice the second or third time you sit through Over. But even MORE bothersome to me, was the huge disparity between the support systems for Jesse and Jane, and how that colored the end result
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Re: Okay, confession timefalafel_musingsOctober 29 2013, 23:57:25 UTC
I actually blamed JANE for that mess. She was a danger to Jesse, and a danger to herself, and I really do believe her death was inevitable. In some ways I think you're right. Jane's death is still a great tragedy in my view. She died way too young. She was very intelligent and artistically talented. She had family who loved her. But yes, she was a career junkie like you say and it's likely that she always would have gone back to her addiction at some point, whether Jesse had come into her life or not. Jane certainly had all the control. She knew Jesse was a drug dealer from the start and right away she used it to extort more rent money from him. And when they did start using heroin together it came at a time when Jesse was very vulnerable (after Combo's murder) not when Jane had suffered any emotional blow to make her backslide. She always seemed in control to me and certainly 'Over' suggests that Jane was largely using Jesse while Jesse really felt like he was falling in love
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Re: Okay, confession timehollywoodlawnOctober 30 2013, 02:26:55 UTC
Ha ha, that's awesome. melusina is an old lj friend of mine. I haven't looked at her page in ages and I had no idea she was into Breaking Bad. Thanks for the link! I'll have to reconnect.
But yes, I've thought about Jesse's family a lot, and I have some very strong opinions on them. I think the writers did a beautiful job of intimating so much with so little. It's really Jesse's dad that gets my distaste. I'm convinced that Ginny hated him, lol.
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A bit like the audience...?
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Yay!!! It's finally posted! I love your recaps. :) :)
Jesse rejects this proposal because "We're not killing Badger, YO!" while Walt, who's been letting Jesse do all the talking, just seems exasperated because he knows the killing Badger suggestion would be so much easier. Walt will come to see prison shankings as the obvious solution later in S5.
Great link to season 5. It's interesting to watch old episodes when you know what's going to happen in season 5. For some reason, I'm worried for Badger... with Jesse, he is Hank's only living link to Heisenberg right now. Walt could consider Badger to be another loose end that needs to be eliminated.
It's one of their greatest moments of friendship and even equality when they high five over all the money they are going to make and Jesse convinces Walt that they should take the night off at a Deny's some place and maybe that'll actually be fun.
Ah, yes. I love the bottle episodes too. Despite the relationship being completely unhealthy, Walt and Jesse do make a great team... they're still ( ... )
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Definitely the crack-house scene. It's just so raw and gut-wrenching and, and I have no words how awesome that scene was.
2) In your opinion did Walt let Jane die for Jesse's sake or his own?
At first I thought it was to get rid of the blackmailing threat but I'm changing my mind after reading your arguments. I totally agree with your reasoning that Jane wasn't a threat to Walt - she was a threat to Jesse. So he let her die to save Jesse. I can you hate and love a character for the exact same action???
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I can you hate and love a character for the exact same action??? Yeah. I kind of feel this way about Jesse shooting Gale too. I hated that Gale died that way. Neither Jane nor Gale were innocents but they weren't bad people either and they didn't deserve their cruel fates. But Jesse shot Gale as a desperate act of love to save Walt and I think Walt did something similar - he didn't want Jane dead, he just realized her death could save Jesse. Of course the difference is Jesse killed Gale ( ... )
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Not creepy at all! This is great to hear. Well, unlike other websites like youtube there's no way of telling how many people are visiting let alone reading these recaps so it's only when I get comments that I know my ramblings are in some way appreciated. So thank you so much for commenting!
Also thanks for sharing your own meta because that's what I was hoping for when I started these posts. Even with the zillions of BB podcasts and reviews out there I can never get enough Walt & Jesse discussion. I definitely agree with the comparison between Walt and Donald; both father figures believing their "child" is the innocent who's being corrupted and seeing their lover as the bad influence. Jane saw Walt as the overbearing father from the scene they met, with Walt pretending to be "Mr Jackson", Jesse's concerned invasive dad.
there's a definite case that's already been made by ( ... )
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there's a definite case that's already been made by several others that another reason Walt cares so much about Jesse and let Jane die is because of homoerotic subtext. But that's a whole other can of worms that it would take too long for me to open right now. Probably best to leave it for another day. I feel like there's more homoerotic subtext in later seasons, but in the first two there are definitely...symbolic elements which can be interpreted that way, is the best way to say it I guess. There are two main ones that I'm thinking of at the top of my head ( ... )
Reply
1. I definitely agree with the subtext of Jesse being 'the other woman'. Or you could say Jesse is Walt's equivalent 'Moll', a love interest who Walt can have crazy criminal adventures with because his wife was too strict and square. When Walt brings Jesse home to dinner it does feel like Walt is flaunting his other life at Skyler and the person he shares it with.
In the 5th season, the relationship between Walt and Jesse has all the same qualities of an abusive marriage. Skyler talks about being Walt's hostage, but Jesse was even more emotionally trapped by Walt at that stage. For all the parallels between Jesse and Junior I think there are bigger parallels between Jesse and Skyler that are sometimes missed.
Glad you're enjoying my meta. :)
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It's Walter White and he's doing it for Jesse. In this moment, Walt has cast all his perfect schemes aside and all he wants is for Jesse to stop killing himself with drugs. I know this is some crazy twisted evil kind of tough love, but it still feels like love to me.Ah, God. I had to take such a long break after I finished watching this season for the first time. It just emotionally wrecked me. (Full disclosure/possible overshare, a few years ago my best friend died of an overdose and so I struggled a lot with Jane's death... it was hard for me not to think of my friend in her situation, and if someone had been able to help her, and didn't... the thought makes me near-literally black out with rage. sorry if that's an overshare but I just find it hard to talk too much about Jane without acknowledging that bit of my own personal history ( ... )
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Okay, yes, I agree. But one of the things that I like most about Jesse is that even though he's so insecure and malleable, he does keep his inner Jesseness, that kind of childlike and gentle core intact in there somewhere. Even though it makes his life harder. Wahh :'(
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One of the things that happens, is you'll watch an entire run from the pov of other characters besides Walt. And the first time I watched the show distinctly from Jesse's pov, I realized so many things about that character.
The two most important relationships Jesse has right now are both with people who don't wish to acknowledge that they really know Jesse.
This is so spot-on and something you can't help notice the second or third time you sit through Over. But even MORE bothersome to me, was the huge disparity between the support systems for Jesse and Jane, and how that colored the end result ( ... )
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But yes, I've thought about Jesse's family a lot, and I have some very strong opinions on them. I think the writers did a beautiful job of intimating so much with so little. It's really Jesse's dad that gets my distaste. I'm convinced that Ginny hated him, lol.
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