On emotional reactions to comments (aka welcome to the dark side of fandom)
Opinions, we've all got 'em. Tastes, they usually vary. Feelings, we all have them too.
Several times in my life I have been referred to as "oversensitive". Believe me when I tell you that I fully got the meaning intended...it was a veiled insult at the worst and highly dismissive of me and of my feelings at best. There was no interpretation that could be even remotely considered complimentary. (For further reading on this type of reaction to a term please see this from Psychology Today: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-introverts-corner/201605/what-it-means-when-someone-tells-you-youre-too-sensitive).
Why do I mention this at all? Because I intend to talk about this from my own perspective and you need to know this about me. I am far from unique BTW. Many a creative person is "oversensitive", it seems to go with the territory.
I am also a perfectionist. No, not expecting perfection from others (far from it and I rarely expect even an attempt from others at perfection...I tend not to judge). I expect it of me. I am my own worst critic and will "brood" like Angel over things I feel I screwed up or over things I might have done that hurt someone else.
So when someone says something that hits me emotionally or that plays into my insecurities or lack of confidence it can take on more importance than it should. Instead of being able to simply say (and MEAN) "well, that's your opinion" and move on I am often hurt or have terrible self-doubt, even retreating to isolation.
I'll give you a current example. My "muse" has been largely missing for over a year. I finally figured out part of the problem and it comes from a couple of conversations and a review or two that caused that self-doubt and lack of confidence to build a wall between me and my writing.
I am not immune to the sting of critical comments, far from it. I can be eviscerated by them. So reading that I am prone to run-on sentences makes me self-conscious and causes me to question every bloody sentence I write (including this one). Having someone review a story that I worked hard on by saying (to paraphrase) that I had shown courage to post it and that while they didn't enjoy it that if writing makes me happy that I should continue does nothing to bolster my confidence or desire to write again.
Having someone or a few someones disparage a particular trope and make it clear that professionals or creative writing instructors see that trope as lazy, contrived or worthy of only an eye-roll can devastate.
For example the use of Deus ex Machina in fiction. This trope is ancient, one of the oldest in fact. Greek plays often had the literal lowering of a statue of a deity to the stage as a plot device to represent divine interference. I submit that the entire conceit of Buffy the Vampire Slayer is one BIG Deus ex Machina. After all, you have the lead character having been selected and empowered by The Powers That Be (aka Deus). Over and over in the program this plot device shows up all the way through to the Guardian and Scythe in the show's end. Something from out of the blue fixes everything? Hello Deus ex Machina (including all of Willow's magic).
Using this plot device in fiction based on this program should be pretty much a given and not take away from the validity of the plot at all. My current epic WIP was designed to create a situation where things became so bad on such a vast scale that such outside interference would be the only way to make things right. The alternative was an ending with no hope possible. No plucky idea by a rag-tag band of heroes could fix the situation.
I began writing it during the first term of George W. Bush when word of "enhanced interrogation" began to leak out. The story was a catharsis where I was working out my many issues about the things taking place in the real world but set in the Buffyverse. It was bleak. It had no happy ending planned. It sat on my hard drive for years. Finally, I decided to continue it but work the ending in a way that offered hope. Yup, that will involve the use of a Deus ex Machina.
Imagine how little encouragement I had to continue writing my story when the very trope I fully intended to use (knowingly and by choice) was mocked in conversation? When the use of that trope was held up as an example of bad writing? Yeah, I'll get right back to working on that, thank you...not.
I use this as an example that things we say really can influence the ability or desire for another person, especially one who is "over-sensitive" to write or continue to write. I have 42 stories on EF alone so I'm not a total novice. I have other stories elsewhere in addition to the 42 Spuffy fanfictions on EF. If this had been my first story I probably would have pulled it and never written another word to share with anyone ever again because in my mind I had been told (by people I respect and like) that my writing was worthless even though no one said those words or realized they were "speaking" to me at all! I didn't take part in the conversation, was far too busy over in the corner feeling like someone with nothing to offer.
We say things never knowing the impact on the person on the other end. It should matter.
Like the subject line of this post says, we all have opinions and differing tastes. There should be a place at the table for everyone but we also have to realize that what we say might well stifle another person without that being our intent, especially someone new to exercising their creativity. That should be a valid concern while we freely express opinions.
I fail at this as often as the next person, please know that I include myself in this reminder...in fact it is directed to myself specifically when you get down to it.
When we talk about things we hate in other people's work we risk scaring off a possible writer or making someone feel less than welcome even though it isn't really about them at all nor is it our intent to hurt someone else. Perhaps a better way to phrase an opinion like that would be to say something along the lines of, "the reason XYZ doesn't appeal to my tastes is..." instead of using emotionally charged words like hate or ick or the like (unless you are talking kiddie porn in which case ick is the least of it!).
I've seen lots of opinions expressed about tropes like claims or today's discussion on all human stories. Opinions about romance novels or fantasy and science fiction too. Nothing wrong with having those opinions or expressing them but realize that there will be an emotional response to that expression.
I'm an eclectic reader, always have been. I love a well-told story (even if the grammar isn't perfect I will read and enjoy if the plot is engaging, the characters well defined). I was reading Sci-Fi when "girls" didn't do that and were ridiculed for even daring to look in that department of the bookstore. I love well-done romance novels and erotica. I enjoy a well-crafted mystery and devour non-fiction history and biographies.
When it comes to Buffy fic I have enjoyed most all of it from vampire Llamas and penguins to canon based to claims even to high school fic though I've been out of high school since 1972. If the characters are recognizable I will likely enjoy it. The trappings of the story aren't usually an issue to me. Claims are from another fandom? So what? Did you watch the show? The only reason they didn't use this trope is because they didn't think of it or decide they needed it not because of some written in stone fact-based reason. All human? Well, Buffy is more than her calling. The human aspect of the characters is how we can relate to them at all.
Stories about space aliens or vampires or the guy next door have to involve characters we can relate to as humans. Let's face it we cannot properly write a story about an alien race that is truly alien...no one would understand the character or the motivation. Even our religious books know that and thus attribute to the deity of choice very human characteristics (often to the point of lunacy IMHO. What true deity would ever be jealous or need their ego stroked all the time?). It is how we relate to the characters in the story. We humanize. We attribute to them actions, emotions, needs that we can relate to. It doesn't matter if it's on an alien planet, a town filled with vampires and demons or a local high school or movie set.
Who of us really cared about a Polgara demon in canon Buffy? There was nothing humanly relatable, they were shown as not being sentient and we didn't feel bad when they were killed just for being. Clem? Now Clem we could relate to as we could the vampires we were allowed to get to know. On Angel the series they did a much better job of showing the differences in demons than on Buffy where they originally were all cardboard evil stake fodder except for Angel (excused by the soul curse). BtVS eventually branched out a bit but not as much as they did on Angel. To care, we humanize.
In writing Buffy fanfic as long as you can recognize Buffy as Buffy her powers or lack thereof aren't the main deal. If you can see Spike in a story, does it matter if he is a penguin or a vampire or the cool British rocker? Your personal taste might cause you to pass on some of the plots chosen by the writer but that's all it is...a matter of taste.
Another thing that can happen in reacting to comments is the way the individual projects (or relates) to a character. For example: I project on to the character of Spike. I know this about myself. I see the character as a basically decent but average human who had a very bad thing happen to him that caused him to make some very bad choices that hurt him and others but is trying to redeem himself. I see him as worthy of love and regard. I relate to him, see myself in his story as I perceive it. So when someone states they hate Spike, yeah, I take it personally. When someone says his bad actions preclude his right to being loved or forgiven I have an emotional reaction. You can probably imagine how happy I have been in many a forum with my "over-sensitivity" on that score! I know not everyone sees him that way but still when words are said, even in a fairly benign way, I don't react well.
This is something we all do I think. How often have you seen someone object to "character bashing" of one character or another only to scratch your head because to you it isn't bashing but just a truthful depiction of the character? Obviously, the person who took exception to the depiction saw the character in a very different way and unless you are taking the depiction straight from canon your take on that character might well be skewed too.
God, this is long-winded and meandering and I apologize to anyone still reading (you brave souls).
But in my roundabout way I guess what I'm saying is that everyone has differing tastes and opinions and that is a good thing. Everyone has the right to have them and express them. BUT know that there is a counter to that. What we say might well cause someone to head for the hills.
Not everyone can take those "negatives" and learn from them, improve their writing or whatever you might think would be the correct reaction. Some of us might never want to write again or feel any confidence in our creative pursuits. It might keep someone from even trying or make someone feel unwelcome. It might make them feel that people they like and admire might think them silly, stupid or worse because they like something we don't like. Not everyone can take negatives in stride.
When someone is hurt it is often the best solution to let them know that you did not intend offense and possibly move along from the topic. It is often counter-productive to try to explain why you disagree as it often just adds to the hurt. Many times a safe distance is the best course of action.
For myself, I will try to be careful in my word choice out of respect for the feelings of others since I know well how I am impacted when things are taken by me in a way other than intended. I hope if I offend anyone they will let me know so I can clear things up because I really never want to hurt another person (or critters for that matter...I feel terrible when I yell at my dogs).
Today in the SB I learned that all caps for a word are often taken as hostile by the reader. I have a habit of using caps at times for emphasis since the written word hasn't the tone and inflection of the oral. Now that I know that it is seen as being hostile I will try to stop that in my writing.
I guess I've said my piece. I wrote it here because if I tried to join the conversation in the SB I'd be spamming until morning and none of us want that LOL.
So that's my two cents worth on the subject.
Love and respect you all,
Kathleen
Several times in my life I have been referred to as "oversensitive". Believe me when I tell you that I fully got the meaning intended...it was a veiled insult at the worst and highly dismissive of me and of my feelings at best. There was no interpretation that could be even remotely considered complimentary. (For further reading on this type of reaction to a term please see this from Psychology Today: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-introverts-corner/201605/what-it-means-when-someone-tells-you-youre-too-sensitive).
Why do I mention this at all? Because I intend to talk about this from my own perspective and you need to know this about me. I am far from unique BTW. Many a creative person is "oversensitive", it seems to go with the territory.
I am also a perfectionist. No, not expecting perfection from others (far from it and I rarely expect even an attempt from others at perfection...I tend not to judge). I expect it of me. I am my own worst critic and will "brood" like Angel over things I feel I screwed up or over things I might have done that hurt someone else.
So when someone says something that hits me emotionally or that plays into my insecurities or lack of confidence it can take on more importance than it should. Instead of being able to simply say (and MEAN) "well, that's your opinion" and move on I am often hurt or have terrible self-doubt, even retreating to isolation.
I'll give you a current example. My "muse" has been largely missing for over a year. I finally figured out part of the problem and it comes from a couple of conversations and a review or two that caused that self-doubt and lack of confidence to build a wall between me and my writing.
I am not immune to the sting of critical comments, far from it. I can be eviscerated by them. So reading that I am prone to run-on sentences makes me self-conscious and causes me to question every bloody sentence I write (including this one). Having someone review a story that I worked hard on by saying (to paraphrase) that I had shown courage to post it and that while they didn't enjoy it that if writing makes me happy that I should continue does nothing to bolster my confidence or desire to write again.
Having someone or a few someones disparage a particular trope and make it clear that professionals or creative writing instructors see that trope as lazy, contrived or worthy of only an eye-roll can devastate.
For example the use of Deus ex Machina in fiction. This trope is ancient, one of the oldest in fact. Greek plays often had the literal lowering of a statue of a deity to the stage as a plot device to represent divine interference. I submit that the entire conceit of Buffy the Vampire Slayer is one BIG Deus ex Machina. After all, you have the lead character having been selected and empowered by The Powers That Be (aka Deus). Over and over in the program this plot device shows up all the way through to the Guardian and Scythe in the show's end. Something from out of the blue fixes everything? Hello Deus ex Machina (including all of Willow's magic).
Using this plot device in fiction based on this program should be pretty much a given and not take away from the validity of the plot at all. My current epic WIP was designed to create a situation where things became so bad on such a vast scale that such outside interference would be the only way to make things right. The alternative was an ending with no hope possible. No plucky idea by a rag-tag band of heroes could fix the situation.
I began writing it during the first term of George W. Bush when word of "enhanced interrogation" began to leak out. The story was a catharsis where I was working out my many issues about the things taking place in the real world but set in the Buffyverse. It was bleak. It had no happy ending planned. It sat on my hard drive for years. Finally, I decided to continue it but work the ending in a way that offered hope. Yup, that will involve the use of a Deus ex Machina.
Imagine how little encouragement I had to continue writing my story when the very trope I fully intended to use (knowingly and by choice) was mocked in conversation? When the use of that trope was held up as an example of bad writing? Yeah, I'll get right back to working on that, thank you...not.
I use this as an example that things we say really can influence the ability or desire for another person, especially one who is "over-sensitive" to write or continue to write. I have 42 stories on EF alone so I'm not a total novice. I have other stories elsewhere in addition to the 42 Spuffy fanfictions on EF. If this had been my first story I probably would have pulled it and never written another word to share with anyone ever again because in my mind I had been told (by people I respect and like) that my writing was worthless even though no one said those words or realized they were "speaking" to me at all! I didn't take part in the conversation, was far too busy over in the corner feeling like someone with nothing to offer.
We say things never knowing the impact on the person on the other end. It should matter.
Like the subject line of this post says, we all have opinions and differing tastes. There should be a place at the table for everyone but we also have to realize that what we say might well stifle another person without that being our intent, especially someone new to exercising their creativity. That should be a valid concern while we freely express opinions.
I fail at this as often as the next person, please know that I include myself in this reminder...in fact it is directed to myself specifically when you get down to it.
When we talk about things we hate in other people's work we risk scaring off a possible writer or making someone feel less than welcome even though it isn't really about them at all nor is it our intent to hurt someone else. Perhaps a better way to phrase an opinion like that would be to say something along the lines of, "the reason XYZ doesn't appeal to my tastes is..." instead of using emotionally charged words like hate or ick or the like (unless you are talking kiddie porn in which case ick is the least of it!).
I've seen lots of opinions expressed about tropes like claims or today's discussion on all human stories. Opinions about romance novels or fantasy and science fiction too. Nothing wrong with having those opinions or expressing them but realize that there will be an emotional response to that expression.
I'm an eclectic reader, always have been. I love a well-told story (even if the grammar isn't perfect I will read and enjoy if the plot is engaging, the characters well defined). I was reading Sci-Fi when "girls" didn't do that and were ridiculed for even daring to look in that department of the bookstore. I love well-done romance novels and erotica. I enjoy a well-crafted mystery and devour non-fiction history and biographies.
When it comes to Buffy fic I have enjoyed most all of it from vampire Llamas and penguins to canon based to claims even to high school fic though I've been out of high school since 1972. If the characters are recognizable I will likely enjoy it. The trappings of the story aren't usually an issue to me. Claims are from another fandom? So what? Did you watch the show? The only reason they didn't use this trope is because they didn't think of it or decide they needed it not because of some written in stone fact-based reason. All human? Well, Buffy is more than her calling. The human aspect of the characters is how we can relate to them at all.
Stories about space aliens or vampires or the guy next door have to involve characters we can relate to as humans. Let's face it we cannot properly write a story about an alien race that is truly alien...no one would understand the character or the motivation. Even our religious books know that and thus attribute to the deity of choice very human characteristics (often to the point of lunacy IMHO. What true deity would ever be jealous or need their ego stroked all the time?). It is how we relate to the characters in the story. We humanize. We attribute to them actions, emotions, needs that we can relate to. It doesn't matter if it's on an alien planet, a town filled with vampires and demons or a local high school or movie set.
Who of us really cared about a Polgara demon in canon Buffy? There was nothing humanly relatable, they were shown as not being sentient and we didn't feel bad when they were killed just for being. Clem? Now Clem we could relate to as we could the vampires we were allowed to get to know. On Angel the series they did a much better job of showing the differences in demons than on Buffy where they originally were all cardboard evil stake fodder except for Angel (excused by the soul curse). BtVS eventually branched out a bit but not as much as they did on Angel. To care, we humanize.
In writing Buffy fanfic as long as you can recognize Buffy as Buffy her powers or lack thereof aren't the main deal. If you can see Spike in a story, does it matter if he is a penguin or a vampire or the cool British rocker? Your personal taste might cause you to pass on some of the plots chosen by the writer but that's all it is...a matter of taste.
Another thing that can happen in reacting to comments is the way the individual projects (or relates) to a character. For example: I project on to the character of Spike. I know this about myself. I see the character as a basically decent but average human who had a very bad thing happen to him that caused him to make some very bad choices that hurt him and others but is trying to redeem himself. I see him as worthy of love and regard. I relate to him, see myself in his story as I perceive it. So when someone states they hate Spike, yeah, I take it personally. When someone says his bad actions preclude his right to being loved or forgiven I have an emotional reaction. You can probably imagine how happy I have been in many a forum with my "over-sensitivity" on that score! I know not everyone sees him that way but still when words are said, even in a fairly benign way, I don't react well.
This is something we all do I think. How often have you seen someone object to "character bashing" of one character or another only to scratch your head because to you it isn't bashing but just a truthful depiction of the character? Obviously, the person who took exception to the depiction saw the character in a very different way and unless you are taking the depiction straight from canon your take on that character might well be skewed too.
God, this is long-winded and meandering and I apologize to anyone still reading (you brave souls).
But in my roundabout way I guess what I'm saying is that everyone has differing tastes and opinions and that is a good thing. Everyone has the right to have them and express them. BUT know that there is a counter to that. What we say might well cause someone to head for the hills.
Not everyone can take those "negatives" and learn from them, improve their writing or whatever you might think would be the correct reaction. Some of us might never want to write again or feel any confidence in our creative pursuits. It might keep someone from even trying or make someone feel unwelcome. It might make them feel that people they like and admire might think them silly, stupid or worse because they like something we don't like. Not everyone can take negatives in stride.
When someone is hurt it is often the best solution to let them know that you did not intend offense and possibly move along from the topic. It is often counter-productive to try to explain why you disagree as it often just adds to the hurt. Many times a safe distance is the best course of action.
For myself, I will try to be careful in my word choice out of respect for the feelings of others since I know well how I am impacted when things are taken by me in a way other than intended. I hope if I offend anyone they will let me know so I can clear things up because I really never want to hurt another person (or critters for that matter...I feel terrible when I yell at my dogs).
Today in the SB I learned that all caps for a word are often taken as hostile by the reader. I have a habit of using caps at times for emphasis since the written word hasn't the tone and inflection of the oral. Now that I know that it is seen as being hostile I will try to stop that in my writing.
I guess I've said my piece. I wrote it here because if I tried to join the conversation in the SB I'd be spamming until morning and none of us want that LOL.
So that's my two cents worth on the subject.
Love and respect you all,
Kathleen