SAME MAN, DIFFERENT TIME: META ON GODHOOD AND POWERS IN THE TEN AND ELEVEN ERAS.

[elisi]

topaz_eyes and I were having a v. interesting conversation on solitary_summer’s LJ, but when she posted the following comment I realised I needed to make a post, because even just thinking about the answer I knew it’d fill up about 4 comment boxes. (It ended up around 8000 words, in the end. Approximately.) Plus it was wildly off topic for the post it was in

Comments

[skipthedemon]

META!!! This is great. I may come back later, and have more to say.

I will say, that I've had bits of a meta essay in my head for a while about the Doctor as Trickster for um, years now. Tricksters are also often strongly associated with travel. Hermes/Mercury is the god of travelers in Greek and Roman mythology. Eshu is the god of travelers and crossroads in Yoruba religion. They are also often the messengers and go betweens, going back and forth between the mortals and the rest of the gods.

Unfortunately, Western storytellers have had an tendency to equate trickster characters with the Devil. I have theories as to why that is, but they aren't exactly flattering to mainstream Christian theology, in my mind. (Sorry.) The short version is tricksters transgress barriers and circumvent cultural norms. In a lot of religions, that's not exactly bad, because the gods aren't perfect. Tricksters allow breathing room for growth and change, in how a culture thinks about itself. When the dominant cultural narrative is that there's a perfect God who hands down morality, equating subversion with evil is easy to do.

This is also why I think trying to put monotheistic imagery in Doctor Who, or analyzing it on that basis, doesn't really *work*.

ETA: Jesus's parables in the Gospels and his behavior in the Temple, otoh, fit the Trickster archetype well. But then, he *was* subverting the dominant cultural narrative. I have crankiness with how the Gospels have come to be viewed through the lens of the writings of Paul, but that's another matter.

[elisi]

META!!! This is great. I may come back later, and have more to say.
Looking forward, if you get round to it. :)

I will say, that I've had bits of a meta essay in my head for a while about the Doctor as Trickster for um, years now.
This does not surprise me AT ALL! And I would love for you to write it, it's such a perfect fit.

Unfortunately, Western storytellers have had an tendency to equate trickster characters with the Devil. I have theories as to why that is, but they aren't exactly flattering to mainstream Christian theology, in my mind. (Sorry.)
No apologies needed - Christianity unfortunately has a tendency to be difficult and prejudiced in things like this.

This is also why I think trying to put monotheistic imagery in Doctor Who, or analyzing it on that basis, doesn't really *work*.
This is a good point, and probably why so much of 'the Doctor as God' stuff is such an awkward fit. Interesting, but awkward.

Jesus's parables in the Gospels and his behavior in the Temple, otoh, fit the Trickster archetype well. But then, he *was* subverting the dominant cultural narrative.
*nods a lot*

I have crankiness with how the Gospels have come to be viewed through the lens of the writings of Paul, but that's another matter.
One of my favourite things of all is where Peter in one of his letters writes 'Our dear brother Paul writes many things which are difficult to understand'. (From memory - but that's the gist. *g*)

(And I think our icons go rather well together!)

[skipthedemon]

I also have thoughts on the importance of memory, but those I can pin down even less. *sigh*

(Yes, they do!)