After reading Robin Hood,(last post) when I found 'Puck of Pook's Hill', and this Poem by Rudyard Kipling--I just Knew that Hobden and Hob o' the Hill were related
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Well, Yes, being as it is so much Older, and (hopefully) will out last us...It always seemed Foolish to claim that we owned It (In Welsh, one does not say "my house', but, " I am with the house" Or some other order--I forget..)
In Any event, I suspect that Kipling May have been 'layering' meanings---(almost punning) 'Own' in the sense of "Admit the Truth of" he 'Knows' the land, the Truth of it, -all its secrets.(...Or perhaps *I* am just too fond of such word-play..)
I suspect the same. it is I think much more than 'knowing it' as much as being part of the fabric of it. It's like when one says "my friend" it's not so much possessive,but as the welsh example. I like how he goes beyond the connection of titles and deeds to that mutual "my". It would be just as easy for the land to say "my Hobden".Another interesting way to think about it is the land seems to always 'produce' its 'Hobden';-) the 'spirit' of the land manifested in a physical container as it were. There is, in the poem, always 'The' Hobden, perhaps different in personality and yet of the same office as it were. It's how I tend to think of another group of 'personalities', figure eights and overlapping circles notwithstanding ;-)
Oh aye, the Hobdens Are Part of the land as much as the deer or hedgehogs... *Natives* - -Like I said, I saw them as related to the Hobs (Spirits) always there, Since their ancestors Walked to england before the sea level rise at the end of the last Ice Age. (see 'chedder man' for example; ---9,000 years, they matched his DNA with locals...)
***Hob-and-Jill(or Gil) is also male-and female ferret
(see 'chedder man' for example; ---9,000 years, they matched his DNA with locals...)
yes. There was an ethnograph done in the early 20th century which pretty much advanced that, based on phenotype rather than genotype. Results of it appeared in 'The Welsh People' by Rhys and Jones. Think John Davies also devoted some time to it in his 'History of Wales'.
Reply
(In Welsh, one does not say "my house', but, " I am with the house" Or some other order--I forget..)
In Any event, I suspect that Kipling May have been 'layering' meanings---(almost punning)
'Own' in the sense of "Admit the Truth of" he 'Knows' the land, the Truth of it,
-all its secrets.(...Or perhaps *I* am just too fond of such word-play..)
Reply
it is I think much more than 'knowing it' as much as being part of the fabric of it.
It's like when one says "my friend" it's not so much possessive,but as the welsh example.
I like how he goes beyond the connection of titles and deeds to that mutual "my". It would be just as easy for the land to say "my Hobden".Another interesting way to think about it is the land seems to always 'produce' its 'Hobden';-) the 'spirit' of the land manifested in a physical container as it were. There is, in the poem, always 'The' Hobden, perhaps different in personality and yet of the same office as it were. It's how I tend to think of another group of 'personalities', figure eights and overlapping circles notwithstanding ;-)
Reply
*Natives* -
-Like I said, I saw them as related to the Hobs (Spirits) always there,
Since their ancestors Walked to england before the sea level rise at the end of the last Ice Age.
(see 'chedder man' for example;
---9,000 years, they matched his DNA with locals...)
***Hob-and-Jill(or Gil) is also male-and female ferret
Reply
---9,000 years, they matched his DNA with locals...)
yes. There was an ethnograph done in the early 20th century which pretty much advanced that, based on phenotype rather than genotype. Results of it appeared in 'The Welsh People' by Rhys and Jones. Think John Davies also devoted some time to it in his 'History of Wales'.
Reply
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