Re: THE 1st COMMENTsunnyskywalkerOctober 14 2010, 17:31:30 UTC
There were probably all manner of amazing, centuries-old treasures in there, including rare books someone didn't even want in the Restricted Section. Plus the Prince's book, of course, which had original magical research in it; just the improved versions of the potions they make in class would be a great benefit to wizarding education and welfare. It's a huge tragedy.
McGonagall telling Harry to get back on task is like a metaphor for the whole book! Harry stands around, thinking about other things, while everyone else covers for him because they think he's doing important world-saving business...
I'm surprised they're having Hermione modify her parents' memories in the movies too. Given how they've either cut (Ton-Tongue Toffees) or changed (Dudley going after the cake) incidents to make the Trio look nicer, it's a break from the pattern. I would have expected movie!Hermione to just tell her parents that bad things are going down and they should take an extended vacation to Australia, then lie and tell them she'll be in some safe hideout for magical kids in Iceland or something, and she wishes she could go with them but it's for their own safety. I know she's usually a lousy liar, but surely she could pass any awkwardness off as nervousness?
Crabbe is surprisingly magically talented! It adds another perspective to Draco keeping him as a bodyguard all those years - it isn't just about having someone to boss around or a bit of muscle, but having a secret weapon everyone underestimates. And now Crabbe has enough confidence to try to make it on his own. (I think someone else cast a Disillusionment Charm besides DD and V when they picked Harry up from the Dursleys in OotP, but I can't remember whether it was Moody, Tonks, or Lupin and don't have the books to check. But it was someone trained in advanced defensive magic, so your point about it being a tough charm probably holds.) And once again, Draco can't stand the thought of murder, even if it's not him doing the murdering.
It's quite sad to see how Harry moved from the kid who at least leafed through his schoolbooks before school started (PS/SS) to one who won't even read crucial information for his quest when he has a year with little else to do.
There's still a niggling question about Albania for me, namely, why did Bertha Jorkins go on vacation there? Maybe because so much of the country is mountainous and isolated, wizards think it's a great spot to not have to worry about hiding, or maybe they go there for the great variety of plant life to use in potions... but surely it isn't the only isolated, flora-rich spot in Europe? Plus, depending on where they land/Portkey/whatever, they might have ended up in some nasty situations in Albania of the 90s. Why not visit the magical chocolate factories in also-mountainous Swizterland instead? (You know they must have them!) It doesn't seem widely known that Helena Ravenclaw ever went there, and Pettigrew only went because he'd heard while in rat form that Voldemort was hiding there before Harry's first year and guessed right that he'd go back, so I doubt Bertha managed to remember something Barty Jr. said about it, because he wouldn't have known. Maybe they have a cheap Floo connection or bargain round-trip Portkeys for Albania, and that's why she picks it.
Re: THE 1st COMMENTkarentheunicornOctober 14 2010, 23:34:04 UTC
/As for Hermione, they wanted to show her room, parents & their house. I think we'll see them agreeing to the modification after talking to her and it'll be presented as tragic, but needed, decision./
One wonders if they picked up on some fans complaint that it seems pretty crappy if she did it to her parents without telling them. So maybe the movie is giving it more play than was ever given in the book.
I can't remember exactly how it went but always got the impression from the book that it was Hermione doing the spell wihtout her parents knowing anything. I never got the impression she told them what she was going to do to them or about the issues with Voldemort.
Who knows, maybe JKR has taken some looks at fan speculation or movie people got a wiff of the debates that have happened and are trying to give a better impression that was given in the book.
Re: THE 1st COMMENTelanor_xOctober 14 2010, 19:22:55 UTC
One of the reasons for DH! Harry's passivity could be that JKR knew he would get entire chapter of heroically going to death and searched for the way to give other characters chance to shine too. Had Harry gone with Ron & Hr, Ron wouldn't be the one to open the chamber.
Another, more important reason, was JKR's desire for (unnecessary) exposition. Harry didn't need Helena's story to remember the diadem in RoR, but JKR wanted to give it, as she decided to show students' evacuation. Since all was done through Harry's pov, we got a protagonist standing around, as if he had all time in the world, with the flimsy excuse of being unable to think without his friends.
I also think being passive makes the decision to go to his death more believable. Somebody with a proactive approach, like teenage TR, would try to think about other way, at least for a few minutes,not immediately accept his fate. In general, proactive Harry wouldn't work in the series, in which the author wants to give out information according to the plot demands, not to what would happen in RL. See: Harry not asking about his parents' house & graves since JKR planned to visit them in DH. That's the main, going to the core cause of passivity.
As for Hermione, they wanted to show her room, parents & their house. I think we'll see them agreeing to the modification after talking to her and it'll be presented as tragic, but needed, decision. May be movie V & DEs, unlike their book counterparts, will be scarily effective and will target relatives of HP's closest friends and supporters, Muggle or not. By target I mean try to seize them all or, at least, question the moment Trio escape from the wedding. I still would make them only move to Australia, without modification, but the script writer believed JKR it was a must, so...
Crabbe is surprisingly magically talented! It adds another perspective to Draco keeping him as a bodyguard all those years - it isn't just about having someone to boss around or a bit of muscle
Didn't think about that, but you're right. Muscle is useless against 1st year level spells anyway, f.e. Stunning.
Re: THE 1st COMMENTsunnyskywalkerOctober 14 2010, 20:59:22 UTC
On the other hand, we also have seen that when he does act, Harry is impulsive, especially when he thinks he's the only one who can save someone. He's also had a few moments of wanting to die to be with all his dead relatives and Sirius - brief, granted, and in times of great stress, but isn't this one of those times? She could have played it so that Dumbledore and Snape's conversation didn't give a solution, and Harry impulsively decided to pass the snake-killing duty off to any of the many capable people around and nobly sacrifice himself to get rid of the last Horcrux, because he couldn't see how they would ever figure out how to dispose of it otherwise (I mean, this is Harry after all). It fits well enough with Harry's previous characterization and doesn't require total passivity! Which makes me think that you're right that the real reason is that JKR is using Harry as a device to help us listen in on whatever information she wants to give us at the moment, not as a convincing character. Although as others have pointed out, given how ambition is demonized in the books and how the "good" Peverell brother was the one who hid and did nothing (that we know of) his whole life, she might also see passivity as a virtue (perhaps unconsciously).
If the DEs are effective - and looking at the added Burrow-burning scene in HBP, they might be - that would make moving the Grangers to Australia a bit more logical. As it is, do we ever see Voldemort hunt down anyone's Muggle relatives besides his own? Random Muggles on a bridge, sure, but I don't think we ever heard that anything happened to Colin's or Justin's families, and despite the Dursleys going into hiding, we never heard about anything happening to them either.
The one good thing about seeing Hermione's room is that we'll actually see her having a tiny bit of a life outside the wizarding world, even if it's only for a few weeks a year. So it might seem like a real, painful situation rather than the equivalent of killing another redshirt like Charity Burbage (ie, not something that has much impact).
Now that we know Crabbe was Draco's silent and loyal magical support, we could probably draw some parallels to Harry and Hermione. (Well, she's not silent, but you know what I mean.)
Re: THE 1st COMMENTsunnyskywalkerOctober 16 2010, 15:52:51 UTC
So it is just a convenient coincidence? Was Peter just waiting for someone he knew to wander through? Did he have a list of old schoolmates with Albanian relatives who might visit, and lurked near their homes?
Re: THE 1st COMMENToryx_leucoryxOctober 16 2010, 20:04:20 UTC
According to Voldemort Peter ran into her at an inn just outside the forest. Peter just stopped for some food. I doubt this version because as a rat he could easily find as much food as he would want.
Re: THE 1st COMMENTsunnyskywalkerOctober 17 2010, 16:05:07 UTC
Yeah, that sounds pretty unlikely. I'm going to go with at least semi-intentional lurking and stalking (as in, he was at the very least looking for a Brit who might know something useful to take as an offering).
Re: THE 1st COMMENTseductivedarkOctober 15 2010, 21:30:06 UTC
Crabbe is surprisingly magically talented! It adds another perspective to Draco keeping him as a bodyguard all those years - it isn't just about having someone to boss around or a bit of muscle, but having a secret weapon everyone underestimates.
Sort-of like Peter Pettigrew, the kid who didn't shine as brightly as his cohort in crime but who still, nonetheless, managed an Animagus transfiguration by fifth year, spied in rat form, saved his own bacon by going into hiding in plain sight as the pet of a Hogwarts-bound kid. Wonder what all he might have picked up wandering the halls in complete safety as a rat all those years, ever since Percy was a firstie. And Crabbe, like Pettigrew, turned his back on his friends in the end and got what was coming.
Re: THE 1st COMMENTseductivedarkOctober 16 2010, 09:57:55 UTC
Meh. I forgot about Mrs Norris and the owls. I was thinking more about the curfew and detention.
I'm not sure being a study maven is a good thing in the Potterverse. Hermione studies but Harry and Ron both blow off the classes they don't like. Ron even gets a line that shows he doesn't think he or Harry need to listen in Potions so Crabbe isn't alone in only attending to what he likes.
Re: THE 1st COMMENTkarentheunicornOctober 17 2010, 14:23:37 UTC
/I'm not sure being a study maven is a good thing in the Potterverse. Hermione studies but Harry and Ron both blow off the classes they don't like/
If Deathly Hallows camping trip with the trio is any evidence all three could should have blow off Hogwarts classes and gone to take some cooking classes from Mrs. Weasley. That way at least we could have skipped the OMG we can't find food and don't know how to get it stuff.
McGonagall telling Harry to get back on task is like a metaphor for the whole book! Harry stands around, thinking about other things, while everyone else covers for him because they think he's doing important world-saving business...
I'm surprised they're having Hermione modify her parents' memories in the movies too. Given how they've either cut (Ton-Tongue Toffees) or changed (Dudley going after the cake) incidents to make the Trio look nicer, it's a break from the pattern. I would have expected movie!Hermione to just tell her parents that bad things are going down and they should take an extended vacation to Australia, then lie and tell them she'll be in some safe hideout for magical kids in Iceland or something, and she wishes she could go with them but it's for their own safety. I know she's usually a lousy liar, but surely she could pass any awkwardness off as nervousness?
Crabbe is surprisingly magically talented! It adds another perspective to Draco keeping him as a bodyguard all those years - it isn't just about having someone to boss around or a bit of muscle, but having a secret weapon everyone underestimates. And now Crabbe has enough confidence to try to make it on his own. (I think someone else cast a Disillusionment Charm besides DD and V when they picked Harry up from the Dursleys in OotP, but I can't remember whether it was Moody, Tonks, or Lupin and don't have the books to check. But it was someone trained in advanced defensive magic, so your point about it being a tough charm probably holds.) And once again, Draco can't stand the thought of murder, even if it's not him doing the murdering.
It's quite sad to see how Harry moved from the kid who at least leafed through his schoolbooks before school started (PS/SS) to one who won't even read crucial information for his quest when he has a year with little else to do.
There's still a niggling question about Albania for me, namely, why did Bertha Jorkins go on vacation there? Maybe because so much of the country is mountainous and isolated, wizards think it's a great spot to not have to worry about hiding, or maybe they go there for the great variety of plant life to use in potions... but surely it isn't the only isolated, flora-rich spot in Europe? Plus, depending on where they land/Portkey/whatever, they might have ended up in some nasty situations in Albania of the 90s. Why not visit the magical chocolate factories in also-mountainous Swizterland instead? (You know they must have them!) It doesn't seem widely known that Helena Ravenclaw ever went there, and Pettigrew only went because he'd heard while in rat form that Voldemort was hiding there before Harry's first year and guessed right that he'd go back, so I doubt Bertha managed to remember something Barty Jr. said about it, because he wouldn't have known. Maybe they have a cheap Floo connection or bargain round-trip Portkeys for Albania, and that's why she picks it.
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One wonders if they picked up on some fans complaint that it seems pretty crappy if she did it to her parents without telling them. So maybe the movie is giving it more play than was ever given in the book.
I can't remember exactly how it went but always got the impression from the book that it was Hermione doing the spell wihtout her parents knowing anything. I never got the impression she told them what she was going to do to them or about the issues with Voldemort.
Who knows, maybe JKR has taken some looks at fan speculation or movie people got a wiff of the debates that have happened and are trying to give a better impression that was given in the book.
Reply
Another, more important reason, was JKR's desire for (unnecessary) exposition. Harry didn't need Helena's story to remember the diadem in RoR, but JKR wanted to give it, as she decided to show students' evacuation. Since all was done through Harry's pov, we got a protagonist standing around, as if he had all time in the world, with the flimsy excuse of being unable to think without his friends.
I also think being passive makes the decision to go to his death more believable. Somebody with a proactive approach, like teenage TR, would try to think about other way, at least for a few minutes,not immediately accept his fate. In general, proactive Harry wouldn't work in the series, in which the author wants to give out information according to the plot demands, not to what would happen in RL. See: Harry not asking about his parents' house & graves since JKR planned to visit them in DH. That's the main, going to the core cause of passivity.
As for Hermione, they wanted to show her room, parents & their house. I think we'll see them agreeing to the modification after talking to her and it'll be presented as tragic, but needed, decision. May be movie V & DEs, unlike their book counterparts, will be scarily effective and will target relatives of HP's closest friends and supporters, Muggle or not. By target I mean try to seize them all or, at least, question the moment Trio escape from the wedding. I still would make them only move to Australia, without modification, but the script writer believed JKR it was a must, so...
Crabbe is surprisingly magically talented! It adds another perspective to Draco keeping him as a bodyguard all those years - it isn't just about having someone to boss around or a bit of muscle
Didn't think about that, but you're right. Muscle is useless against 1st year level spells anyway, f.e. Stunning.
Reply
If the DEs are effective - and looking at the added Burrow-burning scene in HBP, they might be - that would make moving the Grangers to Australia a bit more logical. As it is, do we ever see Voldemort hunt down anyone's Muggle relatives besides his own? Random Muggles on a bridge, sure, but I don't think we ever heard that anything happened to Colin's or Justin's families, and despite the Dursleys going into hiding, we never heard about anything happening to them either.
The one good thing about seeing Hermione's room is that we'll actually see her having a tiny bit of a life outside the wizarding world, even if it's only for a few weeks a year. So it might seem like a real, painful situation rather than the equivalent of killing another redshirt like Charity Burbage (ie, not something that has much impact).
Now that we know Crabbe was Draco's silent and loyal magical support, we could probably draw some parallels to Harry and Hermione. (Well, she's not silent, but you know what I mean.)
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Sort-of like Peter Pettigrew, the kid who didn't shine as brightly as his cohort in crime but who still, nonetheless, managed an Animagus transfiguration by fifth year, spied in rat form, saved his own bacon by going into hiding in plain sight as the pet of a Hogwarts-bound kid. Wonder what all he might have picked up wandering the halls in complete safety as a rat all those years, ever since Percy was a firstie. And Crabbe, like Pettigrew, turned his back on his friends in the end and got what was coming.
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Not safely at all. The corridors of Hogwarts are constantly monitored by a cat, and there are owls flying through the castle every day.
I think Crabbe simply didn't care about formal learning and grades, but practical learning in areas that appealed to him he picked up nicely.
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I'm not sure being a study maven is a good thing in the Potterverse. Hermione studies but Harry and Ron both blow off the classes they don't like. Ron even gets a line that shows he doesn't think he or Harry need to listen in Potions so Crabbe isn't alone in only attending to what he likes.
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If Deathly Hallows camping trip with the trio is any evidence all three could should have blow off Hogwarts classes and gone to take some cooking classes from Mrs. Weasley. That way at least we could have skipped the OMG we can't find food and don't know how to get it stuff.
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