Finally done with uni for the semester! I was origianlly going to post a reply I'd written up at work, but I decided to write a new one instead. Partly because I lost the old one, and partly because fresh is best.
I said above that I agree with the "How can you expect a bunch of 21-year-olds to know what they want to do for the rest of their lives? " sentiment entirely and I still do. When I was in high-school and we had to nominate chosen careers and take aptitude tests and what not I thought it was all a bit of castle-in-the-sky fun at first. Then, when it started getting more serious and uni courses were looked at and real outcomes were considered, I started to believe that I actually had to make up my mind right then and there and whatever I decided was probably going to be what I ended up doing forever and ever. Of course, it doesn't have to be that way, but that's how society likes to push it and that is ridiculous.
In fact, I think part of the problem is how much people push "knowing what you want to do" and "serious careers" so young. I think that many of us who are talented in several different areas (yes, you are), and especially if we're talented in things that don't tend to translate well to the usual selection of "serious careers", are forced into positions where we never feel good enough for or interested enough in any of the apparently available jobs.
Sure, some people are able to know very early on what they want to be and are able to pursue that goal until they get it. The vast majority of people, I suspect, don't really know what they want to do but feel pressured to make a decision and do so without questioning it. It's the sheep mentality, for want of a better metaphor: I have to make a decision now because that is what everybody does at this stage. They slide into whatever is available and live the rest of their lives in tacit acceptance because, hey, everybody does. Then there is the minority of people who are, dare I say, intellectually honest enough to know that a) they have no idea what they want to do, and b) it is not enough to simply acquiesce to the pressure to slide into the first available position (with or without schooling). I think that probably you and I fit into that minority. Unfortunately, what with all the outside pressure and the pressure we put on ourselves to be able to fit all the expectations put out by the 'sheep' category who don't see that there is any choice in the matter, our apparent indecision can cause a truckload of misery and anxiety for us.
My story: I decided on psychology when I was about 10 years old on a whim because the girl next to me said she wanted to be a psychiatrist and I had no idea what I'd like to do, aside from being the next Virgin Mary or maybe a priest or a nun, none of which seemed like an appropriate answer. I stuck with this one through most of my schooling because whenever people asked, I had no better answer. By the time of the Serious Career Decisions I wanted to be a writer, but people seem to take that sort of future vocation as even less serious than my former religious aspirations. The psychologist answer carried through into uni, helped along by an apparently genuine interest in the topic, until I realised that my academic interest wouldn't be enough to make a "respectable career" out of - I really wanted to be a researcher, not a counsellor - so I switched into the good old back-up of "I'll be a teacher!" I'm still dithering now between putting myself on the path teaching English as a second language or trying to break into the world of publishing and editing. And then there's my secret double desires to continue on as an academic and/or write. (More about this in my reply to your comments on my journal.) But really, I have no idea. It seems such a waste to spend years and thousands of dollars training for one thing only to possibly find out a couple of years in that I never was suited to it in the first place.
But I guess the thing is that even if we do make a choice now, whatever that choice is, there is always the chance to change it later on. Of course, that might take sacrifices (which I am terrified of), but it's always possible. At least here. What is adult education like over in Japan?
You say "all these cranky old people at work who complain about how "kids these days" give up too quickly, that instead of sticking it out in a tough workplace they quit and find another job", so it seems as though there is little respect for anyone who realises that they're not suited to one job and attempts to find another. I know a bunch of people over here feel the same way. How pathetic! How utterly stupid! Perhaps that was what it was like in our parents generation, and all the generations before them, but for our generation things are very different. There's a trend in Australia for anyone older to pick on 'Gen Y' (our generation) for being too lazy, too self-entitled and generally all around 'not as hard-working and intelligent as we were/are!!' Well, if you want to make yourselves miserable go ahead. Most of us aren't actually lazy quitters, we're just open-minded enough to see that there are many options and opportunities for a fulfilling life out there and to take those options if and when the opportunity arises.
I do have to add, though, that the whole process does seem to be a lot tougher in Japan. I mean, the whole idea that you spend the final year and a half not attending classes in order to go job hunting just seems ridiculous! But I guess when "everybody" is going on way, it's hard to be the one sheep who dyes his wool pink (to complete my cheesy sheep analogy).
Also, "Most of the time I just want to drop everything and just spend the rest of my life flipping burgers." There is absolutely nothing wrong with this! Of course, given your multiple talents, I would hope that if you did decide to flip burgers for a living you'd continue to use them in other, if perhaps less immediately profitable, ways (like writing and illustrating a book!). But I totally relate to the feeling. In fact, half of me considers it a serious option for my own life.
Anyway, to paraphrase, the whole system is completely fucked up. Not just in terms of how the 'attending uni vs. job hunting' works, but the whole shebang. Way too much pressure and no where near enough realistic expectations.
Especially this part: I think that many of us who are talented in several different areas (yes, you are), and especially if we're talented in things that don't tend to translate well to the usual selection of "serious careers", are forced into positions where we never feel good enough for or interested enough in any of the apparently available jobs.
Sure, some people are able to know very early on what they want to be and are able to pursue that goal until they get it. The vast majority of people, I suspect, don't really know what they want to do but feel pressured to make a decision and do so without questioning it. It's the sheep mentality, for want of a better metaphor: I have to make a decision now because that is what everybody does at this stage. They slide into whatever is available and live the rest of their lives in tacit acceptance because, hey, everybody does. Then there is the minority of people who are, dare I say, intellectually honest enough to know that a) they have no idea what they want to do, and b) it is not enough to simply acquiesce to the pressure to slide into the first available position (with or without schooling). I think that probably you and I fit into that minority.
That part really helps, a lot. I've felt so inferior for not knowing what to do-- everyone seems to have at least some kind of an idea and are doing all the right things to work towards it, and I've been feeling kind of like a baby for not being where they are. But what you said really puts things into perspective and makes me feel okay about having absolutely no clue what I want. Of course it doesn't change the fact that I'm completely confused, but it makes me feel a lot better.
What is adult education like in Japan? -- Do you mean can a person go back to university to pursue an education in a different field after they've already gone onto a career? If that is what you mean, yes, we can do that. It's not extremely common but it is entirely possible, although I imagine terrifying.
Well, if you want to make yourselves miserable go ahead. Most of us aren't actually lazy quitters, we're just open-minded enough to see that there are many options and opportunities for a fulfilling life out there and to take those options if and when the opportunity arises. -- I completely agree with this! I mean obviously you can't quit as soon as things get tough. I believe in giving things a chance, and waiting until the storm has passed. But if you're absolutely sure that what you're doing is not right for you, and you're completely miserable, there really is no need to keep yourself in that situation. I think making that decision takes a lot more courage than just letting yourself stay where you are.
As to the flipping burgers idea, I might not do that exactly. But I am seriously considering that kind of job where you're not so tied down as much, although the money/benefits are virtually non-existent. Maybe teaching English at a cram school on weekdays. And for emotional, internal fulfillment, I'd volunteer on the weekends. I'd be comfortably busy-ish (but not so busy that I'd feel consumed by my job, the way a lot of people center their entire lives around their careers), but not so busy that I wouldn't have any time for myself to do the silly little things I like to do sometimes. Like occasionally knitting, or drawing, or watching movies, or reading, or making little stuffed toys, or taking pictures, or writing.
I feel like maybe that kind of lifestyle would be more fitting for people like us. I'm not saying there's not a real career that would be right for you, or that you're not capable of something like that (you know me, I have no doubts whatsoever in your abilities!). But we're sort of dreamers, I think, and we like the little things in life. We like to sit at home with a cup of hot chocolate, reading a book or listening to the rain. I think we need the freedom and space to move around and explore. At least for me, I feel like if I let my job = my life, I'd lose the time and the freedom to do these things and eventually I'd just quit because I need these little things, they are what I find comfort and beauty in, they are the things that keep me going.
ANYWAY thank you again for your comment. It really means a lot to me and has opened my eyes to the fact that ITS OKAY to be confused and ITS OKAY to change my mind. It's a breath of fresh air. I feel like I've been in a crowded musty hot room and you've cracked the window open.
I know that we will both be able to find our place someday, and until then I hope that we'll both be able to forgive ourselves for changing our minds and that we'll have the courage to act on it.
But we're sort of dreamers, I think, and we like the little things in life. We like to sit at home with a cup of hot chocolate, reading a book or listening to the rain. I think we need the freedom and space to move around and explore. At least for me, I feel like if I let my job = my life, I'd lose the time and the freedom to do these things and eventually I'd just quit because I need these little things, they are what I find comfort and beauty in, they are the things that keep me going.
This is so true for me, too. It makes me so happy that you understand and experience this, too, because so few people seem to and that can make things - life; living - quite difficult.
Thank you for this reply. It really means a lot. =)
I said above that I agree with the "How can you expect a bunch of 21-year-olds to know what they want to do for the rest of their lives? " sentiment entirely and I still do.
When I was in high-school and we had to nominate chosen careers and take aptitude tests and what not I thought it was all a bit of castle-in-the-sky fun at first. Then, when it started getting more serious and uni courses were looked at and real outcomes were considered, I started to believe that I actually had to make up my mind right then and there and whatever I decided was probably going to be what I ended up doing forever and ever. Of course, it doesn't have to be that way, but that's how society likes to push it and that is ridiculous.
In fact, I think part of the problem is how much people push "knowing what you want to do" and "serious careers" so young. I think that many of us who are talented in several different areas (yes, you are), and especially if we're talented in things that don't tend to translate well to the usual selection of "serious careers", are forced into positions where we never feel good enough for or interested enough in any of the apparently available jobs.
Sure, some people are able to know very early on what they want to be and are able to pursue that goal until they get it. The vast majority of people, I suspect, don't really know what they want to do but feel pressured to make a decision and do so without questioning it. It's the sheep mentality, for want of a better metaphor: I have to make a decision now because that is what everybody does at this stage. They slide into whatever is available and live the rest of their lives in tacit acceptance because, hey, everybody does. Then there is the minority of people who are, dare I say, intellectually honest enough to know that a) they have no idea what they want to do, and b) it is not enough to simply acquiesce to the pressure to slide into the first available position (with or without schooling). I think that probably you and I fit into that minority. Unfortunately, what with all the outside pressure and the pressure we put on ourselves to be able to fit all the expectations put out by the 'sheep' category who don't see that there is any choice in the matter, our apparent indecision can cause a truckload of misery and anxiety for us.
My story:
I decided on psychology when I was about 10 years old on a whim because the girl next to me said she wanted to be a psychiatrist and I had no idea what I'd like to do, aside from being the next Virgin Mary or maybe a priest or a nun, none of which seemed like an appropriate answer. I stuck with this one through most of my schooling because whenever people asked, I had no better answer. By the time of the Serious Career Decisions I wanted to be a writer, but people seem to take that sort of future vocation as even less serious than my former religious aspirations. The psychologist answer carried through into uni, helped along by an apparently genuine interest in the topic, until I realised that my academic interest wouldn't be enough to make a "respectable career" out of - I really wanted to be a researcher, not a counsellor - so I switched into the good old back-up of "I'll be a teacher!" I'm still dithering now between putting myself on the path teaching English as a second language or trying to break into the world of publishing and editing. And then there's my secret double desires to continue on as an academic and/or write. (More about this in my reply to your comments on my journal.) But really, I have no idea. It seems such a waste to spend years and thousands of dollars training for one thing only to possibly find out a couple of years in that I never was suited to it in the first place.
Reply
You say "all these cranky old people at work who complain about how "kids these days" give up too quickly, that instead of sticking it out in a tough workplace they quit and find another job", so it seems as though there is little respect for anyone who realises that they're not suited to one job and attempts to find another. I know a bunch of people over here feel the same way. How pathetic! How utterly stupid! Perhaps that was what it was like in our parents generation, and all the generations before them, but for our generation things are very different. There's a trend in Australia for anyone older to pick on 'Gen Y' (our generation) for being too lazy, too self-entitled and generally all around 'not as hard-working and intelligent as we were/are!!' Well, if you want to make yourselves miserable go ahead. Most of us aren't actually lazy quitters, we're just open-minded enough to see that there are many options and opportunities for a fulfilling life out there and to take those options if and when the opportunity arises.
I do have to add, though, that the whole process does seem to be a lot tougher in Japan. I mean, the whole idea that you spend the final year and a half not attending classes in order to go job hunting just seems ridiculous! But I guess when "everybody" is going on way, it's hard to be the one sheep who dyes his wool pink (to complete my cheesy sheep analogy).
Also, "Most of the time I just want to drop everything and just spend the rest of my life flipping burgers." There is absolutely nothing wrong with this! Of course, given your multiple talents, I would hope that if you did decide to flip burgers for a living you'd continue to use them in other, if perhaps less immediately profitable, ways (like writing and illustrating a book!). But I totally relate to the feeling. In fact, half of me considers it a serious option for my own life.
Anyway, to paraphrase, the whole system is completely fucked up. Not just in terms of how the 'attending uni vs. job hunting' works, but the whole shebang. Way too much pressure and no where near enough realistic expectations.
Reply
Especially this part:
I think that many of us who are talented in several different areas (yes, you are), and especially if we're talented in things that don't tend to translate well to the usual selection of "serious careers", are forced into positions where we never feel good enough for or interested enough in any of the apparently available jobs.
Sure, some people are able to know very early on what they want to be and are able to pursue that goal until they get it. The vast majority of people, I suspect, don't really know what they want to do but feel pressured to make a decision and do so without questioning it. It's the sheep mentality, for want of a better metaphor: I have to make a decision now because that is what everybody does at this stage. They slide into whatever is available and live the rest of their lives in tacit acceptance because, hey, everybody does. Then there is the minority of people who are, dare I say, intellectually honest enough to know that a) they have no idea what they want to do, and b) it is not enough to simply acquiesce to the pressure to slide into the first available position (with or without schooling). I think that probably you and I fit into that minority.
That part really helps, a lot. I've felt so inferior for not knowing what to do-- everyone seems to have at least some kind of an idea and are doing all the right things to work towards it, and I've been feeling kind of like a baby for not being where they are. But what you said really puts things into perspective and makes me feel okay about having absolutely no clue what I want. Of course it doesn't change the fact that I'm completely confused, but it makes me feel a lot better.
What is adult education like in Japan? -- Do you mean can a person go back to university to pursue an education in a different field after they've already gone onto a career? If that is what you mean, yes, we can do that. It's not extremely common but it is entirely possible, although I imagine terrifying.
Well, if you want to make yourselves miserable go ahead. Most of us aren't actually lazy quitters, we're just open-minded enough to see that there are many options and opportunities for a fulfilling life out there and to take those options if and when the opportunity arises. -- I completely agree with this! I mean obviously you can't quit as soon as things get tough. I believe in giving things a chance, and waiting until the storm has passed. But if you're absolutely sure that what you're doing is not right for you, and you're completely miserable, there really is no need to keep yourself in that situation. I think making that decision takes a lot more courage than just letting yourself stay where you are.
Reply
I feel like maybe that kind of lifestyle would be more fitting for people like us. I'm not saying there's not a real career that would be right for you, or that you're not capable of something like that (you know me, I have no doubts whatsoever in your abilities!). But we're sort of dreamers, I think, and we like the little things in life. We like to sit at home with a cup of hot chocolate, reading a book or listening to the rain. I think we need the freedom and space to move around and explore. At least for me, I feel like if I let my job = my life, I'd lose the time and the freedom to do these things and eventually I'd just quit because I need these little things, they are what I find comfort and beauty in, they are the things that keep me going.
ANYWAY thank you again for your comment. It really means a lot to me and has opened my eyes to the fact that ITS OKAY to be confused and ITS OKAY to change my mind.
It's a breath of fresh air. I feel like I've been in a crowded musty hot room and you've cracked the window open.
I know that we will both be able to find our place someday, and until then I hope that we'll both be able to forgive ourselves for changing our minds and that we'll have the courage to act on it.
Reply
This is so true for me, too. It makes me so happy that you understand and experience this, too, because so few people seem to and that can make things - life; living - quite difficult.
Thank you for this reply. It really means a lot. =)
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