SPN Fic: The Human Factor

[dodger_winslow]

Okay, this one kinda went the weird way around the block before it got here.

I started out writing a SPN_500 Challenge ficlet just cause I was bored, and this notion appealed to me in a much longer applications, but I didn't really want to go as angsty as it wanted to be in a longer form, so I thought I'd give her a whirl in the 500 words or less

Comments

[tsuki_no_bara]

i like how matter-of-fact dean is about having to puke - just "pull over" and then "sorry." i imagine killing your first demonthing, especially after it's gone back to looking human, would be really difficult. john's justification, that it had to be done because she'd killed a lot of people and would keep doing it, sounds like something dean would say later on, if sam had a problem killing something. very dispassionate and pragmatic.

i'm not sure i buy john telling dean he's proud of him, altho i think dean killing the thing without complication or fuss is something john could respect, and i believe john WOULD be proud of him, i'm just not sure how often he ever said it. i'd buy it for this being dean's first time, tho. also i can kind of see john admitting sam couldn't have done it - i don't doubt he trained them the same but i can imagine john seeing different strengths in his boys, and sam's strength wasn't really killing things, not like this.

[adelheide]

Agreed. I think John would be proud of Dean, but I don't think he would verbalize it. I think John relied on a lot of non-verbal communication. But I think the tone and Dean's actions were spot on.

[dodger_winslow]

I see John's communications as both non-verbal and misdirective, as well as often emotionally constipated. Which is a bit where he is in this, too ... saying "I'm proud of you" when what he really means is "you did the right thing." And equally saying "I can trust you, I always could" when he really means "I've loved you since you were born, boy; and even when you were five, you were my little man and I've never failed to notice that, even if I don't often say it

[adelheide]

John's nod of acknowledgement about Dean having to puke rings very true for me. He didnt' give Dean a hard time about it. He understood the reason and let Dean be. That was very John.

And yes, I can see him saying one think when he really means another. But I don't think Dean heard the words enough, which is why his need for John's approval (almost desperate, when we first met him) strikes me as the behavior of someone who never got a lot of verbal approval. That and Dean's inability to put value and importance on his own life tells me that he didn't hear the words. John may have been behaving in a way that John thought was supportive and yes, males are much more non-verbally communicative, but hearing the words are important, too. And I don't think Dean did.

[dodger_winslow]

I can see why you might hold this stance as a personal interpretation of what we've seen. I'm not sure I can go to the idea that he can't have ever heard them before though. I think we all see the probabilities a little differently; but I tend to want to explore the possibilities, rathe than the probabilities, with my fic choices

[adelheide]

Yes. Um, no. Well, maybe

[dodger_winslow]

Yes. Um, no. Well, maybe.

LOL. Well, that pretty much covers all the bases.

Dean feels that blind loyalty is a sign of being a good son.

Nothing in there that says John hasn't told him he's proud of him for being that blindly loyal good son. ;)

In DT, how does Dean know that there is something wrong with John? Because John compliments him.

Not necessarily. Because of the tone of John's voice. Or the way he chooses to word the compliment. Or his timing of the compliment. Or the fact that he compliments him WHEN he does for WHAT he does, when Dean knows that his dad wouldn't consider this a thing to compliment. Doesn't mean Dean hasn't ever heard that his dad is proud of him, from his dad. Just that he knows this isn't one of the instances John would say such a thing. But you're the one that's assuming that extends to the idea John wouldn't say such a thing at all. There's no aired canon that I've seen that supports such an assumption.

But I love your willingness to cover all the bases anyway. :D

[dodger_winslow]

Thanks. I was afraid I'd catch some flak about the "pull over" thing and the "sorry" ... especially in context of the fact that John offered no comfort here at all, just a nod of acknowledgement and a return to the road. But even if I do catch flak for it, it's worth it 'cause when my husband read it, he looked at me and said, "I love you." Which is his way of saying thank you for writing men like men rather than little girls. LOL

[tsuki_no_bara]

>> especially in context of the fact that John offered no comfort here at all, just a nod of acknowledgement and a return to the road<<

but i really liked that - it seemed like something john would do, and i'm not sure dean would know how to handle any kind of comfort anyway. and i do think john might tell dean he was proud of him for his first kill, because it's the first kill and it seems like it actually went ok. i don't think john said it many other times, tho. and because even tho dean's kind of stoic in his puking, he's bothered by the killing, and saying "i'm proud of you" and "it had to be done" might be the only comfort john can give, and i don't believe he's that much of a stone that he wouldn't at least try to ease his son's discomfort. i don't think he did it often, tho.

>>John trusts Dean far more than he ever would trust Sam ... for exactly this reason. Because Sam couldn't pull the trigger when he had to, and Dean did.... )

[dodger_winslow]

but man, would that have screwed him up.... well, more than he is already.

Ah. *happy sigh* That sounds like a really good reason to write fanfic, doesn't it? :D

[tsuki_no_bara]

...i forgot to mention the first time that i really like how the fic is paced - it's spread out and kind of quiet and sparse, which i think fits really well with how dean and john deal with these kinds of things.

[dodger_winslow]

Thanks! I was trying to make it clear that these events where separated by long stretches of driving-not-talking, and that John's periodic "you done good" expressions weren't all bunched up together, but rather, were the kind of thing that tended to pop up without warning, cause he's trying to figure out a way to help Dean, not to just compliment him. I'm glad it came across that way, cause I thought the timeframes were important.