quotes and notes [ SANDMAN ]
[lucifer] "Hello. Hello, Dream. Etrigan, please leave us. We hear you were caught by mortals, like a newly fledged demon, sweet Morpheus. We expected better of you. Still. You are here now. Have you come to join forces? To ally your realm to ours? To acknowledge the sovereignty of hell?
[dream] you know my views on that, lightbringer
[lucifer] "Yes. Yes, we do. Your family are well, I trust? Destiny, Death, Despair, and the others? No matter. We assume that this is no social call. . . What do you want?"
[lucifer] "Azazel will join us shortly. He is the third lord of hell. Some years ago the dark, the shadow creature, came forth to challenge heaven the episode ended in . . . perhaps a stalemate. But the civil war in hell that ensued tripped the precarious balance of power. We rule in coalition now, Azazel, Beelzebub and I."
[dream] I thank you. The kings of hell are honorable. I will remember this.
[lucifer] "Honorable? You joke, surely. Look around you, Morpheus. The million lords of hell stand arrayed about you. Tell us why we should let you leave? Helmet or no, you have no power here -- what power have dreams in hell?"
[dream] ... ... Ask yourselves, all of you... what power would HELL have if those here imprisoned were NOT able to DREAM of HEAVEN?
[lucifer] "One day, my brothers ... one day I shall destroy him."
This is from A HOPE IN HELL ( The Sandman ). It's the first appearance of Lucifer, and his appearance as the Devil. Dream enters Hell to retrieve his helm and must play a game against Choronzon to win it back. Dream wins and Lucifer pulls that stunt at the end. It should be noted that Lucifer uses a whacky font, also that he speaks in the first person plural - a sign of his ruling. We also know that while Lucifer has ruled Hell by himself in the past it is currently a triad - though in some ways we also know this to be a bit of a falsehood because he could probably wipe the floor with Beelzebub and Azazel without breaking a sweat. This is one of the few times that we, the reader, will ever see Lucifer doing his Devil thing - he's pretty invested in it. The small games and small mindedness of it, and the swearing of vengeance for such a small slight.
Once upon a time, there was a place that wasn't a place. It had many names: Avernus, Gehenna, Tartarus, Hades, Abaddon, Sheol...It was an inferno of pain and flame and ice, where every nightmare had come true long since. We'll call it Hell. It was not considered a pleasant place by the majority of its inhabitants; however, being dead, and being there ( as they imagined ) against their will, their opinions counted for little. And indeed, had hell been pleasant, they would have felt cheated: they were there for pain, for suffering, for torment. Which they received in abundance. The other inhabitants of this place were not dead; however, neither were they alive, in any biological sense of the word. Humanity called them demons without understanding what it had named. There was little that demonkind had in common with the legions of damned souls with whom they shared the infernal marches. However, they were all agreed on one thing. This was as bad as it got. It couldn't get any worse.
THIS IS GAIMAN'S HELL, also now we're into the SEASONS OF MISTS, it will be shown slightly differently in Lucifer. Gaiman also says, in the Sandman Companion, that he made his version of Hell based off of Milton's in Paradise Lost only with edits that were necessary since he was working within the constraints of the DCU.
[dream] ... He was the Creator's finest creation: the angel Samael, called Lucifer. It means "the bringer of light." Of all the angels he was the wisest, the most beautiful, the most powerful. Saving only his Creator, he is, perhaps, the most powerful being there is.
[matthew] More poweful than you?
[dream] Oh yes. By far.
Gaiman mentions in the SC that this is important because of the immense power that Dream has. This is another slight contradiction to Lucifer - since Michael is also very powerful ( though the slowness of Michael to act as well as his general temperament and belief set, perhaps, would shift the scales in these respects ).
[lucifer] "Cain. You must know, of course, of the Cainites?" ... "Gnostic sect. Second century. They rejected the books of the New Testament in favor of the Gospel of Judas. They believed that we created the heaven and the earth, and that you were the persecuted part in that unfortunate affair with your brother. They also held that the way to salvation was to give way to lust and temptation in all things. And no greater percentage of them turned up here than any other religion. Amusing isn't it?." ... "You know... your Lord Morpheus embarrassed us, publicly; that we swore then we would destroy him..." ... "And now, he's returning to Hell..." ... "Well, well, well ... he's coming back. Isn't that wonderful."
"Below you is our domain, first-born man. Look at it. What do you think? Home to millions of demons, to an uncountable number of mortal souls. Do you think they are happy? Why, just recently one of the minor demons -- some little yellow rhymer -- thought to declare himself a king of hell, to usurp the triumvirate... it came to nothing. These things never do. But perhaps it made him happy. Briefly. We wonder why they bother. These little demons... They come to our palace and say, "We have battled: There will be a coalition." We say, very well. And they oust each other, and destroy each other, and it matters not. Or they say, "Lucifer, you are deposed, you are no longer king of hell -- as if merely saying something were enough to make it true. They believe themselves Lucifer's equals, Cain, all these pitiful little gnats. But there is only one that we have ever owned to be our superior. There is but one greater than us. And to Him... to him we no longer speak."
"Still. "Better to rein in hell, than serve in heaven." Eh, little brother-killer?" ... "We didn't say it. Milton said it. And he was blind." ... "Ohhh... go back to your master. Tell him we received his message. Tell him that we will be waiting for him. Tell him... Tell him that Hell is... anticipating... his visit -- most avidly. Now go."
"Hola! You! All of you -- demons and damned, nobles and slaves. It is Lucifer who speaks, the first among the fallen. Hear our words. It was ten billion years ago that we first came to this place. Ten billion years ago we first began to reign. Since then, one by one, willingly or otherwise, each of you has followed us here. You have taken up residence in this world. Taken your opportunities for pain and pleasure. In Hell you have fought and eaten, screwed and screamed, rejoiced and hated and hurt. Now, we discover, with, we must admit a certain perverse delight, that one more comes here. Morpheus of the Endless. The Dreamlord. The news of his visit has crystallized certain matters we have been pondering for millennia. Listen, damned children. This day Morpheus is coming to us, in a futile attempt to free one he loves from our domain. Some say that one day in hell is much like all the rest. That in this place of flux eternal, nothing changes. But this day in hell. This day you shall all remember for ever. And so shall he."
I mainly copied this down so that I could get a good picture of this part of the voice - not to mention there is a bit of the situation of Hell here, some of its history from the point of view of Lucifer, that bit about Milton and the Cainites. There's a bit of a shout out to the larger DCU ( Etrigan is mentioned here, the rhymer ) and Lucifer's opinions on the lesser demons :X. And then, of course, the mention of God. Then there is how he addresses the damned before he frees them all and shuts the gates of Hell.
Dream comes to Hell, Lucifer is like ARE YOU AFRAID OF ME and Morpheus is like yes and Lucifer is like VERY WELL and gives his word not to hurt Dream while he is within the bounds of Hell and then Lucifer is like >:D I'VE QUIT.
[lucifer] "Honestly, Morpheus. You need not stare at us -- at me rather -- with that ridiculous expression on your face."
[dream] I do not understand. There is some trick here, some stratagem or ruse...
[lucifer] "No. I've stopped. I've resigned. I am leaving. Can I make myself any plainer?"
Lucifer's speech is no longer written in his crazy font, it's plain comic sans. There's also the shift here from the first person plural to the singular. And Lucifer is rather happy. He's ecstatic. Also, Dream is someone who is supremely bound by duty - and Lucifer is someone who shrugs duty off rather easily ( though not, particularly, things that fall under duty that would harm his pride, it's an interesting situation when it comes to duty for him ).
[dream] How big is hell?
[lucifer] "How big? It's vast. Even I couldn't say for certain exactly how vast. It's almost a meaningless question -- like asking how big the silver city is, or how many are the fields of paradise. This realm is Heaven's shadow, remember. Or, more precisely, perhaps, Heaven's dark reflection -- like a landscape hanging inverted in the waters of a lake..."
aha! Now this is interesting - and mentioned in several places in Lucifer. The basic idea is that Hell must exist under God/Yahweh's world. If there is a heaven then there must be a hell. Also the dark reflection thing gives me a bit of a giggle.
[lucifer] "I keep telling you, Dream Lord. It's over. I am leaving. And I have closed down Hell."
[dream] How? How can you even...?
[lucifer] "Easy. Ten billion years I've spent in this place. That's a long time... ... and we've all changed, since the beginning. Even you dream lord. You were very different back then."
[dream] Perhaps, Prince Lucifer.
[lucifer] "You can forget the honorifics. Rank never mattered to me, not really. But the demons expected it ... ... which is one reason I've quit. There are others... I'm tired, Morpheus. So tired."
[lucifer] "You knew me, Dream. You knew me when I was an angel. What was I like?"
[dream] You were very proud, Samael. But you were also very beautiful, and wise -- and passionate.
[lucifer] "Was I? Yes... Yes, I was. I cared about so many things. I cared so deeply, back then, in the cold at the beginning of things. In the silver city." ... "I suppose that was why everything began to go wrong. You know... I still wonder how much of it was planned. How much of it He knew in advance." ... "I thought I was rebelling. I thought I was defying his rule. No... I was merely fulfilling another tiny segment of his great and powerful plan. If I had not rebelled, another would have, in my stead. Raguel, perhaps. Or Sandalphon." ... "We fell, my comrades in arms and I. We fell so far... so long. And after an eternity of falling, we came to rest in this place. And I knew then that there was no way I would ever return to paradise..."
[lucifer] "But I'm woolgathering. I apologize. ..." ...
[lucifer] "You also rule a world, Morpheus. A world of sleepers and dreamers. Of stories. A simple place -- compared to Hell. I envy you. Can you imagine what it was like? Ten billion years spent providing a place for dead mortals to torture themselves. And like all masochists they called the shots -- "burn me" "freeze me" "eat me" "hurt me" ... and we did."
[lucifer] "And then there were the demonkind. Imagine being their lord and master. A handful of them were once angels, who fell with me at the dawn. Others strayed here from elsewhere, over the aeons, making this place a home. And soon I found myself their lord and master. A million of them, or more, squabbling and warring and carrying on... I watched their strange little fashions the centuries they spent wearing the bodies of animals... the ridiculous vogue for rhyme to denote status -- demons who spoke exclusively in villanelles, haiku or troilets... and above all, the fashion in intrigue. In the beginning I enjoyed it. I was -- I am -- more powerful than any of them. I could have destroyed any of them -- perhaps even all of them -- without much effort. So I manipulated them; set them one against the other; let them faction and divide and plot. But... But I grew weary, dream lord. Mightily weary. I ceased to care."
[lucifer] "And the mortals! I ask you -- why? Tell me that -- why?"
[dream] "Why" what, first among the fallen?
[lucifer] "Why do they blame me for all their little failings?"
[lucifer] "They use my name as if I spend my entire day sitting on their shoulders, forcing them to commit acts they would otherwise find repulsive."
[lucifer] " 'The devil made me do it.' I have never made one of them do anything. Never. They live their own tiny lives. I do not live their lives for them."
[lucifer] "And then they die, and they come here ( having transgressed against what they believed to be right), and expect us to fulfill their desire for pain and retribution. I don't make them come here."
[lucifer] "They talk of me going around and buying souls, like a fishwife come market day, never stopping to ask themselves why. I need no souls. And how can anyone own a soul? No. They belong to themselves... ... They just hate to have to face up to it."
Wow, does he know how to talk. ANYWAY. This is all said as he locks up Hell, clearly he has had a bit of a tirade building over th epast like 10 billion years or whatever. Here we have a big crux in Lucifer's character as well. He thought he was rebelling. He wanted out of God's plan, but in doing so that was part of the plan. In the SC Gaiman says that Lucifer rebelled/was thrown out of Heaven because he refused to bow to Adam. That Lucifer loved God. This is in contradiction to Lucifer canon.
Part of what Gaiman says about Lucifer and Hell in The Sandman is that there is no proof that the devil ever damned anyone. In fact, some of the stragglers in Hell do not wish to leave because they are still punishing themselves. He says here that he never had any use for souls, as well. We get more of Lucifer's immense power mentioned here as well as more of his character. He doesn't really care for honoriffics, I suspect because of that expectation bit. People want there to be a ruler in place of their planned lives. ( He does, however, not quarrel with Mazikeen when she chooses to call him Lord ).
He does say that he did enjoy being Lord of Hell for a while! It was easy and interesting and he was deluded into thinking he had finally escaped his (F)ather's machinations.
He says he rebelled but that was forever ago and he has sent all the inhabitants away and he has no idea where he will go. He cannot return to the silver city.
[lucifer] "Innocence once lost, can never be regained."
He's all WELL I GUESS I CAN DO ANYTHING :3 go lie on a beach, listen to music, buy a house, learn how to dance or play the piano~~.
Morpheus is like BUT WE WERE GONNA FIGHT and Lucifer is like pshwaaa don't want to I am tired of that and Morpheus is like BUT YOUR RESPONSIBILITIES and Lucifer is like :'D I don't have any anymore. Hell is closed.
[lucifer] "It is enough for me to know that you care for me, Mazikeen. I thank you. Now go. Goodbye, Mazikeen. You are very beautiful."
And once they are outside of Hell... he's like :'D Well, I swore I would destroy you. HERE HAVE THE KEY TO HELL :'D....
[lucifer] "Perhaps it will destroy you, and perhaps it won't. But I doubt it will make your life any easier. It's all yours, now, Morpheus, you're the sole monarch of a locked and empty hell. Perhaps I ought to have given it to you with my best wishes. I could have told you that I hoped it would bring you happiness. But somehow... ...Somehow I doubt it will."
[death] Of course I know. He gave you Hell. The most desirable plot of psychic real estate in the whole order of created things, and now it's all yours.
This is just a charming collection of quotes. I collected them because I was charmed!! I enjoy Morpheus's flabbergastedness. He has no idea how someone could just abandon his responsibilities like that - in a way the Endless are their responsibilities ( except Destruction ) and the thread of obedience is terribly interesting to follow through all of the higher powers in the Sandmanverse. BUT ANYWAY. Lucifer waves goodbye and leaves.
I included the Mazikeen quote because I heart Mazikeen.
The last two quotes are pretty much plot points. Lucifer never goes back on his word, and he did vow to destroy Dream, so there is this last sort of thrust towards it. And Death emphasizes this by saying how desirable it is.
The silver city. It cannot be visited. The inhabitants of the city were created in the same breath as the city itself, in the darkness before time. Before the first dawn, the silver city was. It is not paradise. It is not heaven. It is the silver city, that is not part of the order of created things. The inhabitants of the city possess names, and identities. Perhaps they possess something we might recognize as free will; perhaps not.
[GOD-IN-REMIEL] There must be a hell. There must be a place for the demons; a place for the damned. Hell is Heaven's reflection. It is heaven's shadow. They define each other. Reward and punishment; hope and despair. There must be a hell, for without a hell, heaven has no meaning. And thus hell must be...
Just a bit on the Silver City. And, of course, another emphasis on Hell being part of the Plan. Which, again, slightly contradicts Lucifer.
[remiel] "The early bird catches the worm, Star of Morning. The, um, worm that dieth not, in this case. Eh? haha..."
[lucifer] "How remarkably funny, Remiel. Not actually original though, of course."
[lucifer] "So, you're in charge down in my old haunts, eh? I wonder who the great-and-powerful has set over those who rise, in your absence." ... "My mistake. Of course you do. And I'm sure you just can't shut Duma up. It must be just brimming over with co-monarchical advice." ... "Just sits there and plays with my old front-door key, and watches you, eh? And never says a thing. I bet that drives you quite mad." ... "No, forget I said that. It's none of my business. 'There's so much good in the worst of us,' and all that." ... "Of course they must; and what an exciting and innovative opinion yours must be. What a sweet idea. So. You're having a wonderful time, and you've been redecorating. I'm thrilled."
[lucifer] "So you aren't sitting around down there going, 'oh, if only Lucifer would come back and take this shit-pit off our hands and let us return to the gentle contemplative ecstasy of the silver city?' "
[lucifer] "Been there, Remiel. Done that. Wore the tee shirt, ate the burger, bought the original cast album, choreographed the legions of the damned and orchestrated the screaming..." .. "Honesty is a somewhat overrated virtue, Remiel. Honesty, for example, would compel me to admit that I have never liked you. Even when I was an angel. I didn't like you. Also, I never respected you."
[lucifer] "You didn't join the rebellion, not because you felt I was wrong, but because you were too damned scared. What would you have done, had I won? Told me that you'd always supported me ideologically? That you were secretly cheering me on the whole time?"
[lucifer] "Tell me, Remiel... What did you do when the order came for yout o spread your wings and reign in Hell? Did you whimper? Did you wail? Somehow, I confess I find myself certain that Duma was the one actually to take the key. Duma always struck me as having some backbone..."
[lucifer] "Remiel... You know, when I gave up Hell, I gave up none of my powers, none of my skills. I was captain of the host of heaven. Later, I was the adversary." ... "Now at present, it is true, I am a simple, private individual. But if I could wipe out your existence with as few consequences as I wiped your spittle from my face... you would no longer exist. I could do it. I choose not to. Go now. I will talk to you no further."
... This really just sums up Remiel and Lucifer's relationship pretty well, up to this point. This is also Lucifer's opinion in ever retaking Hell. He doesn't want it back. Lucifer doesn't want power, it is inconsenquential next to freedom. He also sees many of the angels on individual levels, which is interesting to me. Also, the rebellion bit, since he must have known more angels were dissatisfied but did not fall with him.
Annnd, by the ed of Volume 8 of The Sandman the narrational box tells us that Lucifer feels ready to move on again. I am not entirely sure how Sandman and Lucifer line up chronologically within themselves. We know in The Wake Mazikeen still has half of a face, we also know that when Lucifer gives the dream to Elaine's otherfather Morpheus is still around. IDK MY BFF CONTINUITY.