Cultural question to my American friends

[dieastra]

I have a cultural question to my American friends, please. I recently watched the movie "Tangled" in which Rapunzel is born as a princess to a king and his wife. Then she gets stolen. In the original German version it was a poor mother who went to a forbidden garden to eat some Rapunzel (salad) when she was pregnant and the woman that the garden

Comments

[elrhiarhodan]

Hi!

American here, and I can tell you that I grew up with the Grimm Brothers' version where Rapunzel's mother begged her husband (and presumably Rapunzel's father) to go to the witch's garden and steal some rampion. I had no clue that the name "Rapunzel" was in anyway related to that.

ETA: The parents were poor, not a king or queen.

This is the version I grew up with.

[dieastra]

Hiya, thanks for answering!
Right, I might have butchered my Grimm's tale here a bit, it's been a while that I read it. The husband getting them for her sounds right though.

I had tried to find a picture of Rapunzel salad when making the post but it seems to apply to several things and the meaning is not quite clear. It should look like this though: http://images.eatsmarter.de/sites/default/files/styles/576x432/public/images/warenkunde-feldsalat-341x256.jpg

Thanks for the link, I shall read that! One wonders though why she was not named "Rampion" in the English version then? They did, after all, change Aschenputtel to Cinderella, so why not here?

[elrhiarhodan]

I think Cinderella is better known through the French version, by Charles Perrault, rather than through the Grimm Bros version, hence the name.

The stories are rather universal.

[dieastra]

Ah! That could be it, yeah. And it's true, many stories from different countries are similar.
It's interesting to talk about such things, I remember the day I realized what the word Cinderella actually means, that it is not just a pretty name, but it is made of Cinder and Ella.

[traycer_]

I too am American, but I've never heard of the salad version of this story. I do remember that there was a witch involved. Maybe Disney heard the same version of the story that I heard.

ETA: And now that I think about it a little more, I think there was a salad, so please disregard my earlier comment. :) I'm just going to slink away now ...

[dieastra]

I just got this link from a friend: http://pinkmonkey.com/dl/library1/story127.pdf and it says indeed that she was making a salad of rampion. I wonder though why they did not name her Rampion then! That would have been logical.

[wanderingsmith]

I have crap for memory so I don't know about salad or the details. but as to why we wouldn't question the name.. to my canadian ears Rapunzel is no weirder than Cinderella (the fact that you can use 'cinder' to tease the girl for being dirty doesn't explain the name to start...). or, hey, 'Snow White'... fairy tales have fairy tale names -shrug-

[dieastra]

Elrhiarodan above posted this link of the English fairytale version for us all to read: http://pinkmonkey.com/dl/library1/story127.pdf
There is indeed talk of a salad of rampions. So she should have been named Rampion ;)

The way I understand it, the girl was named Ella first, and then they put the Cinder in front, so as Cinder-Ella. Not sure that's right though. In German she is called Aschenputtel, and Asche means cinder as well.

At least with Snow White they explain where the name comes from, with her being as white as snow etc. At least I assume they do? And what you call sleeping beauty, is called Dornröschen in German - which means rose with a thorn or something like that.

Yeah, that's true about fairytale names, and this is one of the reasons I can't get into stories like Lord of the rings - too many weirdly spelled and pronounced names for my liking.

[wanderingsmith]

being as white as snow
yeah, but they always say that about princesses...

too many weirdly spelled and pronounced names for my liking.
snort! just as true in sci fi as it is in fantasy. or in history, for that matter, as soon as you change countries or go back too many centuries in your own country even

hell, even here. enough people of different nationalities that 'weird' names are pretty common.

[dieastra]

Huh, I guess you're right. Thinking back to my Stargate days, with Teal'c and Tok'ra and Goa'uld and Zat'nik'tel and Kelno'reem and... (why does it always have to be apostrophes?)

And the worst thing is, I didn't even have to think about this!

Okay, so it's not the names, but fantasy as a genre does not appeal to me. All those witches and wizards.

[owensheart]

The English version I know from my childhood is the same as your German version, I think Disney is just a law unto itself and changes things to suit its films.

[dieastra]

Yes I think you're right about Disney. Which is sad, as many people only know the Disney version and then think it is all true.