And I'm of the opinion that Dumbledore's plan came together in spite of his manipulations rather than because of them. There seems to have been very much left to chance. What if Harry and crew hadn't been captured and taken to Malfoy Manor? They may never have learned of the cup's location (unless I missed something in the "tell all" scene that explained where Dumbledore had plotted that out, too).
Actually, that's not quite the case. Remember that if they weren't taken, if they never learned the cup's location, Voldemort wouldn't realize Harry knew about Horcruxes, and Harry, Ron, and Hermione would be able to remain at large and continue looking. Eventually, they'd locate... and the same thing would happen. The chance part was that Harry got an opportunity to overpower Draco Malfoy, and become the master of the Elder Wand... but he does it again in the Room of Requirement, so it'd still work.
But no, Dumbledore did not plan that, and he shouldn't have. Something has to be left for Harry. Following a roadmap is not what heroes do.
Hmmm. The book was entertaining, with some great parts to it, but overall I feel the plot was too contrived, too complicated; the Deathly Hallows gimmick didn't work. I'm still recovering, though, and reading other people's (is that where I put the apostrophe?) opinions.
One thing DH proved, I think, is my assertion that HBP was a BAD BOOK. A book full of mainly useless filler.
He found out that Dumbledore was human, too.
One of the things that really amused me with HBP was the number of evil/stupid!Dumbledore fans that came out of the woodwork, and I myself thought that HBP showed Dumbledore to be a patronising evasive berk. So I rejoiced when Harry worked that out for himself, several times, in DH. I thought we'd be spared the usual Dumbledore-exposition-at-the-end chapter for the final book, given that he was DEAD and all, but, no, trust Dumledore to come back regardless. A most annoying wizard :-)
And I'm of the opinion that Dumbledore's plan came together in spite of his manipulations rather than because of them.You bet
( ... )
St. Margaret's is one of the places I saw that question. I put my answer in Tosca's journal first b/c I saw it there first and just decided to copy it here rather than going around to everyone's journal and giving my opinion.
Just poking back in your blog to see your DH commentary ... can you explain a couple of your ETAs? I don't think I saw them after commenting on the original pristine entry.
In your ETA #2 you wrote:
Also...did anyone notice that Voldemort asked "the deluded ones" if they "finally understand?" (this was after Harry's supposed death). I can't help but think that Jo is as tired of the wanking as the rest of the fandom.
I don't understand what you're getting at here; what 'wanking' in particular? Voldemort tells the assembled Hogwarts defenders that Harry had only ever prevailed through the sacrifice of others ... which wasn't quite correct - neither Cedric, Sirius or Dumbledore had *directly* defended Harry, had they? ... but there was a definite friends-of-Harry body count. Voldemort had a point.
And Ron's "He beat you!" resonse was just asinine head-in-the-sand bravado rubbish. Given that Harry's dead body (as far as he knew) was in front of him. Beaten
( ... )
Wow. Haven't really revisited DH in many months. Haven't kept up with the fandom at all rather than the occasional cursory glance. (I have a basic knowledge of the Lexicon kerfuffle, and that's about it).
ETA#2: If I recall, I was commenting more upon Jo's chosen phrasing rather than what was actually going on in the book at the time. To me, when I read it, it sounded like a thinly veiled reference - Jo asking the Harmonians (the deluded ones) if they finally got it now that the series is over.
And as far as the other question...the flayed baby was a piece of Voldemort's soul...that much was obvious. Why does it matter if it was the piece in Harry or the piece in Voldemort? I may have been mistaken about which person it actually resided in...I still got the message Jo was trying to convey. It never occurred to me to debate whether it was the bit in Harry or the bit in Voldie. That, to me, is beside the point.
Some fans are peeved with Rowling's continuous streams of interviews and such with her relentless attempts to explain what happened in the book and expand on her universe. She's been on record a couple of times saying "Harry's MINE" and "it's my world, my version of what came after is the official version", stuff like that (not those exact words). Some people hate those restrictions; me, I particularly hate her attempts to retroactively fix her flawed book or insert meanings that just aren't there. Grrrmph. Aren't you sad you missed all that? :-)
I never thought that the 'deluded' sentence was a slam at the H/Hr folk, and I'm one of them! Mind you, at that point in the book I think I was nodding my head in agreement with Voldemort and hoping he'd kill Harry for good this time. Well, okay, I wasn't that far gone, but was pretty apathetic at that stage.
That, to me, is beside the point.To me a lot of the fun is in the details ... and by NOT concentrating on the minutiae you're letting Rowling get away with her flawed plot. Oh
( ... )
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And Bathilda and Nagini? *shudders to infinity* That was beyond creepy!
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Actually, that's not quite the case. Remember that if they weren't taken, if they never learned the cup's location, Voldemort wouldn't realize Harry knew about Horcruxes, and Harry, Ron, and Hermione would be able to remain at large and continue looking. Eventually, they'd locate... and the same thing would happen. The chance part was that Harry got an opportunity to overpower Draco Malfoy, and become the master of the Elder Wand... but he does it again in the Room of Requirement, so it'd still work.
But no, Dumbledore did not plan that, and he shouldn't have. Something has to be left for Harry. Following a roadmap is not what heroes do.
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One thing DH proved, I think, is my assertion that HBP was a BAD BOOK. A book full of mainly useless filler.
He found out that Dumbledore was human, too.
One of the things that really amused me with HBP was the number of evil/stupid!Dumbledore fans that came out of the woodwork, and I myself thought that HBP showed Dumbledore to be a patronising evasive berk. So I rejoiced when Harry worked that out for himself, several times, in DH. I thought we'd be spared the usual Dumbledore-exposition-at-the-end chapter for the final book, given that he was DEAD and all, but, no, trust Dumledore to come back regardless. A most annoying wizard :-)
And I'm of the opinion that Dumbledore's plan came together in spite of his manipulations rather than because of them.You bet ( ... )
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In your ETA #2 you wrote:
Also...did anyone notice that Voldemort asked "the deluded ones" if they "finally understand?" (this was after Harry's supposed death). I can't help but think that Jo is as tired of the wanking as the rest of the fandom.
I don't understand what you're getting at here; what 'wanking' in particular? Voldemort tells the assembled Hogwarts defenders that Harry had only ever prevailed through the sacrifice of others ... which wasn't quite correct - neither Cedric, Sirius or Dumbledore had *directly* defended Harry, had they? ... but there was a definite friends-of-Harry body count. Voldemort had a point.
And Ron's "He beat you!" resonse was just asinine head-in-the-sand bravado rubbish. Given that Harry's dead body (as far as he knew) was in front of him. Beaten ( ... )
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ETA#2: If I recall, I was commenting more upon Jo's chosen phrasing rather than what was actually going on in the book at the time. To me, when I read it, it sounded like a thinly veiled reference - Jo asking the Harmonians (the deluded ones) if they finally got it now that the series is over.
And as far as the other question...the flayed baby was a piece of Voldemort's soul...that much was obvious. Why does it matter if it was the piece in Harry or the piece in Voldemort? I may have been mistaken about which person it actually resided in...I still got the message Jo was trying to convey. It never occurred to me to debate whether it was the bit in Harry or the bit in Voldie. That, to me, is beside the point.
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I never thought that the 'deluded' sentence was a slam at the H/Hr folk, and I'm one of them! Mind you, at that point in the book I think I was nodding my head in agreement with Voldemort and hoping he'd kill Harry for good this time. Well, okay, I wasn't that far gone, but was pretty apathetic at that stage.
That, to me, is beside the point.To me a lot of the fun is in the details ... and by NOT concentrating on the minutiae you're letting Rowling get away with her flawed plot. Oh ( ... )
Reply
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