The Angel Chronicles: season 5 vices.

[delta_mai]

So here's what I didn't like.

Fred/Wesley
  Although I love the ship, I hate how it was written.  The transition from Fred only seeing him as a friend to suddenly being in love with him was way too quick, wasn't written well, and honestly was just a massive let down considering how long this ship had been drawn out.  Yeah, maybe it was in the

Comments

[iluvroadrunner6]

Re: Fred/Wes: Fred ... never actually said she was in love with him. In fact, there was a part cut from that final scene of "Hole in the World" where she said "I could have loved you" indicating that she wasn't there yet. But I kind of felt that even before the final scene, and without seeing it. Fred's grief in the end was more for the fact that she was dying than what she was losing with Wesley, while Wesley ... was a little obsessed with her

[burningchaos]

Sucksucksmile uploaded all the current comics for us poor folk here. Just add cbc reader and your good to go. Also I agree with like everything you just said.

[delta_mai]

First - omg can't believe I didn't thank you for linking me to these! I raced through them and am totally hooked. So... I haz a question. Do you have issue 37? Cos it doesn't work on my computer for some reason. I tried re-downloading but it's not behaving. I was wondering if you could email it to me?

I wouldn't ask, but I'm kinda really addicted and the last one ended on a cliffhanger.

[burningchaos]

http://www.4shared.com/file/TDuE_uWj/Angel_037_-_Prophet_for_Profit.html

try that link, if not I'll be happy to email it to you.

[delta_mai]

Thanks, but I downloaded and it's still not working :( Just comes up blank. I'll pm you my email.

[noybusiness]

Fred/Wesley
I hadn't thought about it, but a eureka moment would have been nice. Though I think that feelings were building since Season Four.

Nina/Angel
The purpose was to give Angel a romantic relationship without it being true love and risking Angelus. He liked her but wasn't deeply into her. Like or dislike that.

Cordelia
I did notice how, before "You're Welcome", Cordelia seemed absent from the show beyond not being onscreen, and it bugged me, but vendetta? If Joss has a vendetta against Charisma, she doesn't have one against him. She praised him in a recent Veronica Mars interview, and spoke to him about playing Wonder Woman when he was attached to a film idea.

Lindsey
Sorry, I find this highly appropriate to both Lindsey and Lorne by virtue of its anticlimax, last-character-you-would-expect, and Angel's relationship to Lindsey. We can agree to disagree.

The Circle of the Black Thorn
It's been officially stated this plot was rushed because of the axing.

[spangielka]

NFA is my favorite final of any series that I've seen and I liked the Black Thorn plot. It seemed realistic that the Apocalypse came without warning, in the shadow of other events everyone was focusing on (Illyria).
Most of all I loved the concept that all the people were enslaved, yet blissfully unaware of it (kind of like in w&h hell dimension) and the true winning was putting up a fight, because that way the characters were not tools anymore. The outcome was unimportant (so we didn't see it), there always will be things to fight anyway, but choosing to do so was actually declaring freedom. Perfect ending imo.

[delta_mai]

I can't like it because by killing the members of the Circle, without provocation (after all, they hadn't acted to start an apocalypse yet), Team Angel actually brought about the apocalypse - W/H sent LA to Hell as punishment.

Plus I don't agree that everyone was slaves. At all. I mean, sure W/H is all evil etc etc, but they don't take away free will. In fact, without evil people wouldn't be able to make the choice to BE evil, as shown at the end of S4.

[spangielka]

Wasn't the free will illusory if in the big picture every outcome to people's actions was foregone?
I don't blame Angel for making the first move about the apocalypse. That's exactly what Buffy did in Chosen. It was about to happen anyway and even if it hadn't been, they just didn't want to accept the world as it was, controlled by demons, and I get that.

[delta_mai]

Well, you could argue that already exists because of Determinism. But Free Will and Determinism can co-exist - even if every outcome was always going to happen exactly the way it happens, that doesn't mean that our decisions don't affect that outcome - we still have Free Will. It's a pretty tricky concept that we've tackled in Philosophy many times. I'm a Compatibilist myself so....

In any case, Angel had no evidence that the Circle was going to cause the apocalypse any time soon, and by killing them he actually brought it about.

With Buffy it was different - she KNEW there was an army beneath the ground ready to rise. She'd had evidence the entire season.