I think Snow is quite psychologically astute in reading peoples' weaknesses and has great surveillance on his victors, but hell no, he's not omniscient. I imagine the "I know about the kiss" to Katniss about her and Gale out in the woods encourages that mentality that somehow, SNOW SEES EVERYTHING. Personally, that could have just been him making a good psychological read while she was talking about Gale and hitting the mark. And from the non-specific wording of it, he could even be talking about her kissing Peeta in the arena.
This is actually part of a chapter from what amounts to the Johanna counterpart to Haymitch's first year as a mentor/whore story of "Nowhere to Stand and Now Nowhere to Hide" (NTS). This would take place during the 67th Games, and also involves Finnick's first year and the friendship he develops with Johanna, and catches up with Haymitch and his involvement in Johanna and Finnick's lives. It's not fully written yet and I'm really trying to stick to one project at a time for the most part, so that's kind of sitting aside from now. But it will get done!
Since you saw my fancasting here, let me say I do quite enjoy the personality of Woody Harrelson's Haymitch, but I just can't get over him being a blond "merchie" type considering being Seam would be a big part of Haymitch's identity and personality. Ergo, I write him as black-haired and grey-eyed. ;)
Thanks for the link to your series page. That's helpful, because, yes, I've been slowly sifting backwards, which is how I found this fic, but it's been a bit chaotic to get through. Also, I'm glad to finally know what NTS stands for and what that story is about. I'll read it avidly if it's anything like that snippet.
It makes total sense that Haymitch would look the way you describe, but despite knowing that he doesn't fit the role physically much, the very second I saw stills from The Hunger Games in Entertainment Weekly, I knew *instantly* somehow that Woody Harrelson had to be playing Haymitch. Something about the way he looked just inhabited the character perfectly for me, even though I knew Haymitch doesn't look like that. I don't know why, but WH has won my heart in the role ever since.
Welcome! I hope you enjoy the fic...Trovia's comments on it have been really thoughtful. I really don't post my fic on LJ, so I'd refer you to AO3 for it.
Sorry, I tend towards long titles from Mumford and Sons lyrics, so I abbreviate for the ones I talk about most commonly. The three you'll probably see me refer to that way are NTS, HID, and AFAF. ;)
For me, a lot of the characterization of Woody Harrelson in terms of the personality, the clothing, even the shaggy hair, are things that are absolutely in line with Haymitch headcanon for me. It's just that I cannot mentally accept him as a blond merchant, probably in part because I read the books first and had a good mental image of Haymitch. So I kind of take Woody's characterization and mannerisms and give him a different face, if that makes sense? (I also say, with a sigh, as he was already wearing a wig, couldn't they have at least given him dark hair?)
Yes, I've seen you refer to those and had no idea what they were, although I suspected they were probably fics.
Yeah, I actually read the first book on a fairly mercenary level, and wasn't forming strong images in my mind of what the characters looked like, with the possible exception of Effie and Prim, for some reason. They jumped out at me in their descriptions. At first, I was only reading it because someone had pushed it into my hands and after reading about ten chapters, I realized that it would be a book my students would probably get sucked into (this is a rare thing for them). I didn't have tons of emotional investment in the story or what anyone looked like. Then I brought in that EW issue with lots of THG movie stills, and skimming through it, I knew instantly who Woody Harrelson was playing when I saw all the things you mentioned - the clothing, the shaggy hair.
(I also say, with a sigh, as he was already wearing a wig, couldn't they have at least given him dark hair?)
It's funny. I saw an interview with him on YouTube last night about the role and he mentioned that he used his biker brother's appearance as a model for Haymitch, so I imagine his brother was blond like him, and he just never thought to change it to fit the book. It's too bad, because yeah, it would have made no difference to the characterization to have him wear a dark wig, and it would have been more accurate to the book.
Sorry for the confusion! D: I ought to just make a FAQ sticky or something. Typing out the full titles is such a pain in the ass that I quickly went to abbreviations.
You're a teacher? \o/ Go you! What do you teach, if I can ask? I promise I don't stalk people.
I think it was only Haymitch I had a decent mental image of, mainly because his char drew me in so much and my frustration with how little Katniss focuses on him in general. In terms of how he looks, all we get in the first book is chubby, middle-aged, and drunk, and later that he's not extremely handsome in a way he would have had sponsors lined up when he was a tribute...though I argue that implies while hes probably shabby and certainly overweight, he's not worn out or ugly either since Katniss would freely insult him with that.
We don't even know until halfway through CF what coloring he has when Katniss describes his reaping and tells us he's got Seam looks. That made me consciously try to imagine him while reading THG, and right from THG I had him figured as Seam based on his personality. The other chars generally at least get some physical description--hair, eyes, etc., so I didn't have to put in that effort of trying to imagine it.
So having had to make that image myself rather than go with with SC told me, my image of Haymitch is far more defined in a way other chars aren't, if that makes sense?
I'm sure his brother probably is blond too. It's just kind of a missed opportunity. Meh well!
Yeah, it's interesting that such a crucial character that takes up a decent amount of psychic space in the novels doesn't get a description until book 2.
No, it totally makes sense that you would therefore be forced to come up with a strong image for him. I guess I just didn't bother, for some reason, so my mind was ready to be filled with images of Harrelson. ;) I like your take on him though. That picture goes against my actor-influenced images, of course, but it's a great way to see him, one that makes sense given that SC does make a point of saying that the wealthier classes often tend to be blond and pale-skinned.
It's all about Katniss' general lack of interest in anything not related to her or to Peeta. ;)
Well, keep in mind I was reading the books in 2009 or 2010. So unlike you reading them now, I didn't have WH to refer to as an image of Haymitch. I kind of was obliged to make a head-portrait.
But mostly I think the clearly indicated physical and class differences between Seam and merchie, and the resulting personalities, are what really make me dislike a blond Haymitch. Imagining Haymitch with a merchant upbringing just doesn't work--he becomes someone totally different. I suppose he could be like Prim, a half-and-half who looks merchie but was raised in the Seam. It just doesn't work nearly as well for me mentally as simply letting him appear to be from the Seam in the first place.
If not for that clear tie of coloring to social class and thus to a huge personality influence, I'd probably just shrug and say "Blond, whatever." I'm actually usually fairly flexible on book vs movie appearance. Blame SC for this one.
This is actually part of a chapter from what amounts to the Johanna counterpart to Haymitch's first year as a mentor/whore story of "Nowhere to Stand and Now Nowhere to Hide" (NTS). This would take place during the 67th Games, and also involves Finnick's first year and the friendship he develops with Johanna, and catches up with Haymitch and his involvement in Johanna and Finnick's lives. It's not fully written yet and I'm really trying to stick to one project at a time for the most part, so that's kind of sitting aside from now. But it will get done!
Since you saw my fancasting here, let me say I do quite enjoy the personality of Woody Harrelson's Haymitch, but I just can't get over him being a blond "merchie" type considering being Seam would be a big part of Haymitch's identity and personality. Ergo, I write him as black-haired and grey-eyed. ;)
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It makes total sense that Haymitch would look the way you describe, but despite knowing that he doesn't fit the role physically much, the very second I saw stills from The Hunger Games in Entertainment Weekly, I knew *instantly* somehow that Woody Harrelson had to be playing Haymitch. Something about the way he looked just inhabited the character perfectly for me, even though I knew Haymitch doesn't look like that. I don't know why, but WH has won my heart in the role ever since.
Reply
Sorry, I tend towards long titles from Mumford and Sons lyrics, so I abbreviate for the ones I talk about most commonly. The three you'll probably see me refer to that way are NTS, HID, and AFAF. ;)
For me, a lot of the characterization of Woody Harrelson in terms of the personality, the clothing, even the shaggy hair, are things that are absolutely in line with Haymitch headcanon for me. It's just that I cannot mentally accept him as a blond merchant, probably in part because I read the books first and had a good mental image of Haymitch. So I kind of take Woody's characterization and mannerisms and give him a different face, if that makes sense? (I also say, with a sigh, as he was already wearing a wig, couldn't they have at least given him dark hair?)
Reply
Yeah, I actually read the first book on a fairly mercenary level, and wasn't forming strong images in my mind of what the characters looked like, with the possible exception of Effie and Prim, for some reason. They jumped out at me in their descriptions. At first, I was only reading it because someone had pushed it into my hands and after reading about ten chapters, I realized that it would be a book my students would probably get sucked into (this is a rare thing for them). I didn't have tons of emotional investment in the story or what anyone looked like. Then I brought in that EW issue with lots of THG movie stills, and skimming through it, I knew instantly who Woody Harrelson was playing when I saw all the things you mentioned - the clothing, the shaggy hair.
(I also say, with a sigh, as he was already wearing a wig, couldn't they have at least given him dark hair?)
It's funny. I saw an interview with him on YouTube last night about the role and he mentioned that he used his biker brother's appearance as a model for Haymitch, so I imagine his brother was blond like him, and he just never thought to change it to fit the book. It's too bad, because yeah, it would have made no difference to the characterization to have him wear a dark wig, and it would have been more accurate to the book.
Reply
You're a teacher? \o/ Go you! What do you teach, if I can ask? I promise I don't stalk people.
I think it was only Haymitch I had a decent mental image of, mainly because his char drew me in so much and my frustration with how little Katniss focuses on him in general. In terms of how he looks, all we get in the first book is chubby, middle-aged, and drunk, and later that he's not extremely handsome in a way he would have had sponsors lined up when he was a tribute...though I argue that implies while hes probably shabby and certainly overweight, he's not worn out or ugly either since Katniss would freely insult him with that.
We don't even know until halfway through CF what coloring he has when Katniss describes his reaping and tells us he's got Seam looks. That made me consciously try to imagine him while reading THG, and right from THG I had him figured as Seam based on his personality. The other chars generally at least get some physical description--hair, eyes, etc., so I didn't have to put in that effort of trying to imagine it.
So having had to make that image myself rather than go with with SC told me, my image of Haymitch is far more defined in a way other chars aren't, if that makes sense?
I'm sure his brother probably is blond too. It's just kind of a missed opportunity. Meh well!
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No, it totally makes sense that you would therefore be forced to come up with a strong image for him. I guess I just didn't bother, for some reason, so my mind was ready to be filled with images of Harrelson. ;) I like your take on him though. That picture goes against my actor-influenced images, of course, but it's a great way to see him, one that makes sense given that SC does make a point of saying that the wealthier classes often tend to be blond and pale-skinned.
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Well, keep in mind I was reading the books in 2009 or 2010. So unlike you reading them now, I didn't have WH to refer to as an image of Haymitch. I kind of was obliged to make a head-portrait.
But mostly I think the clearly indicated physical and class differences between Seam and merchie, and the resulting personalities, are what really make me dislike a blond Haymitch. Imagining Haymitch with a merchant upbringing just doesn't work--he becomes someone totally different. I suppose he could be like Prim, a half-and-half who looks merchie but was raised in the Seam. It just doesn't work nearly as well for me mentally as simply letting him appear to be from the Seam in the first place.
If not for that clear tie of coloring to social class and thus to a huge personality influence, I'd probably just shrug and say "Blond, whatever." I'm actually usually fairly flexible on book vs movie appearance. Blame SC for this one.
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