AMC--Chapter Forty-Two

Feb 20, 2006 20:37

Yes, it is a day early. Sort of. But I finished it this afternoon and thought, "What the heck?" since it's three days late already. And I have warrant-type things (a.k.a. real work) to do tomorrow morning.

So here is the elusive Chapter Forty-Two, from the PoV of the recalcitrant Carnistir. As it turns out, this chapter is too large for LJ! So it ( Read more... )

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dawn_felagund February 22 2006, 17:32:31 UTC
I think it's a very difficult thing to write from the perspective of someone who's hip-high

Yes, it is. :) Especially a hip-high Elf with a sense that I as a plain ol' Human have never experienced. Tolkien said that little Elves advance faster than little Humans in terms of language ability...but it's hard to walk the line of how far one can go with this and still remain believable to the audience. I was keeping your last comment about this in mind as writing it; visiting thesaurus.com for synonyms and ideas, I was tempted to use certain words and had to slap my own wrist and say, "He's four, Dawn!"

(Was it you who asked me once for the quote about language development in young Elves? I don't think I ever gave it if you did....)

It's such a kid thing to do, and it establishes the bond between Tyelkormo and Carnistir without having to chew up time 'splaining it.

I'm glad--and amused!--that this scene was so well-liked overall. It wasn't planned at all but one of those scenes that just "happens" as I'm writing it.

As for it being a "kid" thing to do...well, this made me laugh because we used to do this sort of thing at The Piece all of the time! It sort of proves my idea that to be a manager in such a place, one's first responsibility is that of a babysitter.

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frenchpony February 22 2006, 21:54:12 UTC
Tolkien said that little Elves advance faster than little Humans in terms of language ability...but it's hard to walk the line of how far one can go with this and still remain believable to the audience.

Well, I think you could look at a little Elf's ability to use language versus his ability to understand it. That is, the kid might very well have a better command of complex grammar and syntax than a human of equivalent physical development, but he might not yet have the experience or the sophistication to really understand what all the words he knows mean, or why people do the things they do, or what, in general, is going on in the world.

Think of a precocious two-year-old who can tell long, involved, plotty stories, but who still has to learn that the stove is hot, that the cat will scratch if you pull its tail, things like that. Generally, the results are pretty funny from the adult's perspective. Sometimes, the kid will use a word that doesn't mean what the kid thinks it means, which can be funny or horrifying or both. Sometimes the kid will blurt out a truth that everyone else has been trying to hide, because he's not yet experienced enough in the ways of the world to pick up on the fact that the adults are dancing around the topic for a reason.

Carnistir probably has regular experiences in his life of being treated unfairly. That's part of the territory of being a little kid. He could probably explain very eloquently THAT it's unfair, but he might not be so good at figuring out WHY it's unfair. Or maybe he does know why, but he still doesn't have the eloquence to explain it (even Elves have learning curves). That's really frustrating for kids, and I think it's a major reason why they have meltdowns. . . or why a kid might bite. Biting is a nonverbal form of expression for feelings that a kid just doesn't have the understanding or the words to deal with peacefully.

Moving right along. . . almost (but not entirely) completely apropos of nothing at all, can I ask you a confectionary question?

My latest oovrah is in the editing phase now, and there are some details I want to get right. Do you think it would be realistic for Elves (mixed Noldor/Sindar population) living in a coastal region to have a candy that resembles Turkish Delight? I'm thinking that gelatin they can get either from seaweed or animal byproduct, rosewater for flavoring anyone can do, you can sort of crystallize honey or work with it liquid. . . is there anything else about that kind of candy that I'm forgetting?

The last time I thought about candy in relationship to Arda, it was more of the boiled-molasses type, but that was in a far different setting than this will be, so I'd like there to be a different type of candy.

Isn't LJ great? I need a confectioner, and I know one. . .

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AMC42 digdigil February 23 2006, 00:11:49 UTC
Hi, Dawn!

I'm late with reading this chapter and commenting! If only I could stop writing *sigh* - too many ideas, too little time! Anyway, I thought that this was a somewhat ethereal chapter compared to most of the others. I love that you are inside Carnistir's head and writing it so well. Now as the parent of a 3-yr-old I can tell you that sometimes they amaze you with what they seem to know. It's like they can't put into words what they see/hear/feel/think but I am sure that they conceptualize and come up with some spot-on conclusions most of the time. It's just in the way that they'll look at your sometimes and seem to know just what you're thinking and you'll ask yourself, "How did he know or suspect that?" and then you realize that you gave yourself away by your actions or your tone of voice or where you looked and he followed the line of your gaze. Little kids are superlative at reading body language and tones in your voice. Teenagers are the opposite. You can hit a teenager over the head with a brick and he'll say "huh?" and he just won't get it. I think it's because little children are so INTO their parents and want to KNOW everything about them and how the family dynamics work, whereas teens are sick of their families (usually) and their minds are always far away on something else.

Anyway, I thought this chapter was very revealing of Carnistir, and I too am intrigued by him. Actually, the plotbunnies are circling around and demanding that Carni's story be fleshed out and that his whole childhood and teenagehood be explored. Can you start a list, Dawn, for what you're going to be writing after you finish your Feany/Nerds romance fic? (Which is causing me to salivate as I think about it, btw.) Would you have room on your agenda for a 'Carni Growing Up' story?

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Re: AMC42 dawn_felagund February 23 2006, 14:32:26 UTC
Don't worry about not reading/commenting right away. As far behind as I am on Maglor/Daeron, I have no room to complain. :)

Little kids are superlative at reading body language and tones in your voice.

Or in Carni's case, reading auras, or whatever it is that he does! :^P

He's a hard character to write, being as I have little experience--or interest--in small children. Of course, I can blunder my way out of that by whining, "But he's an Elf...."

Teenagers are the opposite. You can hit a teenager over the head with a brick and he'll say "huh?" and he just won't get it.

*ahem*

*looks at Nelyo*

He doesn't get it. ;)

Actually, the plotbunnies are circling around and demanding that Carni's story be fleshed out and that his whole childhood and teenagehood be explored. Can you start a list, Dawn, for what you're going to be writing after you finish your Feany/Nerds romance fic? (Which is causing me to salivate as I think about it, btw.) Would you have room on your agenda for a 'Carni Growing Up' story?

Oh, I'm sorry to unleash the bunnies on you! Back, foul beasties!

Stories that I have planned (in part) will include:
  • Formenos: the estrangement of Feanor/Nerdanel; the banishment of the family; daily life (along the lines of AMC); Melkor
  • The rebellion, kinslaying, etc.
  • Daily life in Middle-earth, along the lines of AMC, getting to know the land, learn the ways of live in ME, etc.
  • Maedhros' captivity through relinquishing kingship to Fingolfin; Maglor's regency; Helcaraxe
  • Possibly a Great Journey story, with Finwe/Miriel and all the fun of trekkin' through Middle-earth
  • Maglor's fate (this will either be a short story or--if it's novel-length--will have a lot of original content; maybe novella?)
  • I still have this Darkening novel hanging over me, with Finarfin, Earwen, and Anaire

And that's it. Wow. I'm going to be busy. o.O

Carnistir will, of course, play a role in just about all of these. Actually, I have some of his "scenes" mentally written already. What I've started in AMC is going to carry throughout, so the "Carni growing up story" will be more like the "Carni growing up stories!"

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Re: AMC42 digdigil February 23 2006, 15:18:17 UTC
Oh wow, thanks for the list of your planned fics. They ALL sound fabulous and so interesting! As I now have a particular interest in Maglor, the "Maglor's Fate" one has me drooling! If you ever do finish reading "LTSS" (I just finished it today so one less WIP) then you'll see that I left a huge gap of 12,018 years between the last chapter and the epilogue. That means there is huge space to be filled in! LOL!

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Re: AMC42 rhapsody11 March 4 2006, 22:44:08 UTC

# Maglor's fate (this will either be a short story or--if it's novel-length--will have a lot of original content; maybe novella?)

I am slowly working on, what now feels like, a vignette series that covers Maglor's life. I started on it a year ago, so let me know when you finished this. I would love to see your take on it.

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Re: AMC42 dawn_felagund March 5 2006, 23:53:35 UTC
I (mentally) have a lot of it "written," since it is one of my stories that I "choreographed" to a song...in part, at least. :) It's part of this whole series that includes AMC; I am eager to work on it, but I hesitate until I establish more of the backstory, not wanting to paint myself into a corner.

But I will let you know when I do! :)

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dawn_felagund February 23 2006, 14:39:09 UTC
Of course, you'd pick a confection who's yet to make Turkish Delight! ;)

But most of the recipes that I'm finding involve some sort of citrus (orange, lime, or lemon). I found one that does not involve citrus but dates.

One, bizarrely, is made with peanut butter. Not sure how that one works.

I'd say the only problem I'd see is accounting for the citrus, which would depend on the geographical region, of course.

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frenchpony February 23 2006, 17:09:31 UTC
Can you determine, from reading the recipes, what the citrus does? That is, is it just a flavoring agent, or does it function to bind the candy together, or what? This candy isn't going to be real Turkish Delight; I'm just looking for something with that sort of gumdrop consistency. So, if the citrus is mainly there for flavoring, then it doesn't matter so much. If it's vital to the recipe, then I'd have to think about it some more.

I'm not even going to name the candy -- I just needed something that would be vaguely "foreign" to some of the characters involved in the scene and that would come in little bite-sized pieces. Stickiness is an added benefit.

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dawn_felagund February 23 2006, 18:45:52 UTC
It appears to be for flavoring. Either way, a lot isn't used.

The first recipe I grabbed:

2 tbsp. gelatin
1 tbsp. water
1 med. orange
1 med. lemon
4 tbsp. almonds
3 1/4 c. sugar
1/2 c. water
Icing sugar

Soak gelatin in 1 tablespoon of water and keep aside for about 10 minutes. Extract juice from orange and lemon. Wash the peels and keep aside. Blanche almonds and slice very fine. Combine sugar, water, juices and peels and bring to a boil. Add the gelatin and simmer until it dissolves. Strain the mixture. Cool for about 3 or 4 minutes. When the mixture is about to set, add the almonds. Mix well and pour into a wet bowl. Chill until completely set. Before serving, turn out the jelly onto a plate and cut into 1 inch pieces. Roll the pieces in icing sugar and serve. Makes 20 pieces.

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frenchpony February 23 2006, 20:34:16 UTC
Ooo, thanks! I'll have to try making that at home sometime.

It looks like, if the flavoring is rosewater rather than lemon-orange, and the gelatin comes from the seaweed, they could make a pretty similar candy right there. Cool. Thanks! I'll just keep the candy description that I have, then.

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dawn_felagund February 23 2006, 21:25:05 UTC
You're welcome. :) If you make the recipe, you'll have to let me know how it turns out!

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frenchpony February 23 2006, 22:24:21 UTC
Will do.

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