A Poll to Humor Your Statistically Inclined Hostess ...
I am working on a post for The Heretic Loremaster and am really curious about how people see the attack on Sirion and its aftermath as it relates to Maedhros and Maglor, and Elrond and Elros. I would appreciate the input of anyone who wishes to take the following poll
( Read more... )
In this particular case, I have taken "canonical" to mean "said in the published Silm": Normally I include the HoME to my definition of canon, but just now I am no longer certain what parts of the events at the havens are purely fanon-inspired and what are derived from the supplementary canon. I'd have to look it up, and... *coughs* right now I'm too lazy to do that. *gasp! shock!*
I have taken "non-canonical" to mean that, from what we see in Canon, it would feel OOC to me. I have taken "not sure" to mean that canon doesn't explicitly say so, but it might well be between the lines. A somewhat hazy differentiation, I admit, but it seemed to be what worked best; but I shall explain my answers anyway.
Well, not the answer to the first question, which is fairly straightforward, I think.
But two: I clicked "not sure" because... well. The Silm doesn't say anything of the sort, but I think it's implied in the fact that there is no special mention of resistance. If Maedhros - who is, despite everything, still the leader of the pitiful remnant of the House of Fëanor - had opposed the fostering so that Maglor - in doing it anyway - would factually have turned against him, I think it would be mentioned.
And I think I remember that in one of the older versions actually Maedhros was the one who was keen on adopting the kidlets, so although the published story doesn't explicitly say so, there must have been agreement at the very least. But, well, I can't be certain! ;)
It's different with three: Here I'd definitely say that this reading doesn't comply with canon. It isn't said anywhere in the Silm. And only a few pages before the attack on the havens we are told that Maedhros spent days running through the forests looking for abandoned Elúred and Elurín, in vain. Now this, too, is conjecture on my part, but to me it seems highly unlikely that a character who just spent a week trying to save two abandonet kidlets would one chapter later want to slay two similar kidlets...
So here the "it doesn't say so" is stronger than just "not sure".
And let me at this point say how tired I am of all the fanfic where Maedhros treats Elros and Elrond cruelly and Maglor has to protect them from him all the time. *coughs*
Back to "not sure" at four: It certainly doesn't say so, but there is a line about how Eärendil and Elwing felt great sorrow about the "captivity of their sons". I figure they - and Gil-galad and the rest - may certainly have assumed that the twins were held hostage. It would make sense both from their and from Maedhros' and Maglor's perspective - children for Silmarils? - so while I freely admit that the Silm doesn't say so, it is at least possible.
Somewhere in the back of my head a voice keeps saying "Duh, there even were parleys discussing the terms of release", but I cannot for the life of me say whether I just remember that from some fanfic or whether it's actually said somewhere in the supplementary canon.
Fuzzy, all in all, I know. >_>
You should've added an "complying with my mental canon" option for people like me! ;)
Reply
No worries about not looking things up ... I really didn't want people to feel they needed to do that. I should have clarified. (Maybe I'll add an ETA before broadcasting this to a wider audience.)
For most of the "questions," I don't even think that there is necessarily a correct answer, which is why I wanted to leave it up to each person to use his or her personal definition of canon in coming up with replies. You are right that the earliest versions of The Silmarillion had Maedhros as the rescuer of Elrond (Elros being added later), and JRRT stopped working on this part of the story shortly after switching Maedhros and Maglor's roles. I think that will influence everyone's personal canon differently; some won't think it matters, and others will take it into account, in terms of its use as a trajectory of Maedhros and Maglor's characterization, if nothing else.
Somewhere in the back of my head a voice keeps saying "Duh, there even were parleys discussing the terms of release", but I cannot for the life of me say whether I just remember that from some fanfic or whether it's actually said somewhere in the supplementary canon.
Well, I just spent the afternoon reading the HoMe for information on this event, and I didn't find anything about parleys. ;) So I might be missing something too; my research was based on a keyword-search of "maedhros" or "maidros" in my ebooks. I want to go through each book's index to see if I can find anything on this that might not mention him by name but might be relevant. If I find anything on parleys, I'll let you know! :)
But, if it's there, I don't think I've ever read it because, for me, a big hole in the story has always been Elrond and Elros's departure from Maglor's care: when it happened and on what terms, how old they were, and so on. But I guess that is best explained by the fact that, post-LotR, Tolkien didn't work on this part of the story at all and so didn't see a need to make a stronger "First Age/Third Age" connection that is part of the reason I think people like this particular story so much.
You should've added an "complying with my mental canon" option for people like me! ;)
Lol! Tolkien canon is so complicated that I think that I could have had 20 shades of compliance/non-compliance with canon, and I still would have gotten comments from people wanting to lodge their choice between two of the options! ;)
Reply
Leave a comment