Re: Terrific!harmony_bitesJune 13 2006, 01:09:18 UTC
I'm thinking of cutting out the draco part entirely, or at least moving it around.
Since you're not posting this anywhere but your LJ for now, I'd reserve judgement till your finished--you might find it works better elsewhere or broken up. The reason I liked the Draco part is because it raises the stakes--we're reminded this is going on *during* HBP and exactly what that means.
And I need to credit Book of Shadows again in the acknowledgments.
I'd be honored, but I don't think you *have* to acknowledge things like that--if I did that for Book of Shadows myself, it would be a loooonggg list--lots of HG/SS stories inspired parts, or annoyed me so much I had to do different, or helped form ideas for my Snape. I don't really see much similarty between your fic and BOS, other than you're trying to work a romance between the lines.
In contrast, someone's unacknowledge borrowing (imo) of BOS *has* bothered me. This author, pretty well-known, reviewed my first three chapters. Then two weeks after I posted Four, setting up Occlumency lessons for Hermione with Snape, she posts her own story--about AD arranging Occlumency lessons from Hermione with Snape during the HBP timeframe. I even thought I caught an echo of one line there.
That bothered me cuz she was the established author and I the newbie--I *knew* my story would get compared to hers, and that people would assume I copied her--and indeed, I've gotten a couple of comments on their similarity.
You do something *that* similar, or you copy a device or creature found in a fic (like snarkyroxy's blood dagger or moonfilly from Before the Dawn, or you borrow an OC, then I think you need acknowledgements--but inspiration or influences? Not necessary.
Which doesn't mean you saying BOS influenced you wouldn't be appreciated--being associated with your story would be a pleasure*g*
And yeah, I feel much of the same frustration--which is part of the fun of trying to work things out between the lines. Though I should warn you, it can also be a ball and chain trying to make it work--I'll be releived to finally go beyond the events of the book in my WIP.
That bothered me cuz she was the established author and I the newbie--I *knew* my story would get compared to hers, and that people would assume I copied her--and indeed, I've gotten a couple of comments on their similarity.
See, that sucks! I dunno, I always find that giving credit improves my karma. I can't understand why there are fen out there who don't credit, who steal or-- more incredibly but it does happen-- plagirize word for word. None of us are getting paid for this, it's all about community, it doesn't make sense not to acknowledge other's contributions.
Anyway, even if you don't see BOS, part 6's influence, I do, so I went ahead and added a line in the acknowlegments.
Plus, I'm gonna have to pimp your story to the snape community I belong to-- it deserves more readers!
Re: Terrific!harmony_bitesJune 13 2006, 01:32:28 UTC
I can't understand why there are fen out there who don't credit, who steal or-- more incredibly but it does happen-- plagirize word for word.
That's the one that really gets me. How can you do that knowing any reviews, any rep you get isn't yours? What's the attraction of doing it? We're not talking Jason Blair or Stephen Glass here--you're not getting a prestigious byline or resume filler or a paycheck--so WHYYY????
With BOS and this other writer, it's possible it was coincidence--though I'll admit I find it hard to swallow and I havent' been able to read this writer since--and she had been a favorite. After I posted my fifth chapter, she even went back and reviewed my fourth chapter noting how similar it was to hers. (No kidding?)
If anyone ever says something, I have the dates on FFN to show I posted my fourth chapter before she posted her fic but...
Borrowing ideas and not acknowledging? Unlike plagiarism, that can get iffy--like I said--we all are influenced by others. I can see something of Caeria's Snape in mine, and Dyce's among others (I *wish* I had more of KazVL, Snarkyroxy, LOTM, or Helga in mine, but I'm not sure their Snape is someone I can capture if I tried.)
But I wouldn't put that debt in acknowledgements--because they might not appreciate my fic being linked with theirs! Plus, it's tenuous--and about attitude and portrayal--not a copying of scenarios.
I'm sorry that this author was one of your faveorites-- it's awful when a writer we really like does a jerky thing-- it taints the pleasure we take in their work.
There's a similar problem with academics-- like fandom it's a small community, there's much interaction and intellectual cross-pollination going on, and when an academic whose work I love turns out to be an dumbass, I always feel slimed. But this is worse, because it's your story and it makes it so much more personal.
I admit, it had never occurred to me that an author wouldn't want to be acknowledged because he or she wouldn't want to be associated with an author's fic-- I think now we're getting into fan community dynamics and politics that I must be totally naive about...
There's a similar problem with academics-- like fandom it's a small community, there's much interaction and intellectual cross-pollination going on, and when an academic whose work I love turns out to be an dumbass, I always feel slimed
Its a problem I had in Trek, and now have sometimes already even in HP. You get to know the authors as personalities beyond their fic, and it's not always a good thing!
In one way, it's really wonderful. I never wrote creatively before fanfic. The way authors were accessible made them *people* to me--and so made writing something I felt I could do to. Otoh, there's someone in Trek who was a fav author, who my intereactions with became so bitter, I could no longer enjoy her fic. It happens. We're people.
I admit, it had never occurred to me that an author wouldn't want to be acknowledged because he or she wouldn't want to be associated with an author's fic
I started in Trek. I wrote there this short vignette very early on that made something of a splash (and in a much smaller fandom, splashes btw get heard--no plagiarism in Trek--no one would dare--we all knew each other and our stories). Well, two people wrote a sequel based on it.
In one case I was absolutely thrilled. The person was one of my absolutely favorite writers, and since it was based on my story she asked me to beta, and I got my own first beta out of it (and I loved the story she wrote).
In the second case, the writer did not ask, and I winced when I saw the story. This was a writer whose style I didn't like, and who I found very squicky (themes of incest and underage sex were frequent in his fic). He set his sequel of my story within his AU world.
I wasn't happy.
Otoh, I later wrote yet another story, and it got a spontaneous sequel--acknowledged, but permission wasn't sought. I was thrilled. Because it was GOOD dammit. How could I know feel like Christmas had come? So I think it depends--but there are often undercurrents to thinks like acknowledgements of other fics/writer influences and even betas you wouldn't believe.
I think now we're getting into fan community dynamics and politics that I must be totally naive about...
I really stepped in it in Trek--I'm learned to be much more cautious in HP. Those currents are there and can be dangerous--its smart to sit and watch for a while--but its why loads of people find themselves happier in second fandoms--they make the mistakes in their first.
In one way, it's really wonderful. I never wrote creatively before fanfic. The way authors were accessible made them *people* to me--and so made writing something I felt I could do to. Otoh, there's someone in Trek who was a fav author, who my intereactions with became so bitter, I could no longer enjoy her fic. It happens. We're people.
I know what you mean-- it's the community element that makes it seem less like 'OMG, I'm writing' and more like 'I'm telling a story to some friends of mine.'
But when you have people, you have conflict.
and in a much smaller fandom, splashes btw get heard--no plagiarism in Trek--no one would dare--we all knew each other and our stories
Harry Potter is so unbelieveably HUGE. I wonder how that affects things. I mean, years ago, I was on the fringes of Highlander: The Series fandom. But it was such a small fandom (probably smaller than trek), that I never heard about any plagiarism, and if there was drama and conflict, it pretty much went over my head. But I was more of a reader than a writer in that fandom, and that probably makes a big difference.
I can't believe the regularity with which stories are reported as being outright word for word plagiarized in HP (and I only hear about the D/Hr ones-- the number in the fandom as a whole must be massive). I think you're right; it must have to do with the hugeness. I wonder too about the proliferation of unmoderated webarchives and such-like. When I was reading in Highlander it was 10 years ago and everything was through email lists. And everybody knew each other. It's hard to imagine someone posting a story to HLFIC-L that someone else had already written; someone would have spoken up immediately and the poster would have been banned from the list.
I mean, years ago, I was on the fringes of Highlander: The Series fandom. But it was such a small fandom (probably smaller than trek), that I never heard about any plagiarism, and if there was drama and conflict, it pretty much went over my head. But I was more of a reader than a writer in that fandom, and that probably makes a big difference.
It does. I got a recent review to BOS and it had two subtle digs that would have gone right over a reader's head--but if you knew the background, and knew who this person knew among our common acquaintance...
That was frequent in Trek. The knife going in where only a few people could see. And in comparison, Trek is tiny to HP--which has its good and bad sides. I think, actually, HP is more tolerant because it's large--in Trek, being outed as being of the wrong politics was social death.
And you can get away from the bad here pretty easily. No "big name fan" or any one archive rules the roost. While in Trek, one BNF and their clique could make online life hell for you.
I know of a Trek refugee in Highlander--two of them in fact--Killasandra and Hafital. Slash writers, so I don't know if you'd know them, but both wonderful writers and people. Trek lost them to Highlander at least in part from what I gleaned from them because Highlander was far less toxic--and yes, it's smaller.
When I was reading in Highlander it was 10 years ago and everything was through email lists. And everybody knew each other. It's hard to imagine someone posting a story to HLFIC-L that someone else had already written; someone would have spoken up immediately and the poster would have been banned from the list.
Same in Trek. No moderated archives, and LJ was just taking off when I left. People posted to two Newsgroups and Yahoo email list. FFN wasn't even posted to for the most part by the respected writers. We ran to "one-shots" (a term I never heard till HP) and we just didn't get the reviews you do in HP. I have 17 stories posted to FFN under my Trek name--even my longest and most popular story on FFN - a novella of 20 thousand words--has only 13 reviews--and that's pretty typical. My friend and Trek beta - she's one of the big names in Trek. Her most reviewed story has only 20-something reviews.
In comparison, on FFN alone, BOS has 73 reviews, and my vignette "Gambit" has 31 reviews. It's just mindboggling for me any way I try to look at HP. It's just so much larger in scale. Just the HG/SS ship alone by itself dwarfs Trek. I read just about every Trek fanfic of note within months of getting involved--I haven't even touched the tip of HG/SS almost a year since I started reading it.
That was frequent in Trek. The knife going in where only a few people could see. And in comparison, Trek is tiny to HP--which has its good and bad sides. I think, actually, HP is more tolerant because it's large--in Trek, being outed as being of the wrong politics was social death.
I can see that. HP is so gigantic that everyone can find their niche of people with the same likes and dislikes. Though I've surfed the HP4GU groups and yowza-- it gets vicious over there. Mainly between the Snape-haters and Snape-defenders. Each thinks the other is delusional, and neither group on that list can stop haranguing at each other.
Which is why I prefer hanging with my happy, cozy slytherin-loving groups.
though ok, now that I think about it, I have already witnessed one ugly blow-up on a Snape-discussion list. So ok, dysfunction is everywhere in fandom I guess. When it happens I tend to tune out and wait for it to be over...
I haven't read Killasandra, but I've heard of her; my HL-slashfen friends loved her work. There were lots of great writers in HL fandom, slash, het and gen. But the show died, and then well, people drifted...
though ok, now that I think about it, I have already witnessed one ugly blow-up on a Snape-discussion list. So ok, dysfunction is everywhere in fandom I guess. When it happens I tend to tune out and wait for it to be over...
*nods* - though I do tend to try to stay away from the Snape-hostile portions of the fandom--why get myself tied up in knots either going to my guy's defense--or not.
But yeah--its a matter of carefully observing. I think one thing good about LJ is people expose themselves here, for better and worse--so just watch carefully, and you can learn who it's better to keep some distance from eventually. But it can take a while--some of the scariest people I've met in fandom are the ones who at first seem utterly charming.
I haven't read Killasandra, but I've heard of her; my HL-slashfen friends loved her work. There were lots of great writers in HL fandom, slash, het and gen. But the show died, and then well, people drifted...
That's common--Enterprise really killed Trek--even before it was cancelled. It's why I worry what will become of HP when Book 7 comes out--I'm not actually in much of a hurry to see that happen.
Even if we got everything a HG/SS shipper (or Draco shipper) could want (which I doubt)--Snape on the side of the Light and alive, Hermione alive, Draco alive and redeemed, an open ending so we can take the characters where we want (that I think isn't possible--I heard JKR has written an "ever after" epilogue)--even if that happened, the end of source material seems to diminish fandoms considerably.
t's why I worry what will become of HP when Book 7 comes out--I'm not actually in much of a hurry to see that happen.
Me either! I'm dreading it actually. I hear other fans talk about how they can't wait for Book 7, and I'm like, hm, actually, she could take a couple years off and that would be ok with me...
Even if we got everything a HG/SS shipper (or Draco shipper) could want (which I doubt)--Snape on the side of the Light and alive, Hermione alive, Draco alive and redeemed, an open ending so we can take the characters where we want (that I think isn't possible--I heard JKR has written an "ever after" epilogue)--even if that happened, the end of source material seems to diminish fandoms considerably
there was talk on one of the Snape lists that JKR has hinted fairly broadly that Draco is dead. And whil e I'd like to think she has some great plot justification for killing off His Blondness, I almost suspect that she's doing it because the Draco and Snape fans have always annoyed her.
There are writers-- both novelists and screenwriters-- in scifi and fantasy who are themselves fans. I think about Joss Whedon, various people involved in trek, and loads of novelists. And they 'get' fandom because they are themselves fans. I don't think JKR gets fandom, or the needs of fans to partipate in and tell their own stories about the universe. It always sounds like she feels imposed upon when people have alternative views of the characters.
I mean, to be fair, she started out writing a children's novel and who could ever predict it would have become what it did.
But yes. Book 7. A Much Feared Event. Well, maybe she'll ahve another baby. Really, couldn't she just hold off a year or two? It's not like needs the money...
there was talk on one of the Snape lists that JKR has hinted fairly broadly that Draco is dead. And whil e I'd like to think she has some great plot justification for killing off His Blondness, I almost suspect that she's doing it because the Draco and Snape fans have always annoyed her.
Oh, I don't know--I think she just likes messing with us. When I saw a TV interview with her and could guage her intonation and expression, she would get a mischeivous look when Snape came up. Even her "deeply horrible" and "worse than Voldemort" statements aren't so bad when you read them in context--and a Brit HP fan I know says that in a interview for a Scottish paper, when asked about Snape she said "I'd hesitate to say I'm in love with him."--which is practically admitting she does!
There are writers-- both novelists and screenwriters-- in scifi and fantasy who are themselves fans. I think about Joss Whedon, various people involved in trek, and loads of novelists. And they 'get' fandom because they are themselves fans. I don't think JKR gets fandom, or the needs of fans to partipate in and tell their own stories about the universe. It always sounds like she feels imposed upon when people have alternative views of the characters.
Really? Because I got the opposite impression. She seems to enjoy interacting with fans, she let herself be interviewed by Mugglenet and admitted she peeks at HP forums and is aware of the popular ships. She's also pretty tolerant, even encouraging of fanfic compared to most. Some authors--Rice, Goodkind, Enrod, Robin Hobb, Hamilton--and until recently McCaffrey--who don't even allow fanfic. I'd heard that she's even been encouraging it as a good place to learn craft--which is an amazing concession from a pro writer--most treat fanfic with contempt.
From what I heard, her main beef with fanfic was with those that put her characters in adult situations, especially if it was accessible to children. Especially considering that HP is intended as kidlit, not really an unreasonable concern.
You're way better informed than I am, and I'm just going to bow to your superior JKR knowledge here. Admittedly, most of my JKR info has been filtered through shipping fan-sources, and has had a pretty negative spin on her attitude towards fandom. Maybe unfairly so.
I certainly hadn't heard that quote about Snape! Makes me at least a little more hopeful!
I certainly hadn't heard that quote about Snape! Makes me at least a little more hopeful!
I didn't care much for Snape or HP before HBP--yet by the close of the book I was convinced it was a setup--it just read that way to me--that's what intrigued me. Going strictly by the book--I was absolutely convinced Snape was innocent of murder and that JKR was quite clever--and she'd come across as very canny to me in the interview I'd seen on A&E's bio of her.
Then I hit fandom and was shocked that so many people seemed to have read a different book than I (though many got it). I was more disturbed by what I'd heard that JKR had said, than anything in the books themselves. That's what made me go hunting for her quotes in context--worried I was misreading things after all.
But in context, I found her just as slippery as any Slytherin...
Since you're not posting this anywhere but your LJ for now, I'd reserve judgement till your finished--you might find it works better elsewhere or broken up. The reason I liked the Draco part is because it raises the stakes--we're reminded this is going on *during* HBP and exactly what that means.
And I need to credit Book of Shadows again in the acknowledgments.
I'd be honored, but I don't think you *have* to acknowledge things like that--if I did that for Book of Shadows myself, it would be a loooonggg list--lots of HG/SS stories inspired parts, or annoyed me so much I had to do different, or helped form ideas for my Snape. I don't really see much similarty between your fic and BOS, other than you're trying to work a romance between the lines.
In contrast, someone's unacknowledge borrowing (imo) of BOS *has* bothered me. This author, pretty well-known, reviewed my first three chapters. Then two weeks after I posted Four, setting up Occlumency lessons for Hermione with Snape, she posts her own story--about AD arranging Occlumency lessons from Hermione with Snape during the HBP timeframe. I even thought I caught an echo of one line there.
That bothered me cuz she was the established author and I the newbie--I *knew* my story would get compared to hers, and that people would assume I copied her--and indeed, I've gotten a couple of comments on their similarity.
You do something *that* similar, or you copy a device or creature found in a fic (like snarkyroxy's blood dagger or moonfilly from Before the Dawn, or you borrow an OC, then I think you need acknowledgements--but inspiration or influences? Not necessary.
Which doesn't mean you saying BOS influenced you wouldn't be appreciated--being associated with your story would be a pleasure*g*
And yeah, I feel much of the same frustration--which is part of the fun of trying to work things out between the lines. Though I should warn you, it can also be a ball and chain trying to make it work--I'll be releived to finally go beyond the events of the book in my WIP.
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See, that sucks! I dunno, I always find that giving credit improves my karma. I can't understand why there are fen out there who don't credit, who steal or-- more incredibly but it does happen-- plagirize word for word. None of us are getting paid for this, it's all about community, it doesn't make sense not to acknowledge other's contributions.
Anyway, even if you don't see BOS, part 6's influence, I do, so I went ahead and added a line in the acknowlegments.
Plus, I'm gonna have to pimp your story to the snape community I belong to-- it deserves more readers!
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That's the one that really gets me. How can you do that knowing any reviews, any rep you get isn't yours? What's the attraction of doing it? We're not talking Jason Blair or Stephen Glass here--you're not getting a prestigious byline or resume filler or a paycheck--so WHYYY????
With BOS and this other writer, it's possible it was coincidence--though I'll admit I find it hard to swallow and I havent' been able to read this writer since--and she had been a favorite. After I posted my fifth chapter, she even went back and reviewed my fourth chapter noting how similar it was to hers. (No kidding?)
If anyone ever says something, I have the dates on FFN to show I posted my fourth chapter before she posted her fic but...
Borrowing ideas and not acknowledging? Unlike plagiarism, that can get iffy--like I said--we all are influenced by others. I can see something of Caeria's Snape in mine, and Dyce's among others (I *wish* I had more of KazVL, Snarkyroxy, LOTM, or Helga in mine, but I'm not sure their Snape is someone I can capture if I tried.)
But I wouldn't put that debt in acknowledgements--because they might not appreciate my fic being linked with theirs! Plus, it's tenuous--and about attitude and portrayal--not a copying of scenarios.
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There's a similar problem with academics-- like fandom it's a small community, there's much interaction and intellectual cross-pollination going on, and when an academic whose work I love turns out to be an dumbass, I always feel slimed. But this is worse, because it's your story and it makes it so much more personal.
I admit, it had never occurred to me that an author wouldn't want to be acknowledged because he or she wouldn't want to be associated with an author's fic-- I think now we're getting into fan community dynamics and politics that I must be totally naive about...
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Its a problem I had in Trek, and now have sometimes already even in HP. You get to know the authors as personalities beyond their fic, and it's not always a good thing!
In one way, it's really wonderful. I never wrote creatively before fanfic. The way authors were accessible made them *people* to me--and so made writing something I felt I could do to. Otoh, there's someone in Trek who was a fav author, who my intereactions with became so bitter, I could no longer enjoy her fic. It happens. We're people.
I admit, it had never occurred to me that an author wouldn't want to be acknowledged because he or she wouldn't want to be associated with an author's fic
I started in Trek. I wrote there this short vignette very early on that made something of a splash (and in a much smaller fandom, splashes btw get heard--no plagiarism in Trek--no one would dare--we all knew each other and our stories). Well, two people wrote a sequel based on it.
In one case I was absolutely thrilled. The person was one of my absolutely favorite writers, and since it was based on my story she asked me to beta, and I got my own first beta out of it (and I loved the story she wrote).
In the second case, the writer did not ask, and I winced when I saw the story. This was a writer whose style I didn't like, and who I found very squicky (themes of incest and underage sex were frequent in his fic). He set his sequel of my story within his AU world.
I wasn't happy.
Otoh, I later wrote yet another story, and it got a spontaneous sequel--acknowledged, but permission wasn't sought. I was thrilled. Because it was GOOD dammit. How could I know feel like Christmas had come? So I think it depends--but there are often undercurrents to thinks like acknowledgements of other fics/writer influences and even betas you wouldn't believe.
I think now we're getting into fan community dynamics and politics that I must be totally naive about...
I really stepped in it in Trek--I'm learned to be much more cautious in HP. Those currents are there and can be dangerous--its smart to sit and watch for a while--but its why loads of people find themselves happier in second fandoms--they make the mistakes in their first.
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I know what you mean-- it's the community element that makes it seem less like 'OMG, I'm writing' and more like 'I'm telling a story to some friends of mine.'
But when you have people, you have conflict.
and in a much smaller fandom, splashes btw get heard--no plagiarism in Trek--no one would dare--we all knew each other and our stories
Harry Potter is so unbelieveably HUGE. I wonder how that affects things. I mean, years ago, I was on the fringes of Highlander: The Series fandom. But it was such a small fandom (probably smaller than trek), that I never heard about any plagiarism, and if there was drama and conflict, it pretty much went over my head. But I was more of a reader than a writer in that fandom, and that probably makes a big difference.
I can't believe the regularity with which stories are reported as being outright word for word plagiarized in HP (and I only hear about the D/Hr ones-- the number in the fandom as a whole must be massive). I think you're right; it must have to do with the hugeness. I wonder too about the proliferation of unmoderated webarchives and such-like. When I was reading in Highlander it was 10 years ago and everything was through email lists. And everybody knew each other. It's hard to imagine someone posting a story to HLFIC-L that someone else had already written; someone would have spoken up immediately and the poster would have been banned from the list.
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It does. I got a recent review to BOS and it had two subtle digs that would have gone right over a reader's head--but if you knew the background, and knew who this person knew among our common acquaintance...
That was frequent in Trek. The knife going in where only a few people could see. And in comparison, Trek is tiny to HP--which has its good and bad sides. I think, actually, HP is more tolerant because it's large--in Trek, being outed as being of the wrong politics was social death.
And you can get away from the bad here pretty easily. No "big name fan" or any one archive rules the roost. While in Trek, one BNF and their clique could make online life hell for you.
I know of a Trek refugee in Highlander--two of them in fact--Killasandra and Hafital. Slash writers, so I don't know if you'd know them, but both wonderful writers and people. Trek lost them to Highlander at least in part from what I gleaned from them because Highlander was far less toxic--and yes, it's smaller.
When I was reading in Highlander it was 10 years ago and everything was through email lists. And everybody knew each other. It's hard to imagine someone posting a story to HLFIC-L that someone else had already written; someone would have spoken up immediately and the poster would have been banned from the list.
Same in Trek. No moderated archives, and LJ was just taking off when I left. People posted to two Newsgroups and Yahoo email list. FFN wasn't even posted to for the most part by the respected writers. We ran to "one-shots" (a term I never heard till HP) and we just didn't get the reviews you do in HP. I have 17 stories posted to FFN under my Trek name--even my longest and most popular story on FFN - a novella of 20 thousand words--has only 13 reviews--and that's pretty typical. My friend and Trek beta - she's one of the big names in Trek. Her most reviewed story has only 20-something reviews.
In comparison, on FFN alone, BOS has 73 reviews, and my vignette "Gambit" has 31 reviews. It's just mindboggling for me any way I try to look at HP. It's just so much larger in scale. Just the HG/SS ship alone by itself dwarfs Trek. I read just about every Trek fanfic of note within months of getting involved--I haven't even touched the tip of HG/SS almost a year since I started reading it.
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I can see that. HP is so gigantic that everyone can find their niche of people with the same likes and dislikes. Though I've surfed the HP4GU groups and yowza-- it gets vicious over there. Mainly between the Snape-haters and Snape-defenders. Each thinks the other is delusional, and neither group on that list can stop haranguing at each other.
Which is why I prefer hanging with my happy, cozy slytherin-loving groups.
though ok, now that I think about it, I have already witnessed one ugly blow-up on a Snape-discussion list. So ok, dysfunction is everywhere in fandom I guess. When it happens I tend to tune out and wait for it to be over...
I haven't read Killasandra, but I've heard of her; my HL-slashfen friends loved her work. There were lots of great writers in HL fandom, slash, het and gen. But the show died, and then well, people drifted...
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*nods* - though I do tend to try to stay away from the Snape-hostile portions of the fandom--why get myself tied up in knots either going to my guy's defense--or not.
But yeah--its a matter of carefully observing. I think one thing good about LJ is people expose themselves here, for better and worse--so just watch carefully, and you can learn who it's better to keep some distance from eventually. But it can take a while--some of the scariest people I've met in fandom are the ones who at first seem utterly charming.
I haven't read Killasandra, but I've heard of her; my HL-slashfen friends loved her work. There were lots of great writers in HL fandom, slash, het and gen. But the show died, and then well, people drifted...
That's common--Enterprise really killed Trek--even before it was cancelled. It's why I worry what will become of HP when Book 7 comes out--I'm not actually in much of a hurry to see that happen.
Even if we got everything a HG/SS shipper (or Draco shipper) could want (which I doubt)--Snape on the side of the Light and alive, Hermione alive, Draco alive and redeemed, an open ending so we can take the characters where we want (that I think isn't possible--I heard JKR has written an "ever after" epilogue)--even if that happened, the end of source material seems to diminish fandoms considerably.
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Me either! I'm dreading it actually. I hear other fans talk about how they can't wait for Book 7, and I'm like, hm, actually, she could take a couple years off and that would be ok with me...
Even if we got everything a HG/SS shipper (or Draco shipper) could want (which I doubt)--Snape on the side of the Light and alive, Hermione alive, Draco alive and redeemed, an open ending so we can take the characters where we want (that I think isn't possible--I heard JKR has written an "ever after" epilogue)--even if that happened, the end of source material seems to diminish fandoms considerably
there was talk on one of the Snape lists that JKR has hinted fairly broadly that Draco is dead. And whil e I'd like to think she has some great plot justification for killing off His Blondness, I almost suspect that she's doing it because the Draco and Snape fans have always annoyed her.
There are writers-- both novelists and screenwriters-- in scifi and fantasy who are themselves fans. I think about Joss Whedon, various people involved in trek, and loads of novelists. And they 'get' fandom because they are themselves fans. I don't think JKR gets fandom, or the needs of fans to partipate in and tell their own stories about the universe. It always sounds like she feels imposed upon when people have alternative views of the characters.
I mean, to be fair, she started out writing a children's novel and who could ever predict it would have become what it did.
But yes. Book 7. A Much Feared Event. Well, maybe she'll ahve another baby. Really, couldn't she just hold off a year or two? It's not like needs the money...
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Oh, I don't know--I think she just likes messing with us. When I saw a TV interview with her and could guage her intonation and expression, she would get a mischeivous look when Snape came up. Even her "deeply horrible" and "worse than Voldemort" statements aren't so bad when you read them in context--and a Brit HP fan I know says that in a interview for a Scottish paper, when asked about Snape she said "I'd hesitate to say I'm in love with him."--which is practically admitting she does!
There are writers-- both novelists and screenwriters-- in scifi and fantasy who are themselves fans. I think about Joss Whedon, various people involved in trek, and loads of novelists. And they 'get' fandom because they are themselves fans. I don't think JKR gets fandom, or the needs of fans to partipate in and tell their own stories about the universe. It always sounds like she feels imposed upon when people have alternative views of the characters.
Really? Because I got the opposite impression. She seems to enjoy interacting with fans, she let herself be interviewed by Mugglenet and admitted she peeks at HP forums and is aware of the popular ships. She's also pretty tolerant, even encouraging of fanfic compared to most. Some authors--Rice, Goodkind, Enrod, Robin Hobb, Hamilton--and until recently McCaffrey--who don't even allow fanfic. I'd heard that she's even been encouraging it as a good place to learn craft--which is an amazing concession from a pro writer--most treat fanfic with contempt.
From what I heard, her main beef with fanfic was with those that put her characters in adult situations, especially if it was accessible to children. Especially considering that HP is intended as kidlit, not really an unreasonable concern.
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I certainly hadn't heard that quote about Snape! Makes me at least a little more hopeful!
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I didn't care much for Snape or HP before HBP--yet by the close of the book I was convinced it was a setup--it just read that way to me--that's what intrigued me. Going strictly by the book--I was absolutely convinced Snape was innocent of murder and that JKR was quite clever--and she'd come across as very canny to me in the interview I'd seen on A&E's bio of her.
Then I hit fandom and was shocked that so many people seemed to have read a different book than I (though many got it). I was more disturbed by what I'd heard that JKR had said, than anything in the books themselves. That's what made me go hunting for her quotes in context--worried I was misreading things after all.
But in context, I found her just as slippery as any Slytherin...
I tell ya--she LOVES messing with us.
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