Nine and Ten

[dapperzombie]

I just finished re-watching Doctor Who series 2, and now I understand more what versipellis had meant about Russel T. Davies' decline in quality. The series was still good, but it had a handful of moments where I went, "really? Seriously?"

That said, I've also concluded that I do like Chris Eccleston's Doctor more than David Tennant's. It's not so much to do

Comments

[versipellis]

I hope I haven't prejudiced you against him. Curious to know what moments made you go "what?" though (as always!)

Chris Eccleston feels like "my" Doctor - he was certainly the one I was most upset about leaving! And yeah, I agree with you about his performance.

[dapperzombie]

Oh no, you haven't done that at all :D Davies was still a good writer, and I still adore David Tennant. It's just that the former started to decline a little (this series) and the latter didn't feel as strong as Chris Eccleston. Unfortunately, Davies' writing did affect David Tennant, but more on a directorial level than an acting skill level.

Let's see, moments that made me go "what"...I think the biggest one was Rose being able to go "Yeah I could go the rest of my life without my mom" so easily. Like - seriously? I know the Doctor has shown you a fantastic life, but I'd like to think the person who brought you into the world and raised you for nineteen years would take precedence. When I first watched Doomsday, it struck a sour cord, but I was too busy enjoying it to notice. Now, though...Rose acting like her mom takes such a distant second to the Doctor is VERY "wut"-worthy, especially after we'd seen her confront Elton after he'd upset Jackie just a few episodes earlier. I expected Rose to actually be conflicted, to realize

[versipellis]

It's satisfying to have someone else agreeing with me about this who's been completely apart from the RTD-controversy when it was happening ^^

Yeah, I seem to remember feeling unimpressed with Rose at that point too. Especially as Jackie brought her up alone - you'd think their relationship would be pretty strong.

I liked the idea of the Cassandra tradition but I seem to recall it was quite sudden. Haven't seen that ep for aaages though ;)

I agree that it fit with the Doctor's character, but I felt like the writers thought it was a-ok for him to do that to Harriet and that it was funny and awesome when I thought it was hypocritical and sexist. Gyaaah. SHUT UP DOCTOR. *cough* Yeah, maybe still not over that.

*cuddles Mickey* he was awesome in this season. And yeah, the stuff about his gran was very sad.

Yeah. It's not IT'S ALL RTD'S FAULT OMG by any means; just a few trends that irritated me more as time went on. And some Torchwood stuff as well probably fed into it *cough*

[dapperzombie]

I hate to say it, but I liken Rose's attitude towards Jackie to Bella's attitude towards her father in Twilight - where Bella is ready to throw her entire family away for this (non-meta) abusive, stupid vampire she's only known and had a high school-styled crush on for maybe half a year. Granted, Rose is so very NOT an idiot most of the time, and the Doctor is more than a shallow sparklepire and there's a valid basis for their relationship, but the parallel is still there and it makes me squirm.

I didn't really feel like it was sexist to have the Doctor depose Harriet, but I could just be annoyed at everything else surrounding the event

[versipellis]

Oh gods, I can definitely see that parallel (despite still not having watched/read Twilight). Dammit, Rose, get better role models!

I didn't think it was sexist that he did it - I can totally imagine him doing the same to a male PM - but to me, the "don't you think she looks tired?" is an undermining that doesn't feel like it would work so much with a man. The idea of a woman being weak and therefore looking tired (and the connotations with that being stressed/ugly/emotional) feel like they're ideas more firmly embedded in our psyche about women than men. I don't know, if a male leader is seen as "tired" to me it has more sense of "working very, very hard and very devoted to his country". That was what bothered me in terms of sexism about it ^^

Nothing's been as good as Bad Wolf. And yeah, it did seem quite product placement-y. You're right about the Tooth and Claw placing though - I'd not thought of that before!

[dapperzombie]

Don't even bother with Twilight. It's not worth it. *sigh*

Okay, I see what you mean now. Yes, that's a vicious double-standard, and Davies could have written a better way for the Doctor to psychologically oust Harriet. Maybe it was setup for both the Master's return as Saxton Hale (he was mentioned very briefly in The Runaway Bride, the start of another meme) and Harriet being the one to pull Torchwood Three, Martha and Sarah Jane together to find the Doctor (which was a very noble way to go out, I'll admit).

[versipellis]

Duly noted ^^

I will admit that Harriet's actions in Season 4 were pretty damn awesome and almost made up for the ousting thing. And I guess one can point out that the Doctor ousting Harriet led to a whole host of Master-related fail and misery...