The Heisenberg uncertainty principle shows that there is an assymetry relation between measurements of objects. Some of these assymetry relations are between the measurement
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We should remember that the reason that the uncertainty relationships arise is due to the wave nature of 'particles'. For all types of waves, the position can only be determined at the expense of knowledge of its wavelength. Particles are represented in terms of the addition of many sine waves to yield a wave packet. Using the defintion of momentum, we get that uncertainty relation of position and momentum. Another relation is that of energy and time. Scroedinger's wave equation actually yeilds the same measurments of uncertainty as the Heisenberg relationships. As far as interpreations and implications of this, and if you can apply it to other relationships, thats all you Kevin. As for what its used for, its useful in, catch this, the precision of measurements in the lab, but I think that it is more a statement about measurement rather than a tool. You should really go and talk to one of the Physics professors here about this stuff.
Re: my two centsdangerzooeyMay 26 2005, 22:21:20 UTC
It sounds like you're agreeing with me. Am I wrong? I too think the UP isn't really a tool, and hence my qualms at attributing fault to some observer. UP is about a part of human evidence and explanation, and nothing more.
Re: my two centsdangerzooeyMay 27 2005, 01:21:06 UTC
I don't think people have believed there'd be a winner in particle/wave duality for a long time. Some of my conversations with lyght over this issue have pointed towards that. What's unfortunate is that high school teachers teach it that way, so those of us who go on to study the issues are surprised to find out that we're all perfectly happy with the wave-particle being a single thing having wave-properties and particle-properties, which can't be precisely measured together.
I think mental measurements could only apply to the UP by analogy though, just due to the nature of its derivation.
Re: my two centsovermann84May 27 2005, 02:26:48 UTC
When you said,
"I'm trying to consider whether there might be mental measurements to which this principle might apply."
you are refering to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle's, right? I meant by nature, the way it comes from wave mechanics. There may be some kind of inverse relation between knowledge of moment and confident in something, but I dont think Id see this as being strictly related to Heisenberg's principle. Until you come up with a relation of wavelength to confidence, it seems to me it would just be another uncertainty relationship - which may be your point in fact.
Using the defintion of momentum, we get that uncertainty relation of position and momentum. Another relation is that of energy and time. Scroedinger's wave equation actually yeilds the same measurments of uncertainty as the Heisenberg relationships.
As far as interpreations and implications of this, and if you can apply it to other relationships, thats all you Kevin. As for what its used for, its useful in, catch this, the precision of measurements in the lab, but I think that it is more a statement about measurement rather than a tool. You should really go and talk to one of the Physics professors here about this stuff.
this is will from phil club by the way . . .
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Good to see you here, feel free to stay awhile.
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I think mental measurements could only apply to the UP by analogy though, just due to the nature of its derivation.
How so? What nature is that?
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Oh, and of course the bountiful help from demoivre.
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"I'm trying to consider whether there might be mental measurements to which this principle might apply."
you are refering to Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle's, right? I meant by nature, the way it comes from wave mechanics. There may be some kind of inverse relation between knowledge of moment and confident in something, but I dont think Id see this as being strictly related to Heisenberg's principle. Until you come up with a relation of wavelength to confidence, it seems to me it would just be another uncertainty relationship - which may be your point in fact.
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