Paul/Ringo - I side with Ringo here. I think Paul's clearly got another agenda and that is jealousy. He's probably thinking he's just got rid of John (as Cynthia's here) and now he's got Ringo to battle with. Ringo knows enough of what went on before to appreciate this. For all his faults, and he's not really going about winning Charlie's heart in the right way, Paul's still been their champion throughout.
Ringo/George - No sooner does he give Jealous Paul the slip, here's Jealous George. George is quite lovely in this scene. All jealous and that. I'm not sure what Ringo's trying to do here, except maybe shoot the breeze with George after that terse encounter with Paul. George is a little too wound up about other things to allow that though. Ringo in his usual bumbling way manages to just wind him up that little bit more. I don't think I quite realised before, but this is what sets the ball in motion for what George does next, doesn't it?
Ringo/Cynthia - this is a nice scene too. Emphasises Ringo's lingering feelings of being the outsider as he's reminded that he wasn't trusted with the John's married secret. He genuinely feels for Cyn though, I think. I wonder if he kind of thinks that maybe they wouldn't let him back in either and he'd be pleading "But I'm the drummer!" Also from the conversation with George before, George clearly knows more in depth detail about John and Cyn's marriage than Ringo does.
Charlie/Howard/The Other Girls - Charlie was the leader of this group, and I think she feels she's lost control of it. Howard's promising things that don't seem to be materialising, except for making her take promo opportunities she'd really rather swerve. I don't think he's got wind of her date with Ringo though. I'm sure Howard would want to capitalise on that too. A repeat of London. I think the Howard/Charlie relationship is interesting. Did something happen between those two before that we don't know about? A root for all this hostility she has towards him? Charlie's exchange with Annette was interesting too - why is she so angry? The group will fall apart if Charlie continues along this road.
Stan/Charlie/Ringo - Saved my favourite for last.
I feel quite sorry for Stan. He has feelings for Charlie and she's just a bit of a bitch to him really. She's using him as a place to stay. He's getting some things out of the deal, but I think he wants more and Charlie won't give it to him. I get the impression this isn't a new thing either. I think she might have strung him along for a while. Stan was interested in the Beatles and she was cagey and wouldn't give him any info about them - next thing, Ringo's on the phone giving Stan an all together different impression of what Charlie and the Beatles relationship was like.
She didn't hesitate to give Ringo Stan's number - well, she hesitated a little but she did it anyway - so now Ringo has an idea of what she's like as well. He was expecting a little competition from John and Paul maybe, but now there's a third guy in the picture, I can't blame him for reconsidering if its a good idea to go out with her or not. I don't think I realised from the prologue that Charlie was actually living with Stan. That moves the goal posts entirely. It makes their relationship more intriguing.
I'm not sure if you're familiar with 'Mad Men' but the Stan in this story is the Stan in that television show before he started working in that advertising office.
Charlie is using Stan. Even if she doesn't want to admit it to herself. She can rationalize it by thinking 'He's getting something out of this as well.' But, she's using him for a place to stay. This is what she does and hops from place to place before she wears out her welcome. She keeps coming back to Stan because she knows he'll let her in and she's fond of him in a way as much as someone like Charlie can be fond of anyone.
In the back of her mind she knew what could happen when Stan found out she'd given his number to someone guy to call her at his place. Not only does that put her on the outs with Stan who seems to be genuinely interested in wanting more with her. Now, it also effects how Ringo views her as well. He was hoping for a bit of fun with her but now he doesn't know what will come from their evening out. And, the other thought that you brought up that Ringo thought if he had any competition it would be from John or Paul. But, no there's this mysterious third guy he doesn't know anything about!
No, nothing happened between Charlie and Howard. I think it's pretty simple. She's horrible to him because it's a lot easier for her to place the blame squarely on his shoulders for the Debs not being where she wants them in their career at this point. Think about what happened before the diner scene. Stan told Charlie he wanted her out. Now, she's got to figure out where she's going to go. In an earlier chapter we learn that Charlie had to borrow money from Wanda. So, it's safe to assume that she's not great about handling her money. And, she's dealing with the disappointment of YET another meeting called together by Howard without any real progress. She gives him a hard time. And, she also does the same to Annette because in her eyes from the things Charlie has said about Annette having financial security because of her dad and a reference to her 'wonderful boyfriend' Annette doesn't struggle in Charlie's eyes. I'll have to try and figure out how to make that clear because I can see why it appears that Charlie is just picking on Annette for no good reason. She's not coming across well.
It's been difficult to give Ringo things to do in this story. Which is an odd thing to say because I can do things with him. I don't know. I thought a scene or two with Cynthia might be interesting but I can't really reveal what's going on with her and John because I don't think she'd pour her heart out to Ringo. So, ultimately their scene falls flat in progressing his story but it might serve as motivation for him to finally phone Maureen.
George and Ringo. Yes, this exchange is what gets George to seek out John to question him on what he was up to with Annette. Yet, John's sharp tone with him is enough to get George to reconsider confrontation and drop the subject. It sort or mirrors the first scene with Ringo and Paul.
Ringo's not hanging about to fish for information. He just manages to put his foot in his mouth. While Paul is only there to find out what he can.
Oh really? It's a long time since I watched Mad Men. I can't remember the details very well. I imagined Stan as someone skinnier and a lot cuter, lol. It's funny how you picture characters, isn't it? Like me, you don't go into physical descriptions very deeply. (I don't think you need to unless its important, and I think shopping list style descriptions are boring).
I'm just playing devil's advocate really too. You can see why and how Charlie is jealous of Annette. She presumes, because she doesn't know any better, that Annette has this lovely sweet relationship with George which is going swimmingly and she's got this lovely little life with a nice cosy job - not least working with her father, and we know there is tension in Charlie's family background. Of course Charlie is envious. She would love to have Annette's life. We know too, that Annette has problems of her own, but Charlie doesn't realise this, and her envy - and probably a sense of why is it so unfair? She has everything and I have nothing - manifests itself in her attitude towards Annette. So anyway, it does come through fine, don't worry. If she keeps going like that though, she will drive Annette - and Wanda, and Howard - away.
I empathise too, with the lack of knowing what to actually give a character to do, lol. In real life, what would they do? Watch telly? Read a book? Not very dramatic. It's tricky in the downtime bits. I think the Ringo/Cynthia scene came over well, and though, no, she probably wouldn't totally pour her heart out to Ringo she might in so much as she's a bit alone with John being an arse, and he's just there at the right moment. She does, to an extent, by telling him what happened to her when she couldn't get back in. And Ringo being a down to earth, Northern English guy, clams up and feels awkward because she's crying. Ha ha, very accurate.
Paul/Ringo - I side with Ringo here. I think Paul's clearly got another agenda and that is jealousy. He's probably thinking he's just got rid of John (as Cynthia's here) and now he's got Ringo to battle with. Ringo knows enough of what went on before to appreciate this. For all his faults, and he's not really going about winning Charlie's heart in the right way, Paul's still been their champion throughout.
Ringo/George - No sooner does he give Jealous Paul the slip, here's Jealous George. George is quite lovely in this scene. All jealous and that. I'm not sure what Ringo's trying to do here, except maybe shoot the breeze with George after that terse encounter with Paul. George is a little too wound up about other things to allow that though. Ringo in his usual bumbling way manages to just wind him up that little bit more. I don't think I quite realised before, but this is what sets the ball in motion for what George does next, doesn't it?
Ringo/Cynthia - this is a nice scene too. Emphasises Ringo's lingering feelings of being the outsider as he's reminded that he wasn't trusted with the John's married secret. He genuinely feels for Cyn though, I think. I wonder if he kind of thinks that maybe they wouldn't let him back in either and he'd be pleading "But I'm the drummer!" Also from the conversation with George before, George clearly knows more in depth detail about John and Cyn's marriage than Ringo does.
Charlie/Howard/The Other Girls - Charlie was the leader of this group, and I think she feels she's lost control of it. Howard's promising things that don't seem to be materialising, except for making her take promo opportunities she'd really rather swerve. I don't think he's got wind of her date with Ringo though. I'm sure Howard would want to capitalise on that too. A repeat of London. I think the Howard/Charlie relationship is interesting. Did something happen between those two before that we don't know about? A root for all this hostility she has towards him? Charlie's exchange with Annette was interesting too - why is she so angry? The group will fall apart if Charlie continues along this road.
Stan/Charlie/Ringo - Saved my favourite for last.
I feel quite sorry for Stan. He has feelings for Charlie and she's just a bit of a bitch to him really. She's using him as a place to stay. He's getting some things out of the deal, but I think he wants more and Charlie won't give it to him. I get the impression this isn't a new thing either. I think she might have strung him along for a while. Stan was interested in the Beatles and she was cagey and wouldn't give him any info about them - next thing, Ringo's on the phone giving Stan an all together different impression of what Charlie and the Beatles relationship was like.
She didn't hesitate to give Ringo Stan's number - well, she hesitated a little but she did it anyway - so now Ringo has an idea of what she's like as well. He was expecting a little competition from John and Paul maybe, but now there's a third guy in the picture, I can't blame him for reconsidering if its a good idea to go out with her or not. I don't think I realised from the prologue that Charlie was actually living with Stan. That moves the goal posts entirely. It makes their relationship more intriguing.
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Charlie is using Stan. Even if she doesn't want to admit it to herself. She can rationalize it by thinking 'He's getting something out of this as well.' But, she's using him for a place to stay. This is what she does and hops from place to place before she wears out her welcome. She keeps coming back to Stan because she knows he'll let her in and she's fond of him in a way as much as someone like Charlie can be fond of anyone.
In the back of her mind she knew what could happen when Stan found out she'd given his number to someone guy to call her at his place. Not only does that put her on the outs with Stan who seems to be genuinely interested in wanting more with her. Now, it also effects how Ringo views her as well. He was hoping for a bit of fun with her but now he doesn't know what will come from their evening out. And, the other thought that you brought up that Ringo thought if he had any competition it would be from John or Paul. But, no there's this mysterious third guy he doesn't know anything about!
No, nothing happened between Charlie and Howard. I think it's pretty simple. She's horrible to him because it's a lot easier for her to place the blame squarely on his shoulders for the Debs not being where she wants them in their career at this point. Think about what happened before the diner scene. Stan told Charlie he wanted her out. Now, she's got to figure out where she's going to go. In an earlier chapter we learn that Charlie had to borrow money from Wanda. So, it's safe to assume that she's not great about handling her money. And, she's dealing with the disappointment of YET another meeting called together by Howard without any real progress. She gives him a hard time. And, she also does the same to Annette because in her eyes from the things Charlie has said about Annette having financial security because of her dad and a reference to her 'wonderful boyfriend' Annette doesn't struggle in Charlie's eyes. I'll have to try and figure out how to make that clear because I can see why it appears that Charlie is just picking on Annette for no good reason. She's not coming across well.
It's been difficult to give Ringo things to do in this story. Which is an odd thing to say because I can do things with him. I don't know. I thought a scene or two with Cynthia might be interesting but I can't really reveal what's going on with her and John because I don't think she'd pour her heart out to Ringo. So, ultimately their scene falls flat in progressing his story but it might serve as motivation for him to finally phone Maureen.
George and Ringo. Yes, this exchange is what gets George to seek out John to question him on what he was up to with Annette. Yet, John's sharp tone with him is enough to get George to reconsider confrontation and drop the subject. It sort or mirrors the first scene with Ringo and Paul.
Ringo's not hanging about to fish for information. He just manages to put his foot in his mouth. While Paul is only there to find out what he can.
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I'm just playing devil's advocate really too. You can see why and how Charlie is jealous of Annette. She presumes, because she doesn't know any better, that Annette has this lovely sweet relationship with George which is going swimmingly and she's got this lovely little life with a nice cosy job - not least working with her father, and we know there is tension in Charlie's family background. Of course Charlie is envious. She would love to have Annette's life. We know too, that Annette has problems of her own, but Charlie doesn't realise this, and her envy - and probably a sense of why is it so unfair? She has everything and I have nothing - manifests itself in her attitude towards Annette. So anyway, it does come through fine, don't worry. If she keeps going like that though, she will drive Annette - and Wanda, and Howard - away.
I empathise too, with the lack of knowing what to actually give a character to do, lol. In real life, what would they do? Watch telly? Read a book? Not very dramatic. It's tricky in the downtime bits. I think the Ringo/Cynthia scene came over well, and though, no, she probably wouldn't totally pour her heart out to Ringo she might in so much as she's a bit alone with John being an arse, and he's just there at the right moment. She does, to an extent, by telling him what happened to her when she couldn't get back in. And Ringo being a down to earth, Northern English guy, clams up and feels awkward because she's crying. Ha ha, very accurate.
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