A character named Sue
Seanan McGuire has made an excellent post about the misuse of the term Mary Sue. It really is an excellent post, thoughtful and insightful and calling out some issues that people really need to pay more attention to because they're those issues that just slide by insidiously, sucking all the while. Heaps of things about unconscious use of derogatory terms for female characters we just don't like, whereas we'd probably use more analytical/critical language to describe male characters we don't like. (The difference, really, between saying, "she's a bitch" and "he's unpleasant and condescending and I don't like him because of it". We might mean the same thing, but the different language choice unconsciously reinforces certain gender dichotomies.)
So that stuff? That stuff I totally agree with and could not endorse more. But there's other stuff in there that I didn't agree with, so I'm going to ruminate a little on why no, actually, Mary Sue is bad, wherever she shows up - and she CAN show up in original fiction, possibly because my definition of Mary Sue is a little different. (Yes, it's probably a semantics argument. Those are, actually, my favourite sort, because what we call things and how we define terms is important.)
Mostly, I think my disagreement boils down to this: fanfic and original fiction are not, actually, all that different. The things that make bad fanfic also make for bad origfic - shoddy characterisation, purple prose, unrealistic action (be it porn or battle) and characters with unbalanced positive/negative elements. And the things that make good fanfic also make for good origfic.
Not all original characters within fanfic are Mary Sues. I say this as someone who's wrestled with writing an original character within a fanfic universe and hopes she's succeeded, but I also say it as someone who's read stories with original characters and found them interesting and wonderful and beneficial for the story. Sometimes original characters within fanfic are just good characters, who serve story purpose and deliver immense satisfaction all 'round, not just in their facilitation of the "known" characters, but in and of themselves.
Not all protagonists of original fiction are disproportionate creations of perfection with a few flaws pasted on to win sympathy. Most of them are complicated and layered and sincerely flawed in ways that are shown and make sense and permeate the character and story. Sure, they're also blessed and special and imbued and important, because otherwise, we wouldn't be reading a story about them. This is where I am in vehement agreement with Ms Mcguire's post: because not liking or empathising with a strong female character does not automatically make her a Sue.
There are, however, Sues out there. And they are shoddy, cheap, thin, vapid storytelling and they should not be let off just because they and/or their author is female.
Here's the twist in the tale, though: just because she actually is a Mary Sue in a story that's not great literature doesn't mean someone isn't going to have an amazing empathetic connection with her and love her and the story to bits. Some things just defy all sense (like Twilight). And just because I hate something with a fiery passion and see no reason for anyone to enjoy it does not mean that it should not be written, read and enjoyed. It's not like the words are going to get used up. (Sure, having her around the place may make it more difficult for people to take the genres where she shows up seriously, but I'm actually of the opinion that reading should be about fun, not about being taken seriously. YMMV.)
Addendum: I believe the author-insertion angle of Mary-Sue-ness is overplayed. I think that Mary Sue more often presents wish fulfilment for the author, the heroine of the perfect fairytale, which we do not necessarily associate with us. In fact, often it's necessary to divorce the fairytale princess from ourselves in order for the fantasy to be believable - because these things don't happen to us. When Mary Sue connects with readers, she does so because she is also their wish-fulfilment. (And maybe that should be the one-stop litmus test. Would you want to be this character? Actually, genuinely? For almost every excellent, strong female protag I can think of, my answer would be, "OH HELL NO," almost directly proportional to how much I love them. Good characters have to deal with - actually deal with - way too much shit, too many scars in their past. Mary Sues may have had bad things happen to them, but it never seems to bother them too much.)
Just as a PS: of course readers are more critical of female characters. Most media with a strong female protag is probably aimed at a female readership (women read more than men anyway), and women have always been - and possibly always will be - more critical of other women. I'm not saying it's not a problem and something women should be aware of and work to remedy, I'm just saying that it's there and we haven't fixed it yet.
Originally posted on Dreamwidth
So that stuff? That stuff I totally agree with and could not endorse more. But there's other stuff in there that I didn't agree with, so I'm going to ruminate a little on why no, actually, Mary Sue is bad, wherever she shows up - and she CAN show up in original fiction, possibly because my definition of Mary Sue is a little different. (Yes, it's probably a semantics argument. Those are, actually, my favourite sort, because what we call things and how we define terms is important.)
Mostly, I think my disagreement boils down to this: fanfic and original fiction are not, actually, all that different. The things that make bad fanfic also make for bad origfic - shoddy characterisation, purple prose, unrealistic action (be it porn or battle) and characters with unbalanced positive/negative elements. And the things that make good fanfic also make for good origfic.
Not all original characters within fanfic are Mary Sues. I say this as someone who's wrestled with writing an original character within a fanfic universe and hopes she's succeeded, but I also say it as someone who's read stories with original characters and found them interesting and wonderful and beneficial for the story. Sometimes original characters within fanfic are just good characters, who serve story purpose and deliver immense satisfaction all 'round, not just in their facilitation of the "known" characters, but in and of themselves.
Not all protagonists of original fiction are disproportionate creations of perfection with a few flaws pasted on to win sympathy. Most of them are complicated and layered and sincerely flawed in ways that are shown and make sense and permeate the character and story. Sure, they're also blessed and special and imbued and important, because otherwise, we wouldn't be reading a story about them. This is where I am in vehement agreement with Ms Mcguire's post: because not liking or empathising with a strong female character does not automatically make her a Sue.
There are, however, Sues out there. And they are shoddy, cheap, thin, vapid storytelling and they should not be let off just because they and/or their author is female.
Here's the twist in the tale, though: just because she actually is a Mary Sue in a story that's not great literature doesn't mean someone isn't going to have an amazing empathetic connection with her and love her and the story to bits. Some things just defy all sense (like Twilight). And just because I hate something with a fiery passion and see no reason for anyone to enjoy it does not mean that it should not be written, read and enjoyed. It's not like the words are going to get used up. (Sure, having her around the place may make it more difficult for people to take the genres where she shows up seriously, but I'm actually of the opinion that reading should be about fun, not about being taken seriously. YMMV.)
Addendum: I believe the author-insertion angle of Mary-Sue-ness is overplayed. I think that Mary Sue more often presents wish fulfilment for the author, the heroine of the perfect fairytale, which we do not necessarily associate with us. In fact, often it's necessary to divorce the fairytale princess from ourselves in order for the fantasy to be believable - because these things don't happen to us. When Mary Sue connects with readers, she does so because she is also their wish-fulfilment. (And maybe that should be the one-stop litmus test. Would you want to be this character? Actually, genuinely? For almost every excellent, strong female protag I can think of, my answer would be, "OH HELL NO," almost directly proportional to how much I love them. Good characters have to deal with - actually deal with - way too much shit, too many scars in their past. Mary Sues may have had bad things happen to them, but it never seems to bother them too much.)
Just as a PS: of course readers are more critical of female characters. Most media with a strong female protag is probably aimed at a female readership (women read more than men anyway), and women have always been - and possibly always will be - more critical of other women. I'm not saying it's not a problem and something women should be aware of and work to remedy, I'm just saying that it's there and we haven't fixed it yet.
Originally posted on Dreamwidth