Babbling about Lucia/Bastian and Tellius? Do want. :D
I was thinking lately. (Yeah, I know, what a surprise!)
Namely about Lucia and Bastian´s ending. It says that they never married but had a live-long affair. This leads me to some questions about Crimea (and those two).
1. They have a relationship without being married. In a medieval world. I don't know the Crimean laws or even the social norms concerning this, but since this is a pseudo-medieval world, I have to assume 'having an affair = bad'. Right? Right. What would other people think about them then? Personally, I believe that there would be many problems and conflicts. Elincia may support them (Geoffrey only reluctantly because he's a bit more conversative), but all the other people in the castle? Hell no. Bad gossip and evil rumours; first only about Lucia and Bastian. Later it will spread onto their families and people will think that their parents (Lucia´s and Bastian´s) taught them such loose morals. That would of course effect Geoffrey and Elincia as well (are family or close friends. In Geoffrey and Elincia´s case there already has been rumours about an affair before (in RD) and now their sister repeats that. I can see some nobles seeing this as a prove that Geoffrey and Elincia had had an affair before => very bad results, as in losing respect and growing opposition).
While Lucia may be able to stomach the badtalking about herself, she would be tremendously hurt when people attack her lover and her family. Unfortunately, she can't do anything against the gossip. She can't stop people from talking about her (Elincia may try to help her and makes everything worse; nobles start to distrust her and question her decisions more. Also, quarrels with Geoffrey, since they would not have the same opinion. Drama for fic~) Additionally, if Lucia would bow to the stress and marry Bastian, the gossip would still not stop. Because there was a time when she was doing improper (and maybe sinful) things and suddenly being married won't change the past. Her reputation is destroyed no matter what she does. Besides, Lucia would never bow to pressure. She's a badass.
Bastian wouldn't have that many problems, in contrast. There would be badmouthing about him as well, but people would not be that hard on him because he's a man. (Yes, times were sexist and those poor men couldn't help themselves because those evil, evil women had seduced them. It is really ridiculous when people tried to excuse those poor, helpless war heroes. They are just too weak~ to resist those evil womenz. There also the belief in 'men has affair = My, what a hunk! / Alternatively; ignores because that's a delicate matter' and 'woman has an affair = OMG, slut!'.)
Mm, there should be fic dealing with that.
1.2 This point is related to point 1. What about their children? I don't think it's realistic to think that Lucia and Bastian don't have sex (very hawt sex, for that matter) so children are a possibility. Those children would be illegitimate. Being born out of wedlock is normally not a funny thing. Bastian is the count of Fayre. Would his illegitimate children be able to inherit his title? I think not. I may not know the Crimean laws, but this is too much of a stretch. Maybe Elincia could try to tweak law, I don't know. But people wouldn't like that. Which results in more drama with the nobles (they don't like when Elincia messes around with tradition. Add badmouthing about how Elincia has to clean up after her sister and that it would better for her to abandon Lucia). Well, then one of Bastian´s nephews or nieces have to inherit his title (I refuse to believe that all those FE characters with no mentioned siblings are only-children. Though I do have headcanon for why Geoffrey and Lucia don't have more siblings~) But it still gives his family a bad taste in the mouth that Bastian can't provide them with legitimate heirs. Bastian is not too happy about the situation, but being with Lucia matters more to him than legitimate heirs (and he has badass nephews/nieces anyway).
And what about Lucia as the eldest daughter of the count of Delbray? (Yes, I do believe that their father is the count of Delbray. I haz reasons.)
This leads me to my second, more general wondering.
2. Who can inherit what? How does the inheritance law look like? Let's take the title "count" and all the possessions tied to it as an example. Does the firstborn child inherit everything? Does the firstborn son inherit everything? Or does the king/ the old count/ the council of nobles decide who inherits?
- Personally, I can't think of any female inheriting a title (queen, countess, or anything else) where nobody protested (I'm not familiar with FE1-6). Exception is Elincia in FE9 because that was a very special situation. I conclude that this doesn't happen often or is welcome.
It may also matter if the daughter is an only child, since then they don't have a choice. This case another question comes up; when she marries, does her husband take over her role? (This may or may not depend on the strength of the woman. If she is more dominant than her husband, she may stay the "sole" ruler. (I'm thinking of England here) In a society that does not accept a woman as a ruler, however, she would lose her position to her husband. She could use her husband as a puppet for her own ambitions if he's pushover. But ruling openly is not possible.) I also have to ask myself how Elincia would react. If the rule were that only the firstborn son can inherit, what would she do if her first child is a girl? Would she change the old laws because she knows that girls are capable of being badass queens/ countesses/ etc? Probably yes because Elincia is that badass. This would once against cause the nobles to protest and stuff, but that's nothing new.
Also regarding this point; I don't think we can use Ismaire as an example where the queen is the boss. She was married. We don't know how their reign looked like when he was alive (and if she was married before she became queen, if her husbands was the son of the former king and she came from a noble family, if it was the other way around, or if she was married after she became queen). If she were not allowed to rule after his death, their son would've to take over. At this point in time, however, Joshua was too young so Ismaire had to rule on her own. Over the time people noticed that Ismaire is a great queen and respected and loved her. Before Joshua was old enough to take over, he left.
- Letting the firstborn son inherit everything is what feels the most realistic to me in this setting (even though there are female soldiers and that stuff...) In the case of the Delbray siblings this would mean that Geoffrey is the heir. It also means there is less pressure on Lucia since she doesn't have to provide (legitimate) heirs (even though it would probably be appreciated). Good for her (the affair makes her parents not too happy, but that is to be expected. Her parents also know their daughter well; no matter what they say Lucia does what she wants. Secretly her father is proud that she's so strong. (Why, yes, he's very doting.)).
In case when a family has only daughters, nephews or maybe cousins (if they're not too old and the probability that they may still father heirs is good) will be the heir/s. If there are no nephews either, the old title-holder decides which daughter/niece temporarily inherits the title. She holds this title until she marries. Then the husband takes on the main bulk of responsibility. Makes sense, y/n?
- The third option can be very practical, but it can also go terribly wrong. It's akin to feudalism.
If the king chooses who will be the heir, it gives him unbelievable power. If the family annoys him, he could give the title and land to someone unrelated to them. He would choose one of supporters. The king would literally disown the original family and take all their property and riches from them. This would of course spawn much unrest, hostility and general fear. Nobles would have to watch their every word and I don't believe that they like that. Rebellions would follow, de-throwning and a new king who at first does what the nobles want since he's one of them. Eventually, he would emancipate and concentrate on his own ambitions. The nobles would rebel again; yay, vicious circle~
Feudalism is a tricky thing. The king can misuse his rights so easily (if he is the most powerful person around, mind you!) This reminds me of the Staufer and how they tried to re-establish this kind of feudalism. They had to find a way to weaken all those high lords. It didn't work that well (it's mainly their own fault. They should've concentrated more on being king in Germany than being emperor in Italy).
To be honest, I can see Tellius being like 11th/12th century Germany very much! The former according-to-feudalism distributed provinces have over the time become the possession of the governing lords and no longer belong to the king, i.e. the king loses authority because of this. In the end the king and the lords are on the same power level (which is, obviously, bad for the king. In this situation his title is pretty useless). I mean the struggle between king/queen and the nobles reminds me of FE 10.
The option where the old title-holder chooses his heir is at least not as problematic as the one above. The worst thing that the old dude can do is choosing someone the king hates. This would not warrant a disowning of the family (if the king has the powre to do that), but it certainly does not help the family´s status. There could also be some quarrels within the family. (Which would also be interesting fic fodder~)
In a way I like the possibility of nobles (including the royal family here) "electing" their king, though I don't think this would happen in FE. The only situation where I can see that happen is in the case of a really big inheritance conflict between two fractions (like son A against son B). The two fractions would ask the council to judge who has the right to inherit everything. This would be used to avoid open wars; it may not be economical to waste money on stupid feuds (exception, of course, if other nobles can gain something from the conflict and therefore support it). In general, deciding on the heir of Random Noble #23 is not something they really discuss; the old title-holder asks if everybody is okay with his son/nephew/cousin becoming his heir and the others just nod to get over with that.
"Electing" the next king could maybe happen, but that, once again, depends on the ruling system. (I am again thinking of medieval Germany. Back then there was a time where the nobles "elected" the king (It's more complicated than this and the influence on the "becoming king" thing depends on the year). I'm not too sure if that could happen in Tellius; mainly because it seems like they only have sole heirs. I want sibling conflicts naow. There is also Ashnard; he had to kill his whole family to become king. If the noble would "elect" their future king (from the royal family), he only would've to convince them that he's the best for that job. Crimea and Daein could of course have different systems, but there are no hints about that.
Soooo... I have no answers? Thoughts, anyone?
I fear my train of thought is not too coherent. Please tell me if something doesn't make sense.
Namely about Lucia and Bastian´s ending. It says that they never married but had a live-long affair. This leads me to some questions about Crimea (and those two).
1. They have a relationship without being married. In a medieval world. I don't know the Crimean laws or even the social norms concerning this, but since this is a pseudo-medieval world, I have to assume 'having an affair = bad'. Right? Right. What would other people think about them then? Personally, I believe that there would be many problems and conflicts. Elincia may support them (Geoffrey only reluctantly because he's a bit more conversative), but all the other people in the castle? Hell no. Bad gossip and evil rumours; first only about Lucia and Bastian. Later it will spread onto their families and people will think that their parents (Lucia´s and Bastian´s) taught them such loose morals. That would of course effect Geoffrey and Elincia as well (are family or close friends. In Geoffrey and Elincia´s case there already has been rumours about an affair before (in RD) and now their sister repeats that. I can see some nobles seeing this as a prove that Geoffrey and Elincia had had an affair before => very bad results, as in losing respect and growing opposition).
While Lucia may be able to stomach the badtalking about herself, she would be tremendously hurt when people attack her lover and her family. Unfortunately, she can't do anything against the gossip. She can't stop people from talking about her (Elincia may try to help her and makes everything worse; nobles start to distrust her and question her decisions more. Also, quarrels with Geoffrey, since they would not have the same opinion. Drama for fic~) Additionally, if Lucia would bow to the stress and marry Bastian, the gossip would still not stop. Because there was a time when she was doing improper (and maybe sinful) things and suddenly being married won't change the past. Her reputation is destroyed no matter what she does. Besides, Lucia would never bow to pressure. She's a badass.
Bastian wouldn't have that many problems, in contrast. There would be badmouthing about him as well, but people would not be that hard on him because he's a man. (Yes, times were sexist and those poor men couldn't help themselves because those evil, evil women had seduced them. It is really ridiculous when people tried to excuse those poor, helpless war heroes. They are just too weak~ to resist those evil womenz. There also the belief in 'men has affair = My, what a hunk! / Alternatively; ignores because that's a delicate matter' and 'woman has an affair = OMG, slut!'.)
Mm, there should be fic dealing with that.
1.2 This point is related to point 1. What about their children? I don't think it's realistic to think that Lucia and Bastian don't have sex (very hawt sex, for that matter) so children are a possibility. Those children would be illegitimate. Being born out of wedlock is normally not a funny thing. Bastian is the count of Fayre. Would his illegitimate children be able to inherit his title? I think not. I may not know the Crimean laws, but this is too much of a stretch. Maybe Elincia could try to tweak law, I don't know. But people wouldn't like that. Which results in more drama with the nobles (they don't like when Elincia messes around with tradition. Add badmouthing about how Elincia has to clean up after her sister and that it would better for her to abandon Lucia). Well, then one of Bastian´s nephews or nieces have to inherit his title (I refuse to believe that all those FE characters with no mentioned siblings are only-children. Though I do have headcanon for why Geoffrey and Lucia don't have more siblings~) But it still gives his family a bad taste in the mouth that Bastian can't provide them with legitimate heirs. Bastian is not too happy about the situation, but being with Lucia matters more to him than legitimate heirs (and he has badass nephews/nieces anyway).
And what about Lucia as the eldest daughter of the count of Delbray? (Yes, I do believe that their father is the count of Delbray. I haz reasons.)
This leads me to my second, more general wondering.
2. Who can inherit what? How does the inheritance law look like? Let's take the title "count" and all the possessions tied to it as an example. Does the firstborn child inherit everything? Does the firstborn son inherit everything? Or does the king/ the old count/ the council of nobles decide who inherits?
- Personally, I can't think of any female inheriting a title (queen, countess, or anything else) where nobody protested (I'm not familiar with FE1-6). Exception is Elincia in FE9 because that was a very special situation. I conclude that this doesn't happen often or is welcome.
It may also matter if the daughter is an only child, since then they don't have a choice. This case another question comes up; when she marries, does her husband take over her role? (This may or may not depend on the strength of the woman. If she is more dominant than her husband, she may stay the "sole" ruler. (I'm thinking of England here) In a society that does not accept a woman as a ruler, however, she would lose her position to her husband. She could use her husband as a puppet for her own ambitions if he's pushover. But ruling openly is not possible.) I also have to ask myself how Elincia would react. If the rule were that only the firstborn son can inherit, what would she do if her first child is a girl? Would she change the old laws because she knows that girls are capable of being badass queens/ countesses/ etc? Probably yes because Elincia is that badass. This would once against cause the nobles to protest and stuff, but that's nothing new.
Also regarding this point; I don't think we can use Ismaire as an example where the queen is the boss. She was married. We don't know how their reign looked like when he was alive (and if she was married before she became queen, if her husbands was the son of the former king and she came from a noble family, if it was the other way around, or if she was married after she became queen). If she were not allowed to rule after his death, their son would've to take over. At this point in time, however, Joshua was too young so Ismaire had to rule on her own. Over the time people noticed that Ismaire is a great queen and respected and loved her. Before Joshua was old enough to take over, he left.
- Letting the firstborn son inherit everything is what feels the most realistic to me in this setting (even though there are female soldiers and that stuff...) In the case of the Delbray siblings this would mean that Geoffrey is the heir. It also means there is less pressure on Lucia since she doesn't have to provide (legitimate) heirs (even though it would probably be appreciated). Good for her (the affair makes her parents not too happy, but that is to be expected. Her parents also know their daughter well; no matter what they say Lucia does what she wants. Secretly her father is proud that she's so strong. (Why, yes, he's very doting.)).
In case when a family has only daughters, nephews or maybe cousins (if they're not too old and the probability that they may still father heirs is good) will be the heir/s. If there are no nephews either, the old title-holder decides which daughter/niece temporarily inherits the title. She holds this title until she marries. Then the husband takes on the main bulk of responsibility. Makes sense, y/n?
- The third option can be very practical, but it can also go terribly wrong. It's akin to feudalism.
If the king chooses who will be the heir, it gives him unbelievable power. If the family annoys him, he could give the title and land to someone unrelated to them. He would choose one of supporters. The king would literally disown the original family and take all their property and riches from them. This would of course spawn much unrest, hostility and general fear. Nobles would have to watch their every word and I don't believe that they like that. Rebellions would follow, de-throwning and a new king who at first does what the nobles want since he's one of them. Eventually, he would emancipate and concentrate on his own ambitions. The nobles would rebel again; yay, vicious circle~
Feudalism is a tricky thing. The king can misuse his rights so easily (if he is the most powerful person around, mind you!) This reminds me of the Staufer and how they tried to re-establish this kind of feudalism. They had to find a way to weaken all those high lords. It didn't work that well (it's mainly their own fault. They should've concentrated more on being king in Germany than being emperor in Italy).
To be honest, I can see Tellius being like 11th/12th century Germany very much! The former according-to-feudalism distributed provinces have over the time become the possession of the governing lords and no longer belong to the king, i.e. the king loses authority because of this. In the end the king and the lords are on the same power level (which is, obviously, bad for the king. In this situation his title is pretty useless). I mean the struggle between king/queen and the nobles reminds me of FE 10.
The option where the old title-holder chooses his heir is at least not as problematic as the one above. The worst thing that the old dude can do is choosing someone the king hates. This would not warrant a disowning of the family (if the king has the powre to do that), but it certainly does not help the family´s status. There could also be some quarrels within the family. (Which would also be interesting fic fodder~)
In a way I like the possibility of nobles (including the royal family here) "electing" their king, though I don't think this would happen in FE. The only situation where I can see that happen is in the case of a really big inheritance conflict between two fractions (like son A against son B). The two fractions would ask the council to judge who has the right to inherit everything. This would be used to avoid open wars; it may not be economical to waste money on stupid feuds (exception, of course, if other nobles can gain something from the conflict and therefore support it). In general, deciding on the heir of Random Noble #23 is not something they really discuss; the old title-holder asks if everybody is okay with his son/nephew/cousin becoming his heir and the others just nod to get over with that.
"Electing" the next king could maybe happen, but that, once again, depends on the ruling system. (I am again thinking of medieval Germany. Back then there was a time where the nobles "elected" the king (It's more complicated than this and the influence on the "becoming king" thing depends on the year). I'm not too sure if that could happen in Tellius; mainly because it seems like they only have sole heirs. I want sibling conflicts naow. There is also Ashnard; he had to kill his whole family to become king. If the noble would "elect" their future king (from the royal family), he only would've to convince them that he's the best for that job. Crimea and Daein could of course have different systems, but there are no hints about that.
Soooo... I have no answers? Thoughts, anyone?
I fear my train of thought is not too coherent. Please tell me if something doesn't make sense.