The death of Heath Ledger was sad enough. Anytime such a young life is lost it's enough to give you pause. But this...this really upset me. This upset me to the point of sobs
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anonymous
January 30 2008, 22:30:18 UTC
Please don't read a hostile or judgmental tone into any of what I am about to say... I am genuinely curious about your statement and am not looking to start a fight.
The first time I heard about the WBC I was torn between wanting to throw up and abandoning all hope in mankind. These people are disgusting. I totally understand where you're coming from with your revulsion for Fred Phelps; I think you would be hard pressed to find anyone (outside of his "church"...which consists of his family) who does not become physically ill at the hearing of his vitriol. However, I do not think that it is correct to equate the crazed ramblings of a psychotic misanthrope to the doctrines of every other religion in the world. What the WBC spews is many things, but it most certainly is not religion-- I promise you I am not fooling myself when I say this.
Nothing that was said in the press release you posted can be called Christian (and I only use the term Christian because that is what Phelps pretends to be.. I don't think anything that was said can be tied in with religion properly applied)... these lunatics are preaching under the guise of christianity and they love it when they offend and hurt people. Phelps has decried Billy Graham (he's going to rot in hell for being a 'fag enabler'), the Catholic Church (the Pope? clearly a 'fag enabler'), soldiers (fighting for a country that 'enables fags')... you name them, Phelps has probably said that they are going to rot in hell. The only doctrine the WBC has is a strict doctrine of hatred for everyone and everything outside of their circle; these people teach nothing else but hatred for people of same-sex orientation. I promise you the Bible does not have that much to say about homosexuality... God has bigger fish to fry.
No person who seriously considers themselves to be religious (and understands what that means in practice) would ever call Fred Phelps a Christian. As far as I know there is not a single religious body that recognizes these people as a legitimate denomination.
This is religion. This is it people. And you're fooling yourself if you think your religion is any different. It's not. They're just not as publicly vocal about these beliefs because they'd probably lose quite a few of their sheep that give them money to support their scam
Do you really believe that all religion is like this? Churches are supposed to receive everyone with open arms... that is what I expect from other Catholics, it is what I yearn to see from everyone, no matter their stance on religion. I will be the first to tell you-- especially as someone attending an overtly religious university-- this almost never happens. Where religion gets messed up is in the application... people can be assholes (case in point-- the WBC). Still, I don't find this to be reason enough to throw the baby out with the bathwater... it is a reason to keep trying.
I refuse to believe that religion is a "human mind plague" or "the root of all sadness in the world", etc.. Close-minded extremism is a plague upon humanity, there is no doubt about that-- and it goes both ways.
In all honesty, doyou really believe that while Mother Theresa spent her life ministering to the people in the ghettos of India that she was really burning with an all-consuming hatred? And what, exactly, is the money that I tithe to the church going to? The Pope's gilded gay hating machine?
I guess for me it boils down to the fact that people are not perfect, they are going to make mistakes (sometimes mindblowingly terrible ones).. but that is no excuse to write off 88% of the united states and 96% of the world. I most certainly do not hate gay people-- I don't hate anyone for that matter.
True religion is not a scam.. I could go into it in more detail if you want, but I should probably just shut up.
Re: wall of textclawsofangst16January 31 2008, 02:34:33 UTC
I said all of those things out of an extremely agitated state of emotion. I understand that the WBC is the extreme side of extremism. This extremism, however, is still a branch of Christianity. Not to compare you to Fred.
You ask what I believe? This is it in a clear state of mind. I believe that religion is false. Religion is something that was created by humans. I believe it is a tool used to control. I believe it is a tool used for hate. It is also used for comfort. Either way, I do believe it is a scam. I also believe that humans are inherently bad natured. There are thousands - millions of people who seriously consider themselves religious and do nothing but breed fear and hatred. Not just the WBC.
I realize a lot of the things I said in the post were hot-headed and intolerant, but the fact that you called me a close minded extremist is ridiculous. Am I picketing Baptist funerals and bombing Catholic masses? No. I'm venting built-up aggravation with human stupidity in a livejournal.
I respect intelligent people for devotion to anything. I respect your faith in Catholicism and I would not bother you about it ever, unless one day you decided to try to convert me.
The first time I heard about the WBC I was torn between wanting to throw up and abandoning all hope in mankind. These people are disgusting. I totally understand where you're coming from with your revulsion for Fred Phelps; I think you would be hard pressed to find anyone (outside of his "church"...which consists of his family) who does not become physically ill at the hearing of his vitriol. However, I do not think that it is correct to equate the crazed ramblings of a psychotic misanthrope to the doctrines of every other religion in the world. What the WBC spews is many things, but it most certainly is not religion-- I promise you I am not fooling myself when I say this.
Nothing that was said in the press release you posted can be called Christian (and I only use the term Christian because that is what Phelps pretends to be.. I don't think anything that was said can be tied in with religion properly applied)... these lunatics are preaching under the guise of christianity and they love it when they offend and hurt people. Phelps has decried Billy Graham (he's going to rot in hell for being a 'fag enabler'), the Catholic Church (the Pope? clearly a 'fag enabler'), soldiers (fighting for a country that 'enables fags')... you name them, Phelps has probably said that they are going to rot in hell. The only doctrine the WBC has is a strict doctrine of hatred for everyone and everything outside of their circle; these people teach nothing else but hatred for people of same-sex orientation. I promise you the Bible does not have that much to say about homosexuality... God has bigger fish to fry.
No person who seriously considers themselves to be religious (and understands what that means in practice) would ever call Fred Phelps a Christian. As far as I know there is not a single religious body that recognizes these people as a legitimate denomination.
This is religion. This is it people. And you're fooling yourself if you think your religion is any different. It's not. They're just not as publicly vocal about these beliefs because they'd probably lose quite a few of their sheep that give them money to support their scam
Do you really believe that all religion is like this? Churches are supposed to receive everyone with open arms... that is what I expect from other Catholics, it is what I yearn to see from everyone, no matter their stance on religion. I will be the first to tell you-- especially as someone attending an overtly religious university-- this almost never happens. Where religion gets messed up is in the application... people can be assholes (case in point-- the WBC). Still, I don't find this to be reason enough to throw the baby out with the bathwater... it is a reason to keep trying.
I refuse to believe that religion is a "human mind plague" or "the root of all sadness in the world", etc.. Close-minded extremism is a plague upon humanity, there is no doubt about that-- and it goes both ways.
In all honesty, doyou really believe that while Mother Theresa spent her life ministering to the people in the ghettos of India that she was really burning with an all-consuming hatred? And what, exactly, is the money that I tithe to the church going to? The Pope's gilded gay hating machine?
I guess for me it boils down to the fact that people are not perfect, they are going to make mistakes (sometimes mindblowingly terrible ones).. but that is no excuse to write off 88% of the united states and 96% of the world. I most certainly do not hate gay people-- I don't hate anyone for that matter.
True religion is not a scam.. I could go into it in more detail if you want, but I should probably just shut up.
---Lindsey
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You ask what I believe? This is it in a clear state of mind. I believe that religion is false. Religion is something that was created by humans. I believe it is a tool used to control. I believe it is a tool used for hate. It is also used for comfort. Either way, I do believe it is a scam. I also believe that humans are inherently bad natured. There are thousands - millions of people who seriously consider themselves religious and do nothing but breed fear and hatred. Not just the WBC.
I realize a lot of the things I said in the post were hot-headed and intolerant, but the fact that you called me a close minded extremist is ridiculous. Am I picketing Baptist funerals and bombing Catholic masses? No. I'm venting built-up aggravation with human stupidity in a livejournal.
I respect intelligent people for devotion to anything. I respect your faith in Catholicism and I would not bother you about it ever, unless one day you decided to try to convert me.
Reply
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