Down Syndrome and Eugenics

[ex_restless]

Archbishop Chaput from Denver has written an excellent article in First Things titled Conscience, Courage and Children with Down Syndrome regarding the high rate of abortions among those diagnosed prenatally with Down Syndrome, and what this reflects on us as a society. It begins:

Comments

[karcy]

Although a lot of pro-abortion (as opposed to pro-choice) arguments are made on the basis that women who are going through these abortions are making very difficult, traumatic decisions in their lives, the reality is not quite so. A great number of abortions are done for the sake of convenience, not desperation.

[chordoflife]

Sadly, Karcy is right.

However, I'm not going to condemn someone who makes a difficult decision to terminate a DS fetus. I may not make that decision, but I certainly cannot say what I would do as a woman in that situation. Having met some parents who really struggle with their DS children, it's a very hard life parenting one. I'd like to think that the easy answer would be, well, just give it up for adoption if you can't or won't parent it, but I'm a male who does not have to deal with the burden of a pre-natal decision.

I applaud this article for putting a face on DS children.

[ex_restless]

I think we have to be careful using the language of "condemn." Not just in this argument, but in general. Condemn means something very, very different than making a judgment as to what is the right or wrong decision.

That said, I think beyond just putting a face to DS children, this article goes to the heart of what it says about us as a society that we are moving more or less towards a eugenics type mentality, that children merely born with birth defects are not worth having. It is not a condemnation on the person, but it certainly is an indictment on society as a whole.

[redstar826]

Sounds like somewhere in all of this, there is an argument in favor of making health care more accessible to everyone. I would guess that for many folks, having a child with any serious disability is a HUGE expense. The writer starts to go there when he mentions that services for the disabled vary from state to state, but then he moves on without proposing any sort of solution.

[ex_restless]

Well, the author isn't a policy expert, but I think his point in highlighting those states with healthcare and other services is to set them up as a model, or at least what they potentially represent as a model, for those who are going to discuss the solution itself. But for him to get into that argument would sidetrack the real heart of what he is trying to discuss. What he is ultimately getting at is where do we find value in human beings? What is the quality of a person that we find to be valuable? Ultimately this isn't a discussion about abortion at all, but rather by what standard to we measure human value. I think that's an important discussion to have.

[redstar826]

I understand.

i'm not much of a philosopher. My brain tends to turn things into a "well, what is the problem and what is the solution?" sort of discussion.

[ex_restless]

I understand that. I think it's important, though, that when seeking possible solutions to issues, it's important to have ourselves properly oriented, so that any move we seek is at least well guided by sound principles and a fundamentally moral understanding of human life

[redstar826]

Fair enough.

and maybe this sounds bad, but stuff like this makes me feel a bit relieved that there is a decent chance that I won't be getting pregnant and having children, as I for the life of me do not know what I would do if I found myself in this sort of situation.

[ex_restless]

I understand that sentiment well. I might know what I wouldn't do, but that doesn't mean I know what I would - meaning, the elimination of abortion as a possibility for me (which obviously doesn't eliminate the possibility of abortion in general, since legally I would have no say whatsoever anyway) doesn't necessarily mean I would handle it well. I'd like to think that I would, but I'll never know one way or the other.

[redstar826]

the closest I ever came was a pregnancy scare when I was in college (not sure if I have ever talked about this with you before) and I had already made up my mind that I would not keep the baby had I turned out to be pregnant (I wasn't)

[karcy]

One word: ditto. I still believed it was wrong though, but I was determined to carry it out.

Part of the reason why I cannot really support a lot of feminist arguments for abortion is because I recognize them as instinctively untrue. I won't claim I'm speaking for all women, just myself: when you're considering an abortion, you don't always need people telling you "no, it's completely okay, don't worry". You need people telling you "this is wrong -- are you sure you want to do this?"

[redstar826]

See, I personally don't believe it is wrong. Had I been pregnant, I would have preferred to take care of things as quickly as possible with input from as few people as possible. Not because I would have been worried about someone changing my mind, but because I don't like people involving themselves in areas of my life which I feel are none of their business.

[ex_restless]

I had one a few years ago. There had been a situation where a condom broke, and then immediately following my girlfriend was two weeks late. We never discussed what we would do. Naturally I was quite terrified, but I also knew I would do everything I could to convince her to keep the baby (and honestly, I don't think I would have had to convince her, as I believe it's what she would have done). But yah, two of the most stressful weeks of my life.

[redstar826]

See, we weren't even using any protection (yes, I know that was stupid) and this wasn't someone I was exactly dating at the time (although we were boyfriend and girlfriend in the past, so we knew each other quite well). It's kind of a long story, but I was going through a rather rough patch and doing some really stupid things.

[efriden]

Denmark has relatively inexpensive public healthcare for all, yet between 95 and 100% of all foeti suspected of having DS get aborted. The same tests that are free for all pregnant women in Denmark are now being made available county by county in Sweden with much the same results. The fact is, parents don't want children with DS whatever resources get heaped upon them.