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mintogrubb in christianity

The Roman Catholic Church

Apr 02, 2008 07:55

When Jesus ascended into heaven , He left one Apostolic church behind him- not a ragged bunch of bickering and contesting factions. The church had unity for hundreds of years, until the Great Schism, when the eastern and western halves of the Church broke up ( Read more... )

fascism, luther, pope, catholicism, politics and christianity

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efriden April 2 2008, 07:44:57 UTC

"it all began when the Pope, who lead the western catholic church, centered in Rome, started to raise funds by selling ' indulgences'. For a sum of money, you could buy one, and this was in effect, a free pardon for any sins you may have committed. hence, if you were rich, you could, in effect, buy yourself a way into heaven"

Oops! Several errors galore. The roots of the reformation do not lie with the selling of indulgences, but in the many causes for concern about the state of the Church that many people had validly held for several hundred years. There were several attempts at reformation made, some failed, some remained inside the Church. Indulgences may have been what triggered the Lutheran reformation, but Luther had other grievances too. Plus indulgences never worked the way you write here.

theendless April 2 2008, 08:51:17 UTC

From what I understand from the history if it hadn't been Martin Luther it would have been someone else. I just think it's sad that reformation didn't become more of a church-wide thing, so that reform could occur within the church without the church being splintered. :/

I look forward to the day when we can all worship together as one visible body.

susannah April 2 2008, 09:11:57 UTC

I totally agree. We may always have different expressions - just as humans have different personalities... but I would love to see... in town after town and city after city... people coming together in worship... even if that was just once a month... as a kind of public witness... and as a heartfelt expression of our faith and of our unity in Christ.

I'd like that kind of witness of "christians together" to be like a banner raised up - through worship in a fairly public place... and this desire could also be expressed through shared service of the community in little acts of love.

I believe this kind of coming together is already happening in many places, and I find that so encouraging.

We *can* come together in love.

pastorlenny April 2 2008, 13:28:22 UTC

Happens in Red Bank every month.

mintogrubb April 2 2008, 19:03:38 UTC

In Upminster, we had an Easter service on Good Friday, and Methodists, Anglicans, the URC, Catholics and many others joined together in a joint service, lead by all the relevant clerics from each denomination.

It does happen , and i would like to see it happen more.

susannah April 2 2008, 21:55:49 UTC

I agree. It's so obvious that we should make a public display of our common identity as christians, and also just because it's so good for people to draw closer in faith, even just in human terms.

catholic_heart April 2 2008, 12:44:46 UTC

Well, it sort of did, just a bit too late. But there was also the Catholic Reformation, in which the Church did reform from within, though far too late and after the massive splintering had already occurred.

theendless April 2 2008, 12:51:09 UTC

I do recall that. I think I'm just sad that it happened afterward.I want the church to be one again.

catholic_heart April 2 2008, 13:00:41 UTC

Indeed, me too.

pastorlenny April 2 2008, 14:25:02 UTC

Easily done.

catholic_heart April 2 2008, 14:33:05 UTC

Really? Funny, he had me on speed dial.

pastorlenny April 2 2008, 14:34:33 UTC

LOL. I think you replied to the wrong comment.

catholic_heart April 2 2008, 14:38:47 UTC

Haha, oh, so you've never called Mr. Easily Done before?

pastorlenny April 2 2008, 14:45:07 UTC

Um, no. But I have myself been called something similar. :P

mintogrubb April 2 2008, 19:18:06 UTC

Likewise.
Yet , as I go down the comments I have seen so far, there are those who tell me I am wrong and offer no evidence, and as yet one clear defence of the Catholic position.

the good news is that the Pope *did* oppse hitler, but secretly. no mention of the pre-war pact though, and a lot of talk about how the indulgence thing was not luther's only beef.

hey - I did say that there were 95 theses in total!

even so, I hope that you and others will come forwards with stuff you know. i am sure you will. back to the list...

catholic_heart April 2 2008, 19:29:49 UTC

I think the link I provided offers ample evidence. There are plenty of other links, but most of them provide evidence offered from Catholics. I specifically offered that link so that there would be no accusation of Catholic bias. I also provided a link for clear explanation of the doctrine of infallibility, to help clear up your misunderstanding of what it means ( ... )

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